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***Official*** New Zealand Domestic Season 2017/18

Immenso

International Vice-Captain
Even still, pick one more damn bowler. We aren’t winning with three bloody bowlers.
Re: The discussion about ND only picking 3 bowlers for this round.

ND A playing today. Including 2 young seamers (Randell and Fisher), plus the SLA who topped the U19 wicket tally.
ND already out of the Plunket Shield race. Young players were available?

Wtf?

Boooooooooooo!

https://scoring.nzc.nz/livescoring/match4987/scorecard.aspx
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
Any luck with a new vault password from your sources, btw? Get me again via kippaxcricket at gmail.
They've got rid of all the vault generic users such as the one you had. I'll have to get a new one created, will pass it on to you.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Jeets bowling Wellington to victory in a Plunket Shield Match? The end times surely are nigh.
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
Is that nzfan’s argument though? Wellington only have five 30+ players out of 12 (Blundell was subbed out, so 12 in this match) in this game, and two of them are Woodcock and Murdoch who IIRC nzfan is a big supporter of.

The others are Papps, Patel and Bennett.

I don’t think it’s an age thing at Wellington anymore (a few have retired from previous seasons), but more that there aren’t many local players coming in. Bracewell, Colson, van Beek and Conway have been preferred this season.

Personally I’m of the view that having a strong team for those players to come into is of more benefit than playing a load of them with the hope they’ll be up to it. There’s no doubt for me that they will get a chance, if they’re good enough.

Yeah if domestic cricket was like club rugby league and had its own fans and was profitable in its own right, then I'd strongly prefer players had to battle their way up out of age group play and reserve grade on merit, but you're right, it's not. NZC and Cricket Wellington are leaning on private efforts from dads etc. to get the Hutt Hawks organised and overseas on tours. You're correct to be concerned that the Woodcock types are inadvertently pulling the rope ladder up behind them as they exit, giving the youth the fingers and saying "you weren't going to really cherish cricket like our generation of Sports Roundup New Zealanders did, anyway".
On that note I watched couple of twenty20s at Hutt Rec organized by Hutt Hawks a weekend ago. Somehow they managed to get a franchise from India with IPL players and Indian first class players to play the local lads. The Hutt Hawks had Ravindra, Weerasundara, Johnson, Joon, Matt Taylor and few up coming players including Wellington under 19 lads. The Hutt Hawks guys played such good cricket against some serious t20 players that were beyond their skill level. A week before I saw a Wellington A list of players and was disgusted to see mostly firebirds in the list barring Ravindra and Sears. Such is Cricket Wellington's attitude towards our up coming players. There are so many deserving players in Wellington and if they were given enough opportunities they will have become serious players.

I still can't fathom on a ragging pitch they didn't bowl Peter Younghusband in the second inning. What does that do to a player? Jeetan bowls 34 overs.. It's just beyond me. How are they going to develop someone like Peter Younghusband if they don't even bowl him? He's batting at no.8 and not bowling much. What's the point in him playing? Honestly till they get rid of these senior players there is no chance for the younger ones to come in. No matter what you say about Jeetan or Pappsy, they are failed international cricketers that were found out to be useless despite good number of chances.Barring Grant Elliot most of these players are so selfish and would do anything to stop younger ones from coming. These are the same guys that screwed up our younger lot from the past bullying them. I would blame the cricket wellington management, coaches and the likes that are so clueless and toothless in making sensible decisions. They are happy to win some trophies and smart about. These guys disgust me honestly. Looks like Fraser Colson will be on his way out after his recent couple of inning. Again is he a no.6 bat?

Still good game though, followed that on nzc.
 

Flem274*

123/5
holding on to performing older players is a good thing.

it's when they're not performing, playing guys in weird positions or bringing in random hacks from australian club cricket that i get grouchy. it applies equally to young and old players too. how many years did george worker take to score some runs in red ball cricket? why did jeet raval spend like half a season at #7 several years ago? james baker has only just started taking some wickets, and instead of bringing in actual overseas players wellington hired hamish marshall who has done **** all and both they and auckland have hired craig cachopa who hasn't scored a run since his first stint with auckland.

then there's the 'why structure the team like a normal cricket team? we should select two and a half bowlers or six bowlers, three batsmen, a keeper and an allrounder.' that we've seen over the years.

if a 37 year old is worth his place then you pick him. he keeps the standard as high as possible and from a talent development perspective there will be nothing new under the sun to him which is good for young players to compete against.
 

Immenso

International Vice-Captain
holding on to performing older players is a good thing.

it's when they're not performing, playing guys in weird positions or bringing in random hacks from australian club cricket that i get grouchy. it applies equally to young and old players too. how many years did george worker take to score some runs in red ball cricket? why did jeet raval spend like half a season at #7 several years ago? james baker has only just started taking some wickets, and instead of bringing in actual overseas players wellington hired hamish marshall who has done **** all and both they and auckland have hired craig cachopa who hasn't scored a run since his first stint with auckland.

then there's the 'why structure the team like a normal cricket team? we should select two and a half bowlers or six bowlers, three batsmen, a keeper and an allrounder.' that we've seen over the years.

if a 37 year old is worth his place then you pick him. he keeps the standard as high as possible and from a talent development perspective there will be nothing new under the sun to him which is good for young players to compete against.
Yeah, i think this pretty much sums up my view too.

Experience (and therefore hopefully talent) is worth keeping around and raising the overall standard,

I'm in no position to assess the personality or motivations of the senior players. The individual association coaches (and their employers, who I assume ultimately answer to the clubs or sub-unions) should make that call.

BTW, you are way off on James Baker. He's been producing for years. He'd be a coach's dream and the sort of bowler a coach should build the younger, inconsistent more puntier bowling options around. In a post Arnel/Aldridge world.
 

Flem274*

123/5
so i just checked my facts and since when did jimmy baker average 29? i swear that average was still 40+ last season
 

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
The beeb are reporting this,



If there is a way of preventing a Hughes without looking like the above...
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Ludick with back to back centuries for CD A. I hadn't realised he played for South Africa at the under 19 World Cup, against his current team mates Leopard and Clarkson. Sounds like a future star.
Looks like he played essentially as a bowler in that tournament too. Barely batted at all and when he did it was at 8/9.
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
holding on to performing older players is a good thing.

it's when they're not performing, playing guys in weird positions or bringing in random hacks from australian club cricket that i get grouchy. it applies equally to young and old players too. how many years did george worker take to score some runs in red ball cricket? why did jeet raval spend like half a season at #7 several years ago? james baker has only just started taking some wickets, and instead of bringing in actual overseas players wellington hired hamish marshall who has done **** all and both they and auckland have hired craig cachopa who hasn't scored a run since his first stint with auckland.

then there's the 'why structure the team like a normal cricket team? we should select two and a half bowlers or six bowlers, three batsmen, a keeper and an allrounder.' that we've seen over the years.

if a 37 year old is worth his place then you pick him. he keeps the standard as high as possible and from a talent development perspective there will be nothing new under the sun to him which is good for young players to compete against.
You said it already, they tried Hamish Marshall in Ford trophy after he had pulled out. What sort of thinking is that? My question is why pick Peter Younghusband and bowl him 11 overs in a game meanwhile Jeetan Patel bowls 60+ overs. Why is Fraser Colson batting at no.6? Why is Devon Conway or Malcolm Nofal ahead of Rachin Ravindra? The fast bowling stock is good so that's fine but why is Michael Bracewell picked in every game and when it comes to chopping it's the blokes like Fraser Colson, Matt Taylor or Peter Younghusband creating massive insecurity in them. Luke Woodcock barely bowls in any format and he's playing white ball cricket batting at no.8 Why couldn't they get in Ben Sears or Ravindra in his place? What about the under 19 players and the players that are going well in club cricket. Why don't they get enough hits in the As? Finn Allen has been picked in all formats despite Auckland having a very strong batting line up. Meanwhile the second highest wicket taker in the U19 world cup and averaging 40 with the bat in the under 19 WC at home by Ravindra is not good enough to get a game in white ball or the 4 day games. How can you say Ravindra wouldn't have gone as well as Devon Conway or Luke Woodcock or anyone in the team if he was given a good run?

My problem seriously is not now with firebirds but since a decade now. They have had some unbelievable selections over the years that baffles us followers. Everyone in town and in NZ cricket are shocked someone like Ravindra that most think is going to be one for the future for Blackcaps doesn't appear to be anywhere near firebirds even as no.12? Wouldn't he learn plenty by being 12th man if not in the playing XI? I won't be surprised Firebirds sign up few more players from other regions or bring in a 40 year old the coming year as contracted players. Might as well bring back Chatfield and JR Reid in that case :-)
 

Flem274*

123/5
good news. i was starting to wonder if he would ever play again. did he get called up as a specialist bat for ND? I see he didn't feature in ND As second dig, and didn't bowl the entire match.

edit - @ howsie
 

Flem274*

123/5
You said it already, they tried Hamish Marshall in Ford trophy after he had pulled out. What sort of thinking is that? My question is why pick Peter Younghusband and bowl him 11 overs in a game meanwhile Jeetan Patel bowls 60+ overs. Why is Fraser Colson batting at no.6? Why is Devon Conway or Malcolm Nofal ahead of Rachin Ravindra? The fast bowling stock is good so that's fine but why is Michael Bracewell picked in every game and when it comes to chopping it's the blokes like Fraser Colson, Matt Taylor or Peter Younghusband creating massive insecurity in them. Luke Woodcock barely bowls in any format and he's playing white ball cricket batting at no.8 Why couldn't they get in Ben Sears or Ravindra in his place? What about the under 19 players and the players that are going well in club cricket. Why don't they get enough hits in the As? Finn Allen has been picked in all formats despite Auckland having a very strong batting line up. Meanwhile the second highest wicket taker in the U19 world cup and averaging 40 with the bat in the under 19 WC at home by Ravindra is not good enough to get a game in white ball or the 4 day games. How can you say Ravindra wouldn't have gone as well as Devon Conway or Luke Woodcock or anyone in the team if he was given a good run?

My problem seriously is not now with firebirds but since a decade now. They have had some unbelievable selections over the years that baffles us followers. Everyone in town and in NZ cricket are shocked someone like Ravindra that most think is going to be one for the future for Blackcaps doesn't appear to be anywhere near firebirds even as no.12? Wouldn't he learn plenty by being 12th man if not in the playing XI? I won't be surprised Firebirds sign up few more players from other regions or bring in a 40 year old the coming year as contracted players. Might as well bring back Chatfield and JR Reid in that case :-)
well yeah wellington have been a special case of stupid for a decade now. it's unbelievable the area has produced talents like rachin, weerasundara, bhula and sears when they invested all their time into australian imports who weren't up to it, australian coaches who would rather be somewhere else and a long term australian coach who only cared about how far you could hit a six and who genuinely believed a half fit mark gillespie was 'booming' through the crease. meanwhile boam, austin-smellie and walsh all realised they would never get in and retired before reaching 25.

god jamie siddons was a joke. edgar is a massive upgrade, and he's been doing better imo. no reports of toxic dressing rooms and young players giving the game away this year. bennett was a smart import, and the likes of mcpeake and colson are getting a run finally. you can't really turn down the chance to use a jeetan patel or michael papps if they're available so i don't begrudge those selections. they're in wellingtons best eleven no question.
 
Last edited:

Mike5181

International Captain
Jamieson is impressive from the little of seen of him. From comprehensive reading of two scorecards, it looks like he can bat a bit too. Get him in a squad or two pronto, imo.
 

Howsie

International Captain
good news. i was starting to wonder if he would ever play again. did he get called up as a specialist bat for ND? I see he didn't feature in ND As second dig, and didn't bowl the entire match.

edit - @ howsie
Yeah, he won’t bowl.
 

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