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***Official*** India in New Zealand 2013/14

Howsie

International Captain
no way is Anderson better than Ryder or McCullum. Anderson isn't even in the top 8 batsmen in the country, IMO.
Ryder has regressed so much over the last two years, too much domestic bullying tbh. Technique has really fallen away (not that it was ever that great) and he just looks so sloppy. Non-existent defensive setup isn't going to serve him well when he finally makes it back to test cricket either. Just no on McCullum.

Anderson is a big time bat, will average over 40 with the bat in test cricket without a doubt. Don't let his mediorce domestic record full you, he's a lot more gifted then those numbers suggest (as we've already seen in one day cricket). When you're playing a game here and a game there in your late teens, early twenties it's going to be hard to put up massive numbers. AFAIC you're off your rocker if you don't believe he's inside the top five bats in the country. You don't have to rate him as highly as I do but that's just ridiculous if you actually believe that.
 

Howsie

International Captain
Sigh, Boult really does get shafted by the umpires when it comes to lbw's. They just can't seem to understand that he gets close to the stumps and swings it. Playing without the drs almost seems like a different sport at times.
Yep, especially against India. An umpire knows one bad slip up and he's out the door possibly. Steve Davis today was a perfect illustration of that.
 

Zinzan

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Out of interest, is it Dhoni, the BCCI or both parties who oppose the DRS? Surely batsmen like Kohli would hate the prospect of receiving a howler without the chance of a review.
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
Out of interest, is it Dhoni, the BCCI or both parties who oppose the DRS? Surely batsmen like Kohli would hate the prospect of receiving a howler without a chance of reviewing.
It was SRT who opposed it in the first place. During India's tour to Sri Lanka , I think, SRT was repeatedly turned down when he appealed against decisions that had ruled him out. Out came the great man with comments on how the system was flawed. Of course it wasn't perfect but it was much better than not having it.

Of course, no one in the Indian team, and no one amongst the commentators had the guts to call a spade a spade and point at where the problem lay.

Every time SRT was ruled out, he would go to the non-striker and ask him (one presumes) what he felt. Anyone can imagine what the youngster (everyone is a youngster compared to Sachin) would reply. Up went the great man in review. He was ruled out because he WAS out. On the other hand, Sri Lanka were much smarter on what they appealed against and, therefore, had much greater success in having bad decisions over-turned.

The Indian team, instead of understanding that the UDRS system is not like a toss, that on an average half should go against you and half for, but is purely based on a genuine and very firm belief that a wrong decision has been made. But no. they kept up the pre tense that their 'bad run" with the UDRS was because the system was flawed. It was something like England (and some other teams) who were almost invariably (when fielding) told by Prior(or other equally over-hyper keepers) to appeal. Thank God, they finally realised Prior was only going to waste their three chances to appeal.

The moment the team, led by SRT, reported to the board, headed by nincompoops who can't tell one end of the bat from the other, they all went up against the system and the electronic media followed suit.

Any Indian commentator who speaks in favour of the UDRS faces immediate sacking from the commenting team.

In this kind of an environment, you don't expect sensible decisions being made by BCCI or anyone else in authority in Indian cricket.

One understands the stupidity of the morons who run Indian cricket and the pure greed of the likes of Gavaskar, Shastri and Bhogle but it is the Indian fans who disappoint one the most. It just goes on to highlight what is the worst thing to afflict Indian cricket over the last decade or two - the dumbing-down of the average fan.

People who rely purely on what comes out of the electronic media and some of the worst commentators in world cricket for their own cricket-punditry are not expected to disagree . . .

Those who understand the game and can think for themselves are fast being reduced to a minuscule minority in India and that is a massive tragedy. Great for BCCI of course for like the Indian politicians, they derive their strength from idiocy masquerading as considered opinion.
 
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Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
Ryder has regressed so much over the last two years, too much domestic bullying tbh. Technique has really fallen away (not that it was ever that great) and he just looks so sloppy. Non-existent defensive setup isn't going to serve him well when he finally makes it back to test cricket either. Just no on McCullum.

Anderson is a big time bat, will average over 40 with the bat in test cricket without a doubt. Don't let his mediorce domestic record full you, he's a lot more gifted then those numbers suggest (as we've already seen in one day cricket). When you're playing a game here and a game there in your late teens, early twenties it's going to be hard to put up massive numbers. AFAIC you're off your rocker if you don't believe he's inside the top five bats in the country. You don't have to rate him as highly as I do but that's just ridiculous if you actually believe that.
Agree with this. Ryder will average less than 25 if he comes back now. His footwork has gone to the dogs. I feel like I will be taken more seriously if I use bigger words to say the same thing. But that is the guts of it.
 

Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
Watling has a more organised and compact off side game. But give Corey another year of test cricket and video analysis of his game and he will improve. I already see improvements in his off drive in this game.

Corey is already a more versatile test match batsman evidenced by the fact Flem has labelled watling a bubble batsman who bats the same way regardless of the scoreboard situation.

tl;dr version - maybe but Corey will close the gap pretty quickly.
 

Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
odi ryder =/= test ryder
DWTA - technique is technique. For example Jamie How's forward defence takes my breath away just as much in ODIs as it does in tests.

Legal disclaimer which usually I don't bother with:
To be fair to your general point - he won't slog in tests and or hit across the line but he will still need to play off drives which looked shaky in the ODIs.
 

Immenso

International Vice-Captain
I'm inclined to agree with Howsie. Ryder's batting these days reminds me of Southee. It's hard to tell ODI Jesse from CBF Jesse.

I would like to be wrong, but he doesn't fill me with much confidence.
 

Flem274*

123/5
Baz heaping the praise on KW
cricinfo said:
Brendon McCullum has said his 224 at Eden Park will be his best innings if New Zealand beat India in the first Test. He also credited Kane Williamson for his temperament during their double-century partnership on day one, and said that his younger colleague's knowledge and approach had helped him bat for so long.

"Definitely (it will be my best) if we win the game. Pleased to have contributed in a significant way, which was by building partnerships," McCullum said after the second day's play. "We managed to keep creating partnerships after a tough start so that is very satisfying, especially after we lost wickets. To get 500 after being put into bat, after we were 30 for 3, is a great effort. Team has got a little bit of fight in them in tough situations."

McCullum and Williamson led that fight, adding 221 at over four an over. After Williamson was caught down the leg side for 113, McCullum carried on and added another 133 with Corey Anderson, before the allrounder got a rough decision on 77. McCullum marched on, and took the score past 500, a total he felt New Zealand had no hope of reaching given the dire situation he came into.

"We thought we would get 200-odd," McCullum said. "Was thinking about small targets, being competitive when you are 30 for 3, but when we started going obviously targets changed for us. Never did I think that after 30 for 3, and in those conditions that we would get 500 and that's a fine achievement for this batting group. We have the bowlers to take 20 wickets provided we give them enough runs and I think we have given them enough runs."

Dwelling on Williamson's role in the fightback, McCullum said his partner made him realise the magnitude of their task extended beyond making it to their respective hundreds. "He has got a really good mindset and he said 100 is just a number. Our job at that time was not to get too carried away, it was to keep batting and get good runs on the board. Was nice to tick off the milestone, nice to get a hundred at home, but still had a job to do.

"Credit to Kane for his temperament and also his batting knowledge that he passed on to me that I have got a job to do. Was hard to rein myself in at times but batting with Kane was outstanding. He has a great temperament, a great amount of maturity and is experienced as well. Disappointed that he got out, his approach was right and rubbed off on me."

It was an important innings personally for McCullum as well. New Zealand had taken the one-dayers against India 4-0 but that was mostly due to the batting of Williamson and Ross Taylor. While McCullum did get some quick, late runs, he also had two successive ducks, and admitted it became difficult as captain when the runs were not coming.

"Harder to lead when you are not scoring runs. That's when your fighting qualities and as a leader come out, as you still have a job to do as captain," he said. "If you aren't scoring runs then that's the important time to stand up as a leader, that's what I have realised recently. And still enjoy other people's success as well ... just keep faith, keep heart and desire."

McCullum reached the double-century with a six and a four in the last over before lunch, and had also reached the hundred on day one with a six. He said he did not want to spend too much time in the nineties, having fallen there a few times before.

The No 5 position was the ideal one for him, McCullum said. "Batting at number five is suitable for me with the ball not quite so new. Bat after Kane and Taylor and then with strokemakers later on, BJ (Watling) and Corey. Five is a good place to bat for me."
 

HeathDavisSpeed

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
DWTA - technique is technique. For example Jamie How's forward defence takes my breath away just as much in ODIs as it does in tests.

Legal disclaimer which usually I don't bother with:
To be fair to your general point - he won't slog in tests and or hit across the line but he will still need to play off drives which looked shaky in the ODIs.
He hasn't played tests in quite some time, and from what I've seen of him in first class, he's still got a great eye and his technique is as good as it has ever been. Doesn't guarantee he'll come good but to dismiss him for the latest potential flash in the pan is a little bit naive.
 

Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
He hasn't played tests in quite some time, and from what I've seen of him in first class, he's still got a great eye and his technique is as good as it has ever been. Doesn't guarantee he'll come good but to dismiss him for the latest potential flash in the pan is a little bit naive.
If you've seen him recently play for Otago in a four day match then I guess that is something - but he did not impress me with his defensive system or footwork in the ODIs. And I am confused as to how he could look great in an FC match playing a forward defence and shaky in an ODI playing a forward defence.

I like being called Naive by the way - makes me feel younger as I was feeling my age tuesday night at cricket practice and had to trundle down some off spin :)
 

HeathDavisSpeed

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
If you've seen him recently play for Otago in a four day match then I guess that is something - but he did not impress me with his defensive system or footwork in the ODIs. And I am confused as to how he could look great in an FC match playing a forward defence and shaky in an ODI playing a forward defence.

I like being called Naive by the way - makes me feel younger as I was feeling my age tuesday night at cricket practice and had to trundle down some off spin :)
Hahaha. I like the cut of your jib, buddy.

But I got the feeling with the ODIs, he'd been given licence to go out and just smash the ball as hard as he could whilst Guptill had been told to build an innings (well, that's certainly what it looked like anyway) and in those circumstances, judging him on his forward defence probably isn't fair - though the point about some of his drives looking a bit off is probably fair.
 

Flem274*

123/5
Ryder has always looked like a fat biffer in odis even when defending because that's basically what he is in limited overs. What's truly surprising is he has done better in ODIs than he has in domestic one dayers. Prior to selection he averaged mid 20s and mid 40s in List A and FC respectively.

It's hard to tell with Jesse but on the shield footage he was defending normally and with the usual jesse test technique. one thing i will say is he raises his game to the challenge. the higher the level, the more seriously he takes it.

though i daresay if he gets out in the manner he did last season to southee and boult in that ND welly game he will be dropped forever. that was cbf jesse at his lowest.
 
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Zinzan

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From cricinfo...:blink:


19.5

Wagner to Rahane, 2 runs, full, overpitched, outside off, pushed away for a couple first ball. Bowled at 146ks, the fastest probably in the match
 

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