*Official* Warne vs Murali Discussion

[GotSpin]

While Warne may be a slightly better fielder how is it relevant when we are comparing them as bowlers?It is like me saying Kumble is a better bowler than Warne because he scored a century...

As for this utter BS about slip catching >>>>> any other fielding position

That would make someone like Dravid a better fielder than Ponting

Ponting is a fairly good slipper as well....

 

[Ikki]

I used to believe that Warne was better than Murali but I have changed my mind.

A point about Murali/Warne records in India - while both are equally bad it must be said that Murali's record become this bad only after the latest series in which there were some absolutely flat tracks particularly the first one at Ahmedabad and this at a time when Murali is so obviously past his peak.

If you look at overall records against India then Murali leaves Warne in the dust.As for Murai's record in Aus-well that was the time when all the chucking controversy started and the Australian crowds behaviour towards Murali was despicable.With that in mind I would not take Murali's average against Aus in Aus at face value.Even if you remove minnows or whatever Murali still has a marginally better average and maybe SR too..not sure...and just 50 wickets or so less.Records and stats wise Murali leaves Warne in the dust.Warne was better to watch maybe but Murali is the better bowler.Wisden also has Murali at 1.

Murali's record against India is only better at home. He is as bad as Warne in India.

If Warne had bowled against India in Sri Lanka then it'd be relevant. Australia is one of the worst places in cricket to bowl spin whereas Sri Lanka is one of the best. There are only 2 places in the world where spin outdoes pace, and they are Sri Lanka and India.

 

[JBH001]

A good slipper is better than a good fielder in any other position, period. Unlike the traditional Warne/Murali debate, this one is neither close nor debatable. Warne ****s all over Murali in terms of fielding. This is so clear cut that I'm not even respecting anything else as a valid opinion.

What a load of crap! Just utter dross.

 

[JBH001]

Warne is/was a better fielder than Murali. He was also a better batsman, a better leader and more of a personality (for better and worse). As a bowler I am undecided as they have different strengths.

Like I said - If I wanted someone to bowl a ridiculously good one-off innings I'd go with Murali.

Thats a good way of seeing it, and I'd agree with that. Slightly the better fielder, definitely the better batsman and leader, a bigger personality, and, in my view, the slightly inferior bowler. Spot on about the good one-off innings too; Murali at certain times could just turn it on and scythe through the opposition.

 

[Furball]

lol... what complete BS in this post? Why is catching more imp than stopping the ball? And where is the proof that Murali was in fact a poor catcher? Warne has dropped more than his share of catches..

Because taking a catch dismisses the batsmen, stopping the ball saves a run. In the long form of the game, the former is infinitely more important.

 

[Uppercut]

Taking catches and stopping runs all have equal value..

Are we talking about cricket here, or communism?

 

[GuyFromLancs]

Thats a good way of seeing it, and I'd agree with that. Slightly the better fielder, definitely the better batsman and leader, a bigger personality, and, in my view, the slightly inferior bowler. Spot on about the good one-off innings too; Murali at certain times could just turn it on and scythe through the opposition.

Good to see one person agrees with me occasionally. It doesn't happen often. For a good few years now I have considered Murali the more destructive on his day a as pure bowler. Warne, also a great bowler, seem to scare the opposition in a way you would usually associate with a quick - that is the power of personality - but it can backfire if things don't go your way. Luckily for Warne he played in a great, maybe the greatest, side, and this didn't happen too often.


By the end of Warne's career and despite his brilliant Ashes tour in 2005, Murali was the better bowler, but only by 2-3% IMO.

 

[Teja.]

I rate Warne the better bowler, and am undecided on the better fielder part, some of Murali's direct hits are absolutely phenomenal.

and about the Crows booing Murali, I don't think professional athletes who have played 100+ test matches can justify poor performances due to the crowd booing them, Ponting was ****e in India and Murali was ****e in Australia. To even suggest that he would have fared better if the crowd was friendlier is ridiculous.

 

[Avada Kedavra]

Many players get booed all over the world but that doesn't mean a poor record should be ignored. When Ponting goes to India he gets booed, just like he did in England. There are never any excuses for Pontings poor performances in India based on the fact that he was unpopular. He just played badly and got owned by the turbinator. You need to get some perspective. These are professional athletes. Sledging from the crowd should not provide excuse for failure. Wonder how Gilchrist felt when he went out to bat with the barmy army chanting that Slater was the father of his son (something like that) - But he still chalked up a devastating ton.

You have tried to make Murali look better by providing absurd reasoning for excluding a glaring fault in his track record.

And as for your last point, easily debatable too.

Have you read my post completely or do you pick and choose what you want to read?I would like to see Warne bowl with the umpire no balling him for no reason whatsoever and the crowd booing and no balling him as well..Booing happens to many player,that is not the issue.

As for stats:

Overall.

Murali beats Warne against Bangladesh,England,India,New Zealand,South Africa,West Indies and Zimbabwe.Or simply put,Murali has a better overall record against every team except Pakistan I'' overlook that Warne played for the greatest side and give you that Warne's record against SL is better than Murali's against Australia.Still 7-2 in favour of Murali, no way is it "debatable"

Away from home

Murali beats Warne in Bangladesh,England,New Zealand,Pakistan and West Indies (by a long way,Lara and co took Warne took the cleaners). Warne beats him in India,South Africa and Zimbabwe. That is 5-3 to Murali. Add SL for Warne and it is still 5-4 in favour of Murali.You need to get some perspective.Do me a favour and stop shifting goal posts all the time.

 

[Burgey]

Have you read my post completely or do you pick and choose what you want to read?I would like to see Warne bowl with the umpire no balling him for no reason whatsoever and the crowd booing and no balling him as well..Booing happens to many player,that is not the issue.

Well, he was no-balled the first time because the umpire thought his action illegal - keeping in mind it was before the analysis of his action etc, and back then umpires didn't refer actions, they called bowlers (albeit hardly ever).

Warne copped it massively re. personal things in his life while he was bowling, fwiw. Not condoning how people reacted to Murali btw, just noting it. Warne's arguably greatest series performance came at a time when his marriage was falling apart and his private life was splashed all over the place.

Again though, how people react to these things is a matter for them, and there's no right or wrong way to react. And tbf, Warne was far more advanced in his career when that happened than Murali was when he was no-balled here.

 

[Oscillatingmind]

To this thread, who cares, there both great, there is no separating them logically, two great spin-bowlers who came in the same generation, why not "The Warne & Murali appreciation thread". I know I'm being idealistically daft.

 

[Avada Kedavra]

Well, he was no-balled the first time because the umpire thought his action illegal - keeping in mind it was before the analysis of his action etc, and back then umpires didn't refer actions, they called bowlers (albeit hardly ever).

Warne copped it massively re. personal things in his life while he was bowling, fwiw. Not condoning how people reacted to Murali btw, just noting it. Warne's arguably greatest series performance came at a time when his marriage was falling apart and his private life was splashed all over the place.

Again though, how people react to these things is a matter for them, and there's no right or wrong way to react. And tbf, Warne was far more advanced in his career when that happened than Murali was when he was no-balled here.

Which is why he could deal with it.People knew of his prowess,therefore there was no question of people doubting his ability.With Murali,it happened very early in his career when people had no clue that he'd become the bowler he is today.Imagine what he must have gone through....for that matter,I do not think the cases are comparable.Warne's problems were his own doing - social life, marriage etc....there was no preconceived notion to malign him...

 

[Burgey]

Which is why he could deal with it.People knew of his prowess,therefore there was no question of people doubting his ability.With Murali,it happened very early in his career when people had no clue that he'd become the bowler he is today.Imagine what he must have gone through....for that matter,I do not think the cases are comparable.Warne's problems were his own doing - social life, marriage etc....there was no preconceived notion to malign him...

There wasn't an anti-Murali conspiracy mate. He got called and the boof head element responded. You're giving too much credit in suggesting it was pre-conceived I think.

 

[duffer]

I remember when Sachin-Ponting was the new Warne-Murali. Now it's like we've gone back to our roots. CC bringing it back?

 

[Burgey]

I remember when Sachin-Ponting was the new Warne-Murali. Now it's like we've gone back to our roots. CC bringing it back?

This one's like Smith's Crisps mate - The original and best.

 

[Avada Kedavra]

There wasn't an anti-Murali conspiracy mate. He got called and the boof head element responded. You're giving too much credit in suggesting it was pre-conceived I think.

Why then was he no balled for bowling a leg break?

 

[Burgey]

Why then was he no balled for bowling a leg break?

it might have been, dare I say, the first and only time in history an umpire got something wrong.

I'd extrapolate, but the flying saucer has arrived to take me to Bigfoot's birthday party.

Honestly, where there's a choice between conspiracy and incompetence, choose incompetence. It wins out every time.

 

[GotSpin]

Have you read my post completely or do you pick and choose what you want to read?I would like to see Warne bowl with the umpire no balling him for no reason whatsoever and the crowd booing and no balling him as well..Booing happens to many player,that is not the issue.

As for stats:

Overall.

Murali beats Warne against Bangladesh,England,India,New Zealand,South Africa,West Indies and Zimbabwe.Or simply put,Murali has a better overall record against every team except Pakistan I'' overlook that Warne played for the greatest side and give you that Warne's record against SL is better than Murali's against Australia.Still 7-2 in favour of Murali, no way is it "debatable"

Away from home

Murali beats Warne in Bangladesh,England,New Zealand,Pakistan and West Indies (by a long way,Lara and co took Warne took the cleaners). Warne beats him in India,South Africa and Zimbabwe. That is 5-3 to Murali. Add SL for Warne and it is still 5-4 in favour of Murali.You need to get some perspective.Do me a favour and stop shifting goal posts all the time.

I've clearly read your post since I think it belongs in the rubbish along with the last two hundred simpsons episodes.

Murali is a professional athlete. I think you need to understand that being booed and jeered by a crowd does not provide justification for a poor record. Murali was no balled by a largely incompetent umpire. I don't really understand the correlation between no-balled and poor performances in Australia.

As for the rest of the garbage you posted. It's good to see that you can only read statistics at face value. Such deep critical thinking you've shown there. Groundbreaking

 

[GotSpin]

Which is why he could deal with it.People knew of his prowess,therefore there was no question of people doubting his ability.With Murali,it happened very early in his career when people had no clue that he'd become the bowler he is today.Imagine what he must have gone through....for that matter,I do not think the cases are comparable.Warne's problems were his own doing - social life, marriage etc....there was no preconceived notion to malign him...

errr

you do realise when people already consider you one of the greats there is much more pressure on you than a player who still remains an unknown entity

 

[Ikki]

Just wondering whether Avada's recent revision of Ponting's rank also coincides with his revision of opinion re Warne...