Kallis Vs Sobers

[The Sean]

How does Kallis take the fielding crown?

 

[smash84]

Well let us have a look at the stats. I am using only Tests in this example.

Jacques Kallis
Mathes - 137
Bowling
Wickets - 261
Average - 31.55
Best Bowling - 6/54
Batting
Runs - 10 843
Average - 54.76
100s/50s - 34/53
Top score - 189*
Fielding
Catches - 155

Gary Sobers
Matches - 93
Bowling
Wickets - 235
Average - 34.03
Best Bowling - 6/73
Batting
Runs - 8 032
Average - 57.78
100s/50s - 26/30
Top score - 365*
Fielding
Catches - 109

In the batting Sobers seems miles in front and in the bowling and fielding it is pretty close, but Kallis takes both. None the less the stats appear to indicate that Sober is the better. Hope you have enjoyed it.

???

 

[marc71178]

In the batting Sobers seems miles in front and in the bowling and fielding it is pretty close, but Kallis takes both. None the less the stats appear to indicate that Sober is the better. Hope you have enjoyed it.

Now take away the minnow bashing from Jacques and compare - only one winner then.

Also factor in the "playing for the team" part of things and Jacques bowling average would increase yet further.

 

[Ikki]

TBF, Sobers also had India, Pakistan and NZ who were clearly weak opponents for much of his career. In his era, it was basically two different tiers: Aus, Eng and WI in one and NZ, Pak and Ind in another.

 

[Uppercut]

Now take away the minnow bashing from Jacques and compare - only one winner then.

Also factor in the "playing for the team" part of things and Jacques bowling average would increase yet further.

FWIW Kallis's batting average barely budges an inch when you take out minnows.

And if you're going to start messing around with the figures you could likewise factor in the fact that he's played his home tests in the world's most difficult country to bat in. But people don't like giving him credit for anything. So no one ever does.

 

[kingkallis]

Now take away the minnow bashing from Jacques & Garry and compare - only one winner then. Kallis.

Also factor in the "playing for the team" part of things and Jacques bowling average would increase yet further.

True mate true!

Remove India, New Zealand and Pakistan from Garry's records.
Remove Bangladesh and Zimbabwe from Kallis's records.

 

[marc71178]

FWIW Kallis's batting average barely budges an inch when you take out minnows.

Batting average down 3, bowling average up 3 - that's suddenly quite a change, plus there's the artificially low bowling average owing to his sudden twinges that have a habit of coming on when the going get's tough...

 

[smash84]

Batting average down 3, bowling average up 3 - that's suddenly quite a change, plus there's the artificially low bowling average owing to his sudden twinges that have a habit of coming on when the going get's tough...

Interesting that you find the 3 run difference "quite a change" and 20 percent of career matches not a big factor. Very interesting indeed.

 

[kingkallis]

Its just humorous how they refuse to applaud or acknowledge any young talent ( of our era ) who betters their old man.

 

[kingkallis]

Surprisingly Sobers averaged just 43 against the Australians back in those days. He failed to do anything against the Kiwis as well.

Against India : 1920 @ 83.47
Against Pakistan : 984 @ 89.45

WOW!

 

[fredfertang]

Sobers played the game with a smile on his face and batted and bowled accordingly - that's the difference between them

 

[kingkallis]

lol

And thats why he is THE GREATEST ALL ROUNDER ever?

hahahaha!

 

[fredfertang]

lol

And thats why he is THE GREATEST ALL ROUNDER ever?

hahahaha!

No, and I didn't express the view that he was - but that is a major factor in why most of those who saw him play do believe he was the greatest all rounder of them all

 

[kingkallis]

Since when a smiling face became an criteria Fred?

 

[fredfertang]

Since when a smiling face became an criteria Fred?

I was simply making the point that Sobers was by some distance the most popular player of his era - Kallis is certainly respected, and quite rightly so, but he is not particularly well liked

 

[kingkallis]

So he becomes less important cricketer just cause he is NOT liked?

I totally agree with your point of view in general but one becomes a better cricketer just because he is liked or disliked by the people?

In that case Afridi or Jayasuriya > Kallis or Dravid!

 

[Uppercut]

Stop arguing with something no one said.

 

[Jarquis]

 

[MrIncredible]

Dont know who said it, but PAkistan and India of SObers time were no where near the joke teams that Bang/Zim are.

 

[Ikki]

I recall earlier in this thread where I compared the minnows in their times and India/NZ/Pak weren't much better - if at all actually - than Zimbabwe.