Why do England struggle to produce undisputedly great players?

[BoyBrumby]

Something I didn't know is that both Germany's and Britain's largest indoor spectator sport is Ice Hockey.

Number of men's Olympic ice hockey gold medals won by Germany (East, West & Unified): 0
Number of men's Olympic ice hockey gold medals won by Great Britain*: 1

*admittedly with a team full of Canadian ringers.

 

[uvelocity]

World record number of goals in a game - 58
World record holder - Australia

 

[zaremba]

The same reason why SC observers have skwed views regarding ATG. Robin Smith was great against pace, but here we don't regard him as a "good" because he sucked against spin. Same goes for players like Hussain, Stewart etc. It's a great pity that you think playing pace is more important than playing spin. FFS 45% of overs in test cricket is bowled by spinners.

No-one seriously reckons to Smith to be an ATG, precisely for that reason. But that said, his weakness against spin tends to get overstated.

Look at his Test record against subcontinental teams - it's actually pretty good. In fact his record against all teams is surprisingly consistent. He struggled against Warne but he's not alone in that.

As for people in SL not rating him as even "good", that surprises me. He averaged 67 against SL and on the one occasion when he played against Murali (in SL) he scored a century.

 

[fredfertang]

No-one seriously reckons to Smith to be an ATG, precisely for that reason. But that said, his weakness against spin tends to get overstated.

Look at his Test record against subcontinental teams - it's actually pretty good. In fact his record against all teams is surprisingly consistent. He struggled against Warne but he's not alone in that.

As for people in SL not rating him as even "good", that surprises me. He averaged 67 against SL and on the one occasion when he played against Murali (in SL) he scored a century.

Agreed - the weakness against spin was put about by those who gave up watching England after the debacle that was the 1993 Ashes (can't fault the logic itbt) as amplified by the most diasppointing Chairman of Selectors we ever had, Raimondo D'Illingwortho

 

[BoyBrumby]

Agreed - the weakness against spin was put about by those who gave up watching England after the debacle that was the 1993 Ashes (can't fault the logic itbt) as amplified by the most diasppointing Chairman of Selectors we ever had, Raimondo D'Illingwortho

That's up against some stiff competition too; May & Dexter both held their hands up for that crown.

It might be my memory playing tricks, but I recall Lord Ted often getting the players' names wrong to add to his whole high tory air of patrician bumbling.

Mind you, Jack Charlton & Bobby Robson also had their senior moments with squad members' monikers and both arguably the best managers their countries have had.

 

[zaremba]

Just to add to the list of spinners faced by the Judge, he averaged 45 against Mushtaq Ahmed (in the same 1992 series where Wasim and Waqar were carrying all before them) and 55 against Kumble. Small sample sizes, of course, but that's part of the point.

 

[honestbharani]

To answer the question:


Its because whenever they produce one, no one else in the world accepts them.


I do think Cook is ATG material, tbh. And Pieterson too, maybe.

 

[ImpatientLime]

is joe root on course to end this long drought?

 

[Burgey]

No

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Such a wuss, is he going to make some runs in Australia? Even New Zealand? He's made 10 tons, 8 of which are in England/Wales. The other 2 were against a Steyn-less SA (still ok, but not the same really), and the other against Windies. He needs some decent runs in tough conditions against the best.

 

[91Jmay]

Such a wuss, is he going to make some runs in Australia? Even New Zealand? He's made 10 tons, 8 of which are in England/Wales. The other 2 were against a Steyn-less SA (still ok, but not the same really), and the other against Windies. He needs some decent runs in tough conditions against the best.

weak trolling effort.

As if making runs in ****ing Australia is the mark of a good batsmen. Flattest pitches known to man.

 

[ImpatientLime]

yeah stop making centuries against all the nations.

 

[Shri]

weak trolling effort.

As if making runs in ****ing Australia is the mark of a good batsmen. Flattest pitches known to man.

And when an idiot doesn't even score runs in those, what good is he?

 

[91Jmay]

And when an idiot doesn't even score runs in those, what good is he?

Listen mate, the big 3 are all beyond reproach. Root, Williamson and Smith are legit great players a tier or two above the rest.

 

[Shri]

Ok.

 

[ImpatientLime]

what is ab de villiers

 

[The Battlers Prince]

weak trolling effort.

As if making runs in ****ing Australia is the mark of a good batsmen. Flattest pitches known to man.

Runs in Australia is probably not the main point. I just feel like only one of the "big 3" have consistently made tough runs when required. Of course you can cop a ball in any innings that would get you out. But in terms of class I need to see more from Joe.
I think he's got a great demeanor and obviously can make big scores. So for me, not there yet but has the talent

 

[honestbharani]

Listen mate, the big 3 are all beyond reproach. Root, Williamson and Smith are legit great players a tier or two above the rest.

AFAIC KW is a level above even Root and Smith as of now.

 

[91Jmay]

KW averages nothing in South Africa or England, and apparently unless you score runs in every country you are terrible according to the above logic so I guess he isn't any good either.

 

[Coronis]

Listen mate, the big 3 are all beyond reproach. Root, Williamson and Smith are legit great players a tier or two above the rest.

AB, Amla....