Dale Steyn vs Allan Donald vs Shaun Pollock

[smash84]

the video quality is awesome

 

[Goughy]

Cricket is the only sport where fans can claim with a straight face the standard is getting progressively worse and be taken seriously.

Not at all. There are certain aspects of cricket that have improved over the past 20 years and others that have declined. In the same way that certain aspects of basketball have declined. The argument is about how relative the improvements are and how important the declines are. The answer is that the players of today are better suited to the game of today but that doesnt mean that they would be better suited to the game of a generation or so. Separate to this point, Donald is hardly Pathe news material.

 

[the big bambino]

It's been so long since Waqar's prime, but did he even have any tricks in his armoury other than the yorker? He's synonymous with that for good reason, but rarely do you see footage where he's doing something else with the ball. Steyn is a far more complete fast bowler IMO, especially now that he's obviously working more effectively with the one that nips in. Definitely has a nastier shorter length for one.

Thing with Waqar is that they all swung out with the new ball.All swung in thereafter. Until the 2nd new ball (when needed) when they all swung out again. He was a superb bowler but Akram's unpredictability made him the one to fear for mine.

 

[smash84]

Thing with Waqar is that they all swung out with the new ball.All swung in thereafter. Until the 2nd new ball (when needed) when they all swung out again. He was a superb bowler but Akram's unpredictability made him the one to fear for mine.

yep, that was what pretty much happened

 

[MrPrez]

Tbh, I don't see how anyone could find Pollock attractive.

What other SA bowlers do people rank better than Steyn?

Well for me, Steyn is our best bowler ever. That said, I'd say Proctor could have been rated > Pollock if he'd had more chances. I'd definitely take Proctor as a cricketer over Pollock though.

Steyn's overtaken Donald ever so slightly IMO, just in the last series or two. It'd been obvious to me for a little while that it was likely he would eventually do it in my estimation but I think I'd now be happy enough, if Steyn retired now, to put him ahead of Donald, ever so slightly. My earlier posts in this thread from 2010 or whenever it was started actually ranked Pollock ahead of Donald which is something I don't even quite remember myself thinking, but there you go. I'd have him marginally behind now as a bowler, but still comfortably ahead as the best cricketer of the three.

Yeah, for me Steyn>Donald. There will always be the nonsense about Steyn playing against weaker batsmen than Donald, but bare in mind that for a large part of his career Steyn orchestrated his own wickets, whereas Donald had Fanie/Shaun to build pressure. Up until a year ago, Morkel really couldn't create enough much pressure to help Steyn. If anything, Morkel's stats were boosted by Steyn's pressure.*

The difference between the two goes beyond stats, imo. Why is Marshall rated the best ever by most? I mean, his stats are pretty similar to most of his competition, so what makes Malcolm stand out? There is something that goes beyond stats that gets someone like Marshall recognition over his statistical rivals, and to me that is the same something that makes Steyn more valuable than Donald as a bowler. Who would you want to take the new ball for you in a crucial match?

*I feel dirty for that little excerpt insulting Morkel. I don't know if I'll forgive myself.

 

[akilana]

There is no right answer to this but I think you are under estimating Donald there.
His only real failure is against Australia in SA and in Pakistan where he played only 2 matches.

 

[MrPrez]

There is no right answer to this but I think you are under estimating Donald there.
His only real failure is against Australia in SA and in Pakistan where he played only 2 matches.

I may well be. I didn't get to witness nearly enough of White Lightning in his prime due to my youth. What I have seen though is bloody impressive. I'd still say Steyn has more X-factor - the same sort that puts guys like Marshall ahead of their competition. I'm obviously not saying that Steyn is as good as Marshall was, just using a transferable sliver of logic.

Donald is generally considered to be better than Pollock... that's also due to that X-factor I'm trying to explain, given that they have very comparable stats.

 

[Dazinho]

Donald marginally the best bowler, would pick Pollock in my world XI because of his batting.

Also, Pollock is a ***y man, the other two definitely aren't.

Broadly agree with all of this, but have no opinion on the last line!!

Think Dale and AD are very similar types of bowlers who looked to make an explosive impact. Pollock was a more econonomical 'corridor' bowler in the Hadlee mould and there's no doubt he and AD benefited from having each other bowling in tandem.

Part of my answer would be dependant upon who else I already had in the team - if I already have strike bowlers and/or a weak tail then go for Pollock. Completely agree that in absolute terms, AD is the best as a pure bowler out of the three.

 

[Slifer]

Well for me, Steyn is our best bowler ever. That said, I'd say Proctor could have been rated > Pollock if he'd had more chances. I'd definitely take Proctor as a cricketer over Pollock though.


Yeah, for me Steyn>Donald. There will always be the nonsense about Steyn playing against weaker batsmen than Donald, but bare in mind that for a large part of his career Steyn orchestrated his own wickets, whereas Donald had Fanie/Shaun to build pressure. Up until a year ago, Morkel really couldn't create enough much pressure to help Steyn. If anything, Morkel's stats were boosted by Steyn's pressure.*

The difference between the two goes beyond stats, imo. Why is Marshall rated the best ever by most? I mean, his stats are pretty similar to most of his competition, so what makes Malcolm stand out? There is something that goes beyond stats that gets someone like Marshall recognition over his statistical rivals, and to me that is the same something that makes Steyn more valuable than Donald as a bowler. Who would you want to take the new ball for you in a crucial match?

*I feel dirty for that little excerpt insulting Morkel. I don't know if I'll forgive myself.

Well for me what sets MM apart statistically is his sub 23 average vs all teams and his sub 25 average home/away vs all teams (except for 3 lousy tests in NZ the last 2 of which he was carryin a back injury). No other bowler of MM's time (or since) has had that level of consistency and excellence vs all teams (and also bear in mind he never played ne minnows).

MM's xfactor was his ability to just about bowl everything (off cutters, leg cutters, outswing, inswing etc ) ne where + his very very nasty bouncer. The greatest compliment I think came from the magician himself Wasim Akram...ask him who he thinks the best fast bowler of all time is and he never hesitates to talk of the late great MM.

 

[kyear2]

Well said Slifer.

 

[watson]

I may well be. I didn't get to witness nearly enough of White Lightning in his prime due to my youth. What I have seen though is bloody impressive. I'd still say Steyn has more X-factor - the same sort that puts guys like Marshall ahead of their competition. I'm obviously not saying that Steyn is as good as Marshall was, just using a transferable sliver of logic.

Donald is generally considered to be better than Pollock... that's also due to that X-factor I'm trying to explain, given that they have very comparable stats.

Pollock's stat's take a dip in the absence of Donald. So Pollock needed Donald to bowl really well, but Donald never relied on Pollock. His stat's are the same whether supported by Pollock or not. Therefore, Donald is better than Pollock.

As far as Donald V Steyn - swings n' round-a-bouts really. But I have a personal preference for a younger Donald bowling short of length at a pace that can hurt. And with a lot of off-cut which he was really good at.

 

[NUFAN]

Just wondering if Steyn makes your SA ATG ODI XI?

He does not make mine and is in danger (not really the right word but meh) of never making it.

 

[cnerd123]

I think Morkel is a better ODI bowler than Steyn TBH.

Not sure though, off the top of my head, who I'd pick to support Donald and Pollock in an ODI ATXI for SA. Assuming Kallis + Klusener in the Top 7, you'll need another quick and a spinner to round off the side.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Morkel definitely for me too.

 

[Red]

Just wondering if Steyn makes your SA ATG ODI XI?

He does make mine and is in danger (not really the right word but meh) of never making it.

First picked for me.

 

[Red]

Smith *
DeKock +
Amla
Kallis
DeVilliers
Rhodes
Klusener
Pollock
Steyn
Tahir
Donald

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

Monk deKock in saffers atg odi xi? really?

 

[AldoRaine18]

Yeah a bit harsh on Gibbs.

 

[marc71178]

A bit harsh on a lot of people.

 

[Red]

Monk deKock in saffers atg odi xi? really?

For team balance, yep. It's either him or Boucher, and I prefer him.

Yeah a bit harsh on Gibbs.

Who would you take out to make a spot for Gibbs?

A bit harsh on a lot of people.

Who?