Cricketweb's 5 most unfairly treated players

[nexxus]

He is, sometimes it grates but it actually doesn't sound forced, think he's genuinely excited, says 'batters' a lot and very 'Natalian' like Shaun Pollock.

I think whether it works or not depends on his co-commentator. Last year they had him and Peter Kirsten on and I wanted to die. I think it may have been mostly Kirsten though.

 

[smash84]

Kallis

possibly

 

[DDP]

kallis i reckon

 

[Zinzan]

Pretty much classic Dickinson, this. Chose a non-mainstream opinion, present it as fact and doggedly stick to it in the face of arguments to the contrary, however compelling or sensible they may be.

Suffice to say I agree with everyone else; if any cricket writer or commentator suggested that Bond's contribution was incidental rather than crucial, one would assume they'd had one too many post-prandial ports.

Haha, ride down memory lane. A vintage thread from 5 years ago ! The likes of Flem & Brumby in fine form.

Which players do we think 5 years on?

 

[Flem274*]

I think you've missed my general point - emphasised by your comment that I've "listed Shane ****ing Warne in the 'no good at ODIs' camp" - I haven't, not at all. I've listed Warne in the "much better at Tests than ODIs". Warne was nothing more than a pretty good ODI bowler, he was far from one of the best of the modern era. Whereas there are some who think (very wrongly IMO but there we go) that he's the best Test bowler in history. Undoubtedly he is one of the better Test bowlers in history - having him in a top-ten, for instance, would be perfectly fair enough. I could easily, however, list 10 ODI bowlers better than him in the 1990s\2000s era (just FTR - Pollock, Murali, McGrath, Wasim Akram, Ambrose, Fraser, Walsh, Donald, Gough, Bracken).

Everyone I listed was notably better at either Tests or ODIs than the other. It's fair to say that some got the chance to show how good they were at one format and not at the other - Bracken being one of the better examples. But such cases are relatively few, and there's no gurantee in any such case that they would have proven as good at <insert format at which they did not get a fair crack>.

If half of those were genuinely not even good enough for one format that merely emphasises the point further.

I'll just go through each briefly to show what I mean:
Stephen Waugh - one of the best ever in Tests, merely just-about-good-enough in ODIs
Mahela Jayawardene - excellent Test batsman, merely just-about-good-enough in ODIs
Brian Lara - one of the best ever in Tests, merely very good in ODIs
Rahul Dravid - as above
Thilan Samaraweera - pretty damn excellent in Tests, not much crack at ODIs
Andy Flower - see Jayawardene, M
Younis Khan - as above
Virender Sehwag - until recently excellent in Tests and crap in ODIs
Ashwell Prince - pretty damn good in Tests, barely good enough in ODIs
Salim Malik - see Younis Khan
Justin Langer - good Test batsman, barely even played ODIs
VVS Laxman - see Salim Malik
Mark Richardson - OK-ish Test batsman, nowhere near good enough for ODIs
Andrew Strauss - good Test batsman, still doubt he'll be much good at ODIs
Daryll Cullinan - see Laxman
Hashan Tillikaratne - see Samaraweera
Simon Katich - decent Test batsman, not much crack at ODIs
Michael Slater - good Test batsman, crap at ODIs
Richie Richardson - see Cullinan
Michael Vaughan - see Slater
Jimmy Adams - as above
Asanka Gurasinha - as above
Alec Stewart - good Test batsman, no-more-than-OK ODI one
Kepler Wessels - see Richardson
Mark Taylor - as above
Michael Atherton - good Test batsman, not much crack at ODIs
Nasser Hussain - as above
John Crawley - not-far-from-Test-class batsman, nowhere near ODI-class
Mark Butcher - just-about-good-enough Test batsman, so bad at OD cricket he never even played ODIs
Sherwin Campbell - decent Test batsman, not much crack at ODIs
Andrew Hudson - as above
Tillakaratne Dilshan - as above
Jacob Oram - good Test all-rounder, ODI-class one but only, only just
Waqar Younis - superlative Test bowler for a time, never had control in ODIs though took wickets
Stuart Clark - excellent Test bowler, not much crack at ODIs
Shane Warne - one of the best Test bowlers ever, merely pretty good at ODIs
Dean Headley - decent Test bowler, terrible ODI one
Stuart MacGill - borderline Test-class bowler, nowhere near ODI-class
Dominic Cork - OK-ish Test bowler (could've been better), nowhere near ODI-class
Matthew Hoggard - Test-class for a time, nowhere near ODI-class ever
Daryl Tuffey - as above
James Franklin - as above
Venkatesh Prasad - decent Test bowler, pretty awful ODI one
Dean Jones - one of the best ever ODI batsmen, no more than OK at Tests
Michael Bevan - arguably best-ever ODI batsman, not Test-class though might have been with more chance
Mark Waugh - see Jones, D
Yuvraj Singh - outstanding ODI batsman, barely Test-class
Chris Gayle - as above
Sanath Jayasuriya - one of the best in ODIs, merely just-about-good-enough in Tests
Shoaib Malik - good ODI batsman, crap Test one
Nathan Astle - excellent ODI batsman, merely decent Test one
Hansie Cronje - as above
Jacques Rudolph - see Yuvraj Singh
Graeme Hick - excellent ODI batsman, nowhere near Test class for over half his career
Ramnaresh Sarwan - see Jayasuriya
Sourav Ganguly - as above
Neil Fairbrother - excellent ODI-batsman, not Test-class in relatively few chances he got
Nick Knight - excellent ODI batsman, not Test-class
Roger Twose - as above
Arjuna Ranatunga - see Cronje
Ajay Jadeja - see Fairbrother
Marcus Trescothick - excellent ODI batsman, serviceable Test batsman if I'm being generous
Neil Johnson - excellent ODI all-rounder, frankly nowhere near Test-class though might have played more in happier circumstances
Ijaz Ahmed - see Ranatunga
Russel Arnold - see Knight
Andrew Symonds - see Arnold
Runako Morton - sorry to you, but despite being one of the worst-ever Test batsmen he's actually OK-ish at ODIs
Andrew Flintoff - outstanding ODI all-rounder for many years, only relatively briefly the same in Tests
Lance Klusener - as above
Chris Harris - outstanding ODI all-rounder, nowhere near Test-class
Shane Bond - one of the best ever in ODIs, never played much Test cricket and was merely OK when he did
Mark Ealham - excellent ODI bowler, nowhere near Test-class
Gavin Larsen - as above
Saqlain Mushtaq - outstanding ODI bowler, merely OK one in Tests
Harbhajan Singh - as above
Brett Lee - ODI-class, not Test-class for the vast majority of his career
Adam Dale - see Larsen
Alan Mullally - as above
Daniel Vettori - see Saqlain and Harbhajan
Fanie de Villiers - outstanding ODI bowler, decent Test one
Craig Matthews - as above
Bryan Strang - pretty good ODI bowler, awful Test one
Mushtaq Ahmed - good ODI bowler for many years, good Test one only briefly
Pat Symcox - good ODI bowler, not Test-class
Chaminda Vaas - consistently excellent ODI bowler, mind-numbingly inconsistent Test one
Robert Croft - see Vettori
Kumara Dharmasena - see Dale
Aaqib Javed - decent ODI bowler, nowhere near Test-class
Ian Bradshaw - good ODI bowler, not Test-class
Steven Elworthy - good ODI bowler, 33 before he even looked remotely like being Test-class (and wasn't BTW)
Andrew Whittall - serviceable in ODIs and one of the most ineffective ever in Tests
Nathan Bracken - excellent ODI bowler, not Test-class in his few chances
Chris Pringle - see Aaqib Javed

Jesus ****ing Christ how long did this post take to write?

 

[Flem274*]

Neil Broom should not bat three, He's a good batsman but its not his thing, Daniel Flynn is also a one season wonder and not ery good but Broom should not bat three, he should bat four or five if he is picked for tests.

Which he won't ne because he'll fail in ODIs and not be touched again for ages, even if we go bto todd Astle or some not very good person.

The drunken prophet right here. Even better because we technically did pick Tastle in tests and the running CW joke is to get him to open again.

 

[sledger]

Does it count as "unfair treatment" if a player is massively overrated? If so I can think of a few from the subcontinent who have been treated very unfairly indeed...

 

[uvelocity]

whomever could you mean?

 

[sledger]

The one(s) who could be described as an obnoxious weed.

 

[uvelocity]

mango is a fruit innit

 

[Singh Is King]

Tendulkar without doubt. Think people like to ignore his performances against arguably the best attack ever (Australia) home and away, and his amazing away record.
Bradman said Tendulkar was the closest player to himself, yet we have people on here who think they know more than the best ever cricketer (Bradman) and pick players who they say are better than Tendulkar who they have never seen play and played against some very ordinary bowling attacks, unlike the bowlers Tendulkar faced in the 90s and completely stood out against

 

[sledger]

the best ever cricketer (Bradman)

Ah, that's more like it. Finally someone who treats Tendulkar fairly.

 

[Red]

Tendulkar without doubt. Think people like to ignore his performances against arguably the best attack ever (Australia) home and away, and his amazing away record.
Bradman said Tendulkar was the closest player to himself, yet we have people on here who think they know more than the best ever cricketer (Bradman) and pick players who they say are better than Tendulkar who they have never seen play and played against some very ordinary bowling attacks, unlike the bowlers Tendulkar faced in the 90s and completely stood out against

No. Bradman said Tendulkar reminded him of himself (in terms of style). I don't think Bradman meant Tendulkar was better than the others.

 

[Singh Is King]

No. Bradman said Tendulkar reminded him of himself (in terms of style). I don't think Bradman meant Tendulkar was better than the others.

Have you not heard what he said? So all these analysts on TV and Journalists have interpreted it one way, yet you interpret it another way? Its plain and simple in his quote

 

[ImpatientLime]

Tendulkar without doubt. Think people like to ignore his performances against arguably the best attack ever (Australia) home and away, and his amazing away record.
Bradman said Tendulkar was the closest player to himself, yet we have people on here who think they know more than the best ever cricketer (Bradman) and pick players who they say are better than Tendulkar who they have never seen play and played against some very ordinary bowling attacks, unlike the bowlers Tendulkar faced in the 90s and completely stood out against

I absolutely hate this line of argument.

You may as well close this forum down if the opinion of the ex player is the only one that matters.

 

[sledger]

Yes, standard Ikki logic. Terrible.

 

[Spark]

Have you not heard what he said? So all these analysts on TV and Journalists have interpreted it one way, yet you interpret it another way? Its plain and simple in his quote

It is, and it seems that you are not aware of this, called an opinion. People have them. They are legitimate.

 

[sledger]

I get infracted when I have an opinion.

 

[stumpski]

Haha, ride down memory lane. A vintage thread from 5 years ago ! The likes of Flem & Brumby in fine form.

Which players do we think 5 years on?

Jade will be waiting in vain for a mention I fear.

 

[fredfertang]

I get infracted when I have an opinion.

Is your current linekeresque disciplinary record as a consequence of losing the ability to hold opinions, or the desire to express them?