Great Dhoni

[SJS]

i am really getting tired of these thread about indian players. "great dhoni" lol. why are indian players treated like God by indians??? they are human beings !!

Because . . .

The Hindu pantheon has, in a famous example of hyperbole, over 330 million deities. In a sense India is God-intoxicated, there is god everywhere, in all things: within/without, above/below, in the six degrees of separation and in the three planes of existence.​

PS : We want to do our bit to take that number 330,000,000 to another level

 

[Precambrian]

He has a fair point though. I'm a massive Dhoni fan, firmly beleive he's the best ODI batsman in the world at the moment and a very fine skipper but the adulation he receives (mostly from Indians) is ridiculous, but typical of a country where top cricketers are treated like demi-gods.

Adulation ridiculous? You must be reading some English newspapers of these days and their over-the-top praise of the new captain after jus winning a test and 4 one dayers. Dhoni is a world cup captain and won a series down under within 6 months of being captain, and that's something to celebrate in a cricket crazy nation.

Adulation is fine, and calling god, is also ok, but things become ridiculous when there heroes fail. They burn effigy, and throw stones at these very 'gods' abodes. I find it extremely pathetic.

 

[honestbharani]

Because . . .

The Hindu pantheon has, in a famous example of hyperbole, over 330 million deities. In a sense India is God-intoxicated, there is god everywhere, in all things: within/without, above/below, in the six degrees of separation and in the three planes of existence.​

PS : We want to do our bit to take that number 330,000,000 to another level

With all due respect, SJS, I do think one of the best traits of Hinduism is precisely what you said... For the person who truly understands what HInduism is about, there is God in everywhere and everything.. There is God in trees, in animals, in poor people, in rich people, in rain, in the seas and oceans, in land, in sun, in moon, in the planets... EVERYWHERE.. It cultivates a honest respect for all of these things in us and makes us understand how small we are in the ultimate picture.. A pity that most people cant see it for what it is and that they only see the stories and miss the morals.. They forget the philosophy and the reason behind the stories.. Instead they concentrate on the stories alone and that is when trouble starts.. Anyways, that is for another thread..


And the whole worshipping of cricketers is simply because Indians, as a rule, do tend to vary between the extremes.. We still like the good old heros and villains rather than the grey area characters in between.. Hence the tendency to either worship and put down the cricketers so much......

 

[Precambrian]

No wonder erstwhile film stars find it so easy in politics in India.

Another thing is the absence of a sporting culture in India. We have cricket, which has transcended from being just sport to a part of our culture and identity, then there is daylight, and then other sports. A billion find their sporting aspirations met in cricket alone, since it being the only sport we excel somewhat in. Naturally, the stars of such a sport will get deified. It's more than a joke that 'The day Sachin scores a 100, the Gross National Happiness index gets multiplied manifold'. Strange, yet true.

 

[honestbharani]

No wonder erstwhile film stars find it so easy in politics in India.

Another thing is the absence of a sporting culture in India. We have cricket, which has transcended from being just sport to a part of our culture and identity, then there is daylight, and then other sports. A billion find their sporting aspirations met in cricket alone, since it being the only sport we excel somewhat in. Naturally, the stars of such a sport will get deified. It's more than a joke that 'The day Sachin scores a 100, the Gross National Happiness index gets multiplied manifold'. Strange, yet true.

Even more strange that the Gross National Happiness Index is more affected by Sachin scoring a century than by India winning a game........

 

[Precambrian]

Even more strange that the Gross National Happiness Index is more affected by Sachin scoring a century than by India winning a game........

Because it satisfies the perfect stereotypes of perceived notions of a tragic hero, who did everything he could, yet, who was 'betrayed' by his teammates. Yep, we Bollywoodify cricket.

Same the case with Lara also. I think he has a far bigger fan base in India than anywhere. Why? He also belonged to the same 'last man standing' subtype.

 

[SJS]

With all due respect, SJS, I do think one of the best traits of Hinduism is precisely what you said... For the person who truly understands what HInduism is about, there is God in everywhere and everything.. There is God in trees, in animals, in poor people, in rich people, in rain, in the seas and oceans, in land, in sun, in moon, in the planets... EVERYWHERE.. It cultivates a honest respect for all of these things in us and makes us understand how small we are in the ultimate picture.. A pity that most people cant see it for what it is and that they only see the stories and miss the morals.. They forget the philosophy and the reason behind the stories.. Instead they concentrate on the stories alone and that is when trouble starts.. Anyways, that is for another thread..


And the whole worshipping of cricketers is simply because Indians, as a rule, do tend to vary between the extremes.. We still like the good old heros and villains rather than the grey area characters in between.. Hence the tendency to either worship and put down the cricketers so much......

It was just said in fun and to lighten up this place HB

 

[honestbharani]

Because it satisfies the perfect stereotypes of perceived notions of a tragic hero, who did everything he could, yet, who was 'betrayed' by his teammates. Yep, we Bollywoodify cricket.

Same the case with Lara also. I think he has a far bigger fan base in India than anywhere. Why? He also belonged to the same 'last man standing' subtype.

yeah.. but with the Windies, it was no big deal coz we were more fans of Lara than the Windies team.. I just hope there are more fans of the Indian team than fans of any one player from the same team though..


I understand what you say but it also talks about how much we want to glorify any heros we have and esp. at what cost........

 

[Richard]

I was referring to Mike Brearley. He hardly justified his place due to his batting.

No, he didn't - he was 34 when he made his Test debut and 35 when he assumed the captaincy. Such cases are rarely if ever going to produce a particularly good player. Brearley is famous for more than just Ashes victories though, so that's why I presumed you were referring to Vaughan.

Brearley's case is one I've always been annoyed by - there's no disputing to me that he was England's finest ever captain. Yet there's also little dispute he should not have had the chance to be, as he shouldn't have been picked when he was (though he did have something of a case earlier in his career).

 

[Richard]

With all due respect, SJS, I do think one of the best traits of Hinduism is precisely what you said... For the person who truly understands what HInduism is about, there is God in everywhere and everything.. There is God in trees, in animals, in poor people, in rich people, in rain, in the seas and oceans, in land, in sun, in moon, in the planets... EVERYWHERE.. It cultivates a honest respect for all of these things in us and makes us understand how small we are in the ultimate picture.. A pity that most people cant see it for what it is and that they only see the stories and miss the morals.. They forget the philosophy and the reason behind the stories.. Instead they concentrate on the stories alone and that is when trouble starts.. Anyways, that is for another thread..

Maybe, but agree completely incidentally.

 

[Richard]

Adulation ridiculous? You must be reading some English newspapers of these days and their over-the-top praise of the new captain after jus winning a test and 4 one dayers.

Which writers are responsible here then?

 

[weldone]

I'm still to be convinced he's a better Test batsman than Karthik...

He has performed better than Karthik with the bat at every level (be it test, ODI, first class, t20 or list A)...

 

[Nishant]

Agreed, I'm for keeping Dhoni regardless of his batting.

true...but i rate dhoni very highly as a batsman these days as well...he has really improved his temperamnet frm the days when all he was was a slogger-sort of batsman. He plays accord to the situation and does ven better when under a little pressure due to captaincy. The way he played mendis in the SL tour was credible especially when all other batsmen, including the greats, didnt have a clue. truely rate him for that...he saved indias blushes and guided them to a historic series win.

 

[Uppercut]

Because . . .

The Hindu pantheon has, in a famous example of hyperbole, over 330 million deities. In a sense India is God-intoxicated, there is god everywhere, in all things: within/without, above/below, in the six degrees of separation and in the three planes of existence.​

PS : We want to do our bit to take that number 330,000,000 to another level

That's really interesting, it's something i never thought of. From here, the Indian attitude to their cricketers does seem completely wild and over-the-top. But then calling someone a god is blasphemous on this side of the planet, so it would do.

 

[SJS]

That's really interesting, it's something i never thought of. From here, the Indian attitude to their cricketers does seem completely wild and over-the-top. But then calling someone a god is blasphemous on this side of the planet, so it would do.

In India, besides the three MAIN Gods, and the 330,0000,000 others of various shapes and sizes, we also have people who HAVE to be treated as Gods.

Thus we have the tradition of "pati-parmeshwar' or Husband the supreme-God.

The Guest who is like God

Father who is to be treated like God.

The King who is "God on earth'

I am sure I could think of others but these are the most common

PS : Oh yes, the customer is God too.... we were always good traders

 

[Precambrian]

Which writers are responsible here then?

Just sample an article here by Stephen Brenkley in the Independent. Makes me wonder whether it was written by a pro or a fanboy.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-to-lead-england-to-promised-land-921607.html

In India, fans deify cricketers, but press usually never. Well, not since the Tendulkar heady days of late nineties.

 

[Richard]

He has performed better than Karthik with the bat at every level (be it test, ODI, first class, t20 or list A)...

Recently he has, yes. However there was a time when Karthik's First-Class record was notably better (his OD record never was and Karthik playing ODIs before Dhoni was beyond ludicrous) and perhaps I've hankered too long after hoping that these days will return.

 

[Precambrian]

A good article about M S Dhoni from Peter Roebuck

Dhoni plays it straight

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/current/story/377870.html

Excerpts :

Cricket comes easily to Dhoni because he was not overwhelmed by it. It was just the game he happened to play. Captaincy comes easily to him because he did not pursue it. He was born to lead but in his boyhood no one thought along those lines, or took themselves that seriously. After all, Dhoni and his pals were growing up in ignored Jharkhand, in forgotten Ranchi, surrounded by each other, making the best of things, laughing a lot, enjoying whatever thrills and spills life had to offer. He was not a boy struggling to break away from a restricting background, was not unhappy, had not been defeated. Always he has been able to focus on matters in hand - the next skylark, the next ball. Throw him at a wall and he will not break.

Dhoni's primary skill as leader lies in his ability to forge his side into a united force with one thought in mind. As India takes to the field, they form a huddle and he talks to them, mighty and meek, old and young, famous and obscure - none of it matters to him; all are treated the same, all are playing in a team. Players respond to him, trust him, and he does not let them down. When a paceman sends down rubbish he does not rant or rave or scowl but points out that "everyone has an off day". Judgment is left to the priests. Players like him because he does not make a fuss, or get flustered or back down or yet confront. Misfields, dropped catches and other mishaps may occur and he takes them in his stride. Because he has faith in himself, he is able to convey faith, and without any clapping or backslapping or other artifices. Because he fights so hard he is able to instill the same attitude in his charges. Because he works so hard with gloves and bat he is able to coax long stints from his pacemen and long innings from his batsmen. Ishant Sharma and Zaheer Khan have bowled entire sessions; Virender Sehwag has been willing to deliver lengthy spells.

 

[SJS]

Dhoni is improving his talent day by day.Will he sleeted for test team captain ?

Just great ?

I dont believe this.

Not the greatest of all time?

No?

Okay how about the greatest from the southern hemisphere ?

Okay lets say one of the greatest of all time.

Agreed?

Good

By the way, I had the greatest day of my life yesterday. My younger son, easily the greatest younger Indian son living in Chicago, called up. He told me he had found a new single malt which is undoubtedly the greatest single malt in the entire planet.

 

[Precambrian]

Just great ?

I dont believe this.

Not the greatest of all time?

No?

Okay how about the greatest from the southern hemisphere ?

Okay lets say one of the greatest of all time.

Agreed?

Good

By the way, I had the greatest day of my life yesterday. My younger son, easily the greatest younger Indian son living in Chicago, called up. He told me he had found a new single malt which is undoubtedly the greatest single malt in the entire planet.

Hows the malt?

BTW : A Small correction : Dhoni's from the Northern Hemisphere. Not that it really matters!