Daryl Harper withdraws from Dominica test

[Daemon]

This is essentially the crucial point.

Players, captains and managers whinging about match officials is endemic in all team sports I pay even the vaguest notice of; in any given Premiership weekend some manager will bemoan how a penalty, a non-award of the same or a mildly contentious offside has cost his team, etc. After the 2003 rugby union world cup final (which his team won) Sir Clive Woodward (correctly) suggested weak refereeing of the scrum by Andre Watson had nearly cost his team the win.

However, what unites most who complain about the standard of officiating is that they want more help for the chaps who make the on-field calls, not less. In Dhoni's case there is a system that can be used to correct some of the errors the standing umpires make, but his board, for their own reasons, oppose(d) it. If you willingly choose to blindfold your keeper is it fair to complain that he can't see the ball?

Any obfuscating comparisons to Stuart "His Dad's a Match Referre, You Know" Broad's massively irriating refusal to appeal for LBWs or Ricky Ponting's serial umpire abusing (both of which are/were, frankly, disgraceful) are from the "two wrongs make a right" school.

Agree with all this.

About that highlighted part though, opting for no UDRS does not mean handicapping the umpires (blindfolding the keeper), it just means that they're not given an additional tool (which they never had anyways for ages) and for that reason I believe Harper shouldn't be immune from criticism. In this case however, the criticism came in the wrong form and via the wrong means.

 

[G.I.Joe]

Proof?

http://www.cricketweb.net/forum/off-topic/22830-what-do-you-look-like-pt-iii-178.html#post2133671

 

[Cevno]

which point?

Was referring to the End of post before yours.

The point being that Dhoni can't criticisise because there is no UDRS etc... etc...
Has been responded to so many times with opposite examples too.

 

[GIMH]

So it is fine to accuse Indians sarcastically of getting away with everything ,but you cannot claim the opposite?

Another example of you wanting to have the cake and eat it too

SS constantly alludes to what the BCCI would do if x happened. It's naïve to assume otherwise. I don't think India get away with everything though - can you quote me saying that? If I did then fair enough but....

There's also a difference between accusing one of always defending their own, and accusing one of being anti a specific nation or race. The fact I have to explain that to you beggars belief.

 

[Cevno]

SS constantly alludes to what the BCCI would do if x happened. It's naïve to assume otherwise. I don't think India get away with everything though - can you quote me saying that? If I did then fair enough but....

There's also a difference between accusing one of always defending their own, and accusing one of being anti a specific nation or race. The fact I have to explain that to you beggars belief.

Nice attempt to completely change tracks.
We weren't talking about your posts though. We were talking about Marcuss,Gotspin and HB'S post.

Either all were bad or all were fine,imo. You can't be selective about it when it suits your argument.

 

[Cevno]

http://www.cricketweb.net/forum/off-topic/22830-what-do-you-look-like-pt-iii-178.html#post2133671

C'd.

 

[GIMH]

Was referring to the End of post before yours.

The point being that Dhoni can't criticisise because there is no UDRS etc... etc...
Has been responded to so many times with opposite examples too.

Yeah but not with any actual valid arguments

 

[GIMH]

Nice attempt to completely change tracks.
We weren't talking about your posts though. We were talking about Marcuss,Gotspin and HB'S post.

Either all were bad or all were fine,imo. You can't be selective about it when it suits your argument.

Hmmm I think I have misunderstood you here. I have no idea what you're trying to prove.

HB's post was not the same as anything anyone else has said in the thread.

 

[Cevno]

Yeah but not with any actual valid arguments

You will not consider anything valid tbf ,so....

 

[Jarquis]

Not sure what was wrong with my post... called hb put on what he was pretty obviously doing.

 

[Son Of Coco]

nightprowler10 is Muttiah Muralitharan.

Discuss.

You might be right, I've heard he spends a lot of time on the internet sporting an unusually bent arm.

 

[vcs]

Next time someone moans about Stu Broad not appealing, I'll bring up a time he did appeal. That'll shut the moral high ground up

And hb, the 'As long as they aren't Indian' post is really poor. Very disappointing.

Except that Broad is actually supposed to appeal, he's not doing the umpire a favour by appealing. Whereas Dhoni could easily have been justified to have had a moan, because he was genuinely hard done by due to the operator showing the wrong replay (none of which has anything to do with UDRS).

Anyway, my dislike for Broad comes more from the ball-throwing incident at Haider and his failure to give a proper apology, rather than his tendency not to appeal.

 

[honestbharani]

Wrong again.

Hb played the race/nationality card. Marcuss called him on it.

I played the card that there is a lot of anti-India posters here.. It is also called the Truth card.. How the hell does race/nationality come into this? I just meant to say there is a lot of hate for Indian cricketers and the Indian cricket board here.......... If Marcuss couldn't figure that out, I really gotta question whatever IQ test he did take...

 

[Cevno]

Hmmm I think I have misunderstood you here. I have no idea what you're trying to prove.

HB's post was not the same as anything anyone else has said in the thread.

I'll reply in the manner GingerFurball would do to this -



Was referring to Marcuss and Gotspin's posts which were of the same nature as Hb's but in the opposite direction.

Not sure what was wrong with my post... called hb put on what he was pretty obviously doing.

Accusing someone of having a biased opinion or one sided obtuse opinion does not imply accusing someone of Racism.

Gimh and Gotspin among others in this thread have admitted to not liking the Indian team and hating the players and supporting everyone against them ,does that make them Racist going by your logic?
I don't think it does.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Agree with all this.

About that highlighted part though, opting for no UDRS does not mean handicapping the umpires (blindfolding the keeper), it just means that they're not given an additional tool (which they never had anyways for ages) and for that reason I believe Harper shouldn't be immune from criticism. In this case however, the criticism came in the wrong form and via the wrong means.

I was indulging myself in a spot of reductio ad absurdum. In any sphere if a party denies another party use of something that will demonstrably improve their performance it's then unfair for the first party to complain about the second's performance.

What some people seem to fail to grasp is that Dhoni being unjustified here doesn't mean he's always wrong or that because other players have behavioural problems his is mitigated. Bringing in unrelated issues just muddies the waters and the thread disappears down partisan lines.

I don't have any love for Harper and think the elite panel is well shot of him, but where he's denied an aid that will, in all probability, improve his performance, any criticism of him by those who represent the board preventing its use cannt be justified.

 

[Daemon]

What some people seem to fail to grasp is that Dhoni being unjustified here doesn't mean he's always wrong or that because other players have behavioural problems his is mitigated. Bringing in unrelated issues just muddies the waters and the thread disappears down partisan lines.

Agree completely.

I don't have any love for Harper and think the elite panel is well shot of him, but where he's denied an aid that will, in all probability, improve his performance, any criticism of him by those who represent the board preventing its use cannt be justified.

Are you saying that it would be unjustified of Dhoni to criticise Harper even via the match report, without consulting the media? If so, then I have to disagree, for reasons I've stated before.

 

[honestbharani]

I agree that one should use that forum to criticize an umpire if he happens to be an international captain, but what history shows is that ICC pretty much turn a blind eye to the umpire's review by the captains and coaches.. In that case, one can understand why a frustrated captain would answer this way when prompted.. Again understandable != justifiable.. Lets be clear on that.

 

[G.I.Joe]

 

[G.I.Joe]

 

[G.I.Joe]