***Official New Zealand Domestic Season Thread 2009/10

[Flem274*]

Do you think if you put Shane Bond back in domestic cricket, he would average 47.15 with the ball?

Tuffey would....with the bat.

Tuffey.

 

[Flem274*]

No, you're point?

His point is your knee is jerking all over Kemar Roach and you're prejudiced against anyone below 135, even if they averaged 18 with the ball domestically, you'd still abuse them.

Oh wait, thats my point. Lets see what PEWS's is.

 

[Howsie]

His point is your knee is jerking all over Kemar Roach and you're prejudiced against anyone below 135, even if they averaged 18 with the ball domestically, you'd still abuse them.

Oh wait, thats my point. Lets see what PEWS's is.

I rate Roach, big deal. I rated him before he began playing international cricket and probably would have rated him higher then some current international bowlers then also.

Again, I rate Brent Arnel, Trent Boult and Tim Southee and they're all around that 135K mark. I just don't rate Tuffey anymore, we have better bowlers in domestic cricket at the moment that are better and almost a decade younger. Tuffey will go down the Ian Butler road, play a couple of decent games before being spanked around and being dropped.

 

[SmityNZ]

Howsie's right here. The difference between Thompson and McClenaghan is that Thompson is a decent domestic seamer. McClenaghan isn't one.

Reading some of the stuff on here makes me livid.

The consistent bagging of young guys trying to make their mark.

A guy like McClenaghan, a rare breed in NZ domestic cricket who has something that sets him apart from the rest. A guy who has pace, a guy who can hurry up even the most assured of international batsmen. Who may not hit the channel every time, but has something new to offer. Who isn't the 130km seamer who thrives in NZ conditions, then struggles on the international scene.

Yet nah, you want to bag him and class him as not a decent domestic seamer. Someone who doesn't look good on scorecards all the time that you look at on the internet, therefor is free to be bagged.

 

[Prince EWS]

Reading some of the stuff on here makes me livid.

The consistent bagging of young guys trying to make their mark.

A guy like McClenaghan, a rare breed in NZ domestic cricket who has something that sets him apart from the rest. A guy who has pace, a guy who can hurry up even the most assured of international batsmen. Who may not hit the channel every time, but has something new to offer. Who isn't the 130km seamer who thrives in NZ conditions, then struggles on the international scene.

Yet nah, you want to bag him and class him as not a decent domestic seamer. Someone who doesn't look good on scorecards all the time that you look at on the internet, therefor is free to be bagged.

What makes me livid is the consistent championing of players who haven't actually done anything but look like they might ahead of those who have proven themselves consistently. What make me livid is the huge bias that exists against older players, against successful bowlers who bowl below 140km/hr, and against players who have been consistently good in First Class cricket; something people wash their hands off in pursuit of pipe dreams.

I have nothing against McClenaghan at all - my gripe is with people rating players based on style (or age) ahead of substance before they've actually done anything. McClenaghan could in time prove himself to be a decent domestic seamer or even more than that - hell he could end up the next Wasim Akram for all I know; he has time on his side and I wish him the best of luck. But until he actually, you know, starts taking regular wickets at a decent average, I'll rate him at the standard I currently do. See, I actually rate players on what they've done and the results they produce; not what they clock on the speed gun, how excited the FBC gets when they watch them or what they might theoretically be able to do if they improve in several areas. In case you hadn't noticed, my posts about him are deliberately exaggerated to counteract the gross favouritism towards him and players like him by Howsie.

 

[Howsie]

A good example of two bowlers who have just started their test careers, Kemar Roach and Ravi Rampaul. Roach is a 21 year old inexperienced bowler with 55 first-class wickets at 33, Rampaul's been playing first-class cricket for eight years now and has picked up 112 wickets at 28.6. But, who's looked the most impressive in their international career?

I rate McClenaghan because he's the type of bowler that's most likely going to succeed at the international level, weather that's now or in the future. You don't pick up five wicket hauls against touring A teams if you're an average bowler, and you sure as heck don't have them jumping around and beating them for pace if you can't control your line in the process.

 

[Flem274*]

Oh joy this debate again.

What makes me livid is the consistent championing of players who haven't actually done anything but look like they might ahead of those who have proven themselves consistently. What make me livid is the huge bias that exists against older players, against successful bowlers who bowl below 140km/hr, and against players who have been consistently good in First Class cricket; something people wash their hands off in pursuit of pipe dreams.

I have nothing against McClenaghan at all - my gripe is with people rating players based on style (or age) ahead of substance before they've actually done anything. McClenaghan could in time prove himself to be a decent domestic seamer or even more than that - hell he could end up the next Wasim Akram for all I know; he has time on his side and I wish him the best of luck. But until he actually, you know, starts taking regular wickets at a decent average, I'll rate him at the standard I currently do. See, I actually rate players on what they've done and the results they produce; not what they clock on the speed gun, how excited the FBC gets when they watch them or what they might theoretically be able to do if they improve in several areas. In case you hadn't noticed, my posts about him are deliberately exaggerated to counteract the gross favouritism towards him and players like him by Howsie.

This.

A good example of two bowlers who have just started their test careers, Kemar Roach and Ravi Rampaul. Roach is a 21 year old inexperienced bowler with 55 first-class wickets at 33, Rampaul's been playing first-class cricket for eight years now and has picked up 112 wickets at 28.6. But, who's looked the most impressive in their international career?

Roach obviously. However the records are far more comparable than McClenaghan vs the top echelon of current NZ domestic seamers. Roach has also played longer and taken five wicket hauls. Thats a pick on potential I would actualy support, because he's shown more than flashes of brilliance.

I rate McClenaghan because he's the type of bowler that's most likely going to succeed at the international level, weather that's now or in the future. You don't pick up five wicket hauls against touring A teams if you're an average bowler, and you sure as heck don't have them jumping around and beating them for pace if you can't control your line in the process.

Well actualy average bowlers have done well for our A team in the past but yes I agree. McClenaghan rose to the occassion and I rate A team success higher than domestic success (after making sure they haven't picked Luke Wright to open or something silly). That performance shows that he has a chance. Ftr I expect him to start running through domestic line ups because he has the two elements of seam bowling that New Zealander's are appalling against:

A) Express pace

B) Left armer

The fact that he hasn't yet used these to his advantage bar one or two flashes is interesting but its only a matter of time before he exploits these rampant historical weaknesses.

In his defence there's the fact he has to bowl at Napier and Pukekura Park instead of the University Oval, Rangiora or Seddon Park. However Michael Mason and Ewen Thompson have coped with this and part of the reason I am so impressed with these two plus Daryl Tuffey and Lance Shaw is the fact they have to bowl on home pitches that are ridiculously flat with short boundaries yet they do well.

McClenaghan is more likely to succeed than Ewen Thompson if he builds on his A team success yes. At this point I'd pick Thompson.

I might go drag out some of those old posts McClenaghan made about his bowling. I found them quite interesting. The swing posting was pretty interesting.

 

[DIRK-NANNES]

At least McCleanaghan has done well when given a chance by New Zealand cricket to perform.

McClenaghan rose to the occassion and I rate A team success higher than domestic success (after making sure they haven't picked Luke Wright to open or something silly).

Just to clear some things, McClenaghan played two 2-day games for the Emerging Players and one 4-day game for NZ A.

Of the 5 Lions innings he bowled in, he had one obviously outstanding performance with the 5-fer @ 2.7 RPO. But the other performances weren't noteworthy, being expensive with 1-2 wickets.

He could become a Midge Johnson type, hurling down loads of poo and every 5 games or so pulling out a stellar spell.

Tour Match: New Zealand Emerging Players v England Lions at Lincoln, Feb 22-23, 2009 | Cricket Scorecard | Cricinfo.com
Tour Match: New Zealand Emerging Players v England Lions at Lincoln, Feb 25-26, 2009 | Cricket Scorecard | Cricinfo.com
1st unofficial Test: New Zealand A v England Lions at Queenstown, Mar 1-4, 2009 | Cricket Scorecard | Cricinfo.com

 

[NZTailender]

He could become a Midge Johnson type, hurling down loads of poo and every 5 games or so pulling out a stellar spell.

I hope he does become like Johnson, who has matured into a fine international bowler.

 

[NZ Guy]

Gillette Cup! Anyone following?

Silverstream fluking it into the finals and making Wellington look bad

The best performance, cant go past this beauty!

The stand out bowler from Palmerston North was Tim Richards who took three for three off 10 overs – of the three runs he conceded two were wides.

 

[Howsie]

Always hated the Gillette cup, especially when you played schools that raided your teams players. Impressive figures though.

 

[NZ Guy]

Always hated the Gillette cup, especially when you played schools that raided your teams players. Impressive figures though.

Bah! changing schools is clearly for educational purposes

 

[KiWiNiNjA]

Bhupinder Singh - is he an Indian Indian or a New Zealand Indian?

This guy?

 

[kingdamo]

Gillette Cup! Anyone following?

Silverstream fluking it into the finals and making Wellington look bad

The best performance, cant go past this beauty!

The stand out bowler from Palmerston North was Tim Richards who took three for three off 10 overs – of the three runs he conceded two were wides.

Goes to my school, good bloke. Definitely not the best we have in the team though.

 

[Somerset]

CANTERBURY WIZARDS
MHW Papps, RJ Nicol, PG Fulton, JG Myburgh, SL Stewart, CD McMillan, CZ Harris, CFK van Wyk (captain), C Frauenstein, RD Burson, LM Burtt

Now there's an interesting bowling line up for Canterbury. Has Bennett died? They used to love picking him even if he did poorly, now he's disappeared without an outing all summer.

Quoting a post from a few days ago, but I thought you'd be interested to know that Bennett's been named in Canterbury's squad of 12 to play Northern Districts in their first class match starting on Saturday.

 

[Howsie]

Finally, Williamson has been given a run at three. Only made 16 but he better stay there.

 

[Bahnz]

Bennett had a pre-season knee injury that was always going to keep him out of the first month of domestic cricket.

I think de Boorder should be batting higher for Auckland. He's been great so far this season and is now averaging on the right side of 40.

 

[Howsie]

God, Nethula bowls a crap load of no balls for a leggie.

 

[thierry henry]

Hey guys, spent the day watching JimmyGS today. I was actually watching my brother play and he was on the next field over (one of those situations where the boundary of one field is almost on the next pitch.)

Appeared to take a bag of wickets and bowl the opposition out for next to nothing, then made a few runs before being bowled trying to work one to leg.

Was gonna say hi but chickened out.

 

[Flem274*]

Hey guys, spent the day watching JimmyGS today. I was actually watching my brother play and he was on the next field over (one of those situations where the boundary of one field is almost on the next pitch.)

Appeared to take a bag of wickets and bowl the opposition out for next to nothing, then made a few runs before being bowled trying to work one to leg.

Was gonna say hi but chickened out.

Good work to Jimmy.

Man up TH