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Hayden calls Harbhajan an obnoxious weed

Bracken

U19 Debutant
I don't think that anything beats getting ur country into the final [of any tourney] and playing for it

Ur point is more like a solider saying that he doesn't want to fight coz the battle field is uncomfortable

cheers
My point is nothing of the sort. Comparing a soldier in battle with a sportsman playing a game is, while admittedly common, nothing more than a hokey cliche used by those without even the slightest sense of perspective.

They tried their best to win, and fell short. Nothing wrong with finding a silver lining in a dark cloud.
 

duffer

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I've wondered this recently... are you one such person? Had always presumed until recently that you were an Australian of Australian descent.
Yep, both my parents are Indian. I was born in Sydney and have lived there most of my life (living in Melbourne now)
 

silentstriker

The Wheel is Forever
As I said to Gelman, in the context he used it, I found his use of Sharma's accent personally offensive. And I don't give a **** about the multi-millionaire crybabies. So I don't ever find things that they say personally insulting. But that's just me and maybe I don't have a sense of humor. Anyway, I have nothing else to contribute for now.
 

ret

International Debutant
My point is nothing of the sort. Comparing a soldier in battle with a sportsman playing a game is, while admittedly common, nothing more than a hokey cliche used by those without even the slightest sense of perspective.

They tried their best to win, and fell short. Nothing wrong with finding a silver lining in a dark cloud.
why do u think SL players would be bothered by this?

Ranatunga, Murali, Jayasuriya have all gone through it and fought back .... I guess, it was the OZ tour by SL b4 the 1996 WC that pumped the SLans up

cheers
 

pasag

RTDAS
Yep, both my parents are Indian. I was born in Sydney and have lived there most of my life (living in Melbourne now)
I thought you supported Aus when India wasn't playing though? Anyways, congrats on choosing the better state.
 

duffer

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I thought you supported Aus when India wasn't playing though? Anyways, congrats on choosing the better state.
I used to. I was in the minority though (as far as curries go), but recent events have sort of turned me to the dark side.

Still love the Socceroos, Boomers and all our other sporting teams though. Just these cricketers give me the ****s.

And cheers, Melbourne is awesomeness.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
Have to say though that Hayden making fun of the Sharma's accent in that context is as racially insensitive and offensive as anything else that has allegedly been said during the course of this tour.
That's very true. Very disappointed in Haydos here.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Loved his imitation of Sharma's accent.8-)
Imitiating someone's accent in order to mock him can be considered racist. And I think Hayden is again let off lightly by CA ala Harbhajan. At least in Bhajji's case there was no evidence, but here there was an evidence.

It also makes Hayden a Hypocrite.
 

Bracken

U19 Debutant
why do u think SL players would be bothered by this?

Ranatunga, Murali, Jayasuriya have all gone through it and fought back .... I guess, it was the OZ tour by SL b4 the 1996 WC that pumped the SLans up

cheers
Read my original post.

"You know, if I was a Sri Lankan player, I would be down on my knees thanking whatever deity that they wish to pray to that I get to fly away and leave this ridiculous series behind them early. Getting away from this nonsense would be a far greater reward than being in the finals.

I wouldn't know (and couldn't care less) is they are bothered or not. *I* think that the behaviour on both sides has been petty and childish, and that the teams have done their level best to piss all over the notion of the sport being more important that the individuals involved. As such, if *I* was in the team (which is admittedly pretty unlikely, considering that I am neither Sri Lankan nor a very accomplished cricketer) I would take consolation from the fact that I was able to get the hell out and not associate myself with such a farce for any longer than necessary.
 

pasag

RTDAS
Imitiating someone's accent in order to mock him can be considered racist. And I think Hayden is again let off lightly by CA ala Harbhajan. At least in Bhajji's case there was no evidence, but here there was an evidence.

It also makes Hayden a Hypocrite.
It's an interesting topic as I was saying to Manan, when I go to America everyone makes fun of my accent and I wouldn't find it particularly offensive, (though it gets really old really quick) and I don't think anyone would particularly care if an Aussie made fun of a SA, English, Kiwi or American accent. But Asian accents seem to be a lot more taboo. I'll admit I found it distasteful, inappropriate and offensive as well, but I haven't figured out why it's different though, yet.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Nah its fairly common to make fun of the Indian accent here. Happens on television adverts, comedy shows etc.

Just seen not to be offensive. Making fun of an Asian accent, whilst still occuring fairly often, is seen to be more offensive and less acceptable.

So it comes down to what is acceptable in the culture/society and what is not.

Didn't people say that 'Monkey' is not considered a racial abuse in India and amond Indians ?
 

silentstriker

The Wheel is Forever
It's an interesting topic as I was saying to Manan, when I go to America everyone makes fun of my accent and I wouldn't find it particularly offensive, (though it gets really old really quick) and I don't think anyone would particularly care if an Aussie made fun of a SA, English, Kiwi or American accent. But Asian accents seem to be a lot more taboo. I'll admit I found it distasteful, inappropriate and offensive as well, but I haven't figured out why it's different though, yet.
Racism consists of power + privilege (otherwise, its at most bigotry). That's why if you're muslim/jewish in a very protestant country, or a white person in Zimbabwe, things can be taken with a different context.
 
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ret

International Debutant
Read my original post.

"You know, if I was a Sri Lankan player, I would be down on my knees thanking whatever deity that they wish to pray to that I get to fly away and leave this ridiculous series behind them early. Getting away from this nonsense would be a far greater reward than being in the finals.

I wouldn't know (and couldn't care less) is they are bothered or not. *I* think that the behaviour on both sides has been petty and childish, and that the teams have done their level best to piss all over the notion of the sport being more important that the individuals involved. As such, if *I* was in the team (which is admittedly pretty unlikely, considering that I am neither Sri Lankan nor a very accomplished cricketer) I would take consolation from the fact that I was able to get the hell out and not associate myself with such a farce for any longer than necessary.
I understand ur point but if I were a SL cricketer, i would be pretty upset for playing some ordinary cric and going home w/o playing in the final then worry abt off-field things that don't affect me directly and take consolation from it

Not even the Ind team which is involved in the off-field event gives these issues more importance than playing in the final

Ur logic could be applied to Ind and OZ players too, if they hadn't made it to the final. what i m trying to say is that I don't think that the SL team will agree with ur opinion

cheers
 

duffer

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
It's an interesting topic as I was saying to Manan, when I go to America everyone makes fun of my accent and I wouldn't find it particularly offensive, (though it gets really old really quick) and I don't think anyone would particularly care if an Aussie made fun of a SA, English, Kiwi or American accent. But Asian accents seem to be a lot more taboo. I'll admit I found it distasteful, inappropriate and offensive as well, but I haven't figured out why it's different though, yet.
Yeah but I'm sure you can see how there would be different implied connotations when a white person does it to an though can't you?

When I went to America last time my cousins made fun of my accent too, but it was done in a far more affectionate way than what people do when mocking an Indian accent. Or maybe I'm paranoid.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
When I went to America last time my cousins made fun of my accent too, but it was done in a far more affectionate way than what people do when mocking an Indian accent. .
Indeed. It really depends on the context. If it was said in a funny friendly way , it is fine, but If that friend/cousin rolled his eyes and then tried to mock you, then it will be deemed offensive.
 

ColdSnow

School Boy/Girl Captain
well if thats so then I retract my remark, but whether that is the case or not does not take away from the fact that calling Symonds a monkey is clearly a racial aggrivated comment, irrespective of any other potentially racist remarks made worldwide.
Yes, "bastard" is taken as a huge insult in India. It is taken literally, while the word "monkey" is used all the time.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
while the word "monkey" is used all the time.
hmm where thats true, there is a massive difference between saying, "you cheeky monkey" and "you filthy monkey", obviously there is a significant difference between the two.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
On the accents thing: context is everything. There's all sorts of circumstances when imitation isn't mockery at all, just being funny, sometimes even affectionate. Alistair McGowan (who I don't know whether or not is internationally famous, so maybe talking about someone only UK\Irish viewers will have a clue what I'm on about) as well as Bird, Bremner and Fortune (who I'm fairly sure are) are two examples of this. I'm not too bad myself - I've always done a mean SA accent and can take a decent stab at plenty of other places.

However, it appears fairly inescapable that, given we know there's bad blood between Hayden and Sharma, imitation will indeed be mockery. I don't accept that Australian (or Brit, or USAn, or wherever else) imitation of Asian accent is automatically a problem, though it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if there are indeed Australians who do it in a manner I'd deem unacceptible, ie which would be basically along the lines of the old Blackface "entertainers" - inferring inferiority while impersonating. I'll stress: I don't know for certain that there are, it's just the impression given to me by Jono, Dasa and duffer. It's a shame Manju has such a hatred of long posts, else his input here would be most interesting.

I would condemn Hayden because the imitation is done in an obviously condescending context (I'd say indisputable there because it'd be fairly futile to deny there is bad blood between him and Sharma), not automatically because he's an Australian imitating an Asian accent.
 

pasag

RTDAS
Yeah but I'm sure you can see how there would be different implied connotations when a white person does it to an though can't you?

When I went to America last time my cousins made fun of my accent too, but it was done in a far more affectionate way than what people do when mocking an Indian accent. Or maybe I'm paranoid.
Yeah as I said it doesn't sit well with me, but I'm not so sure of the absolute racial connotations, I might be way off the mark here but think it's all from 'Lolz, they sound different, let's imitate them' type thing. Perhaps since Aus + other anglo countries are closer it might be seen as more banterish type thing but with India, China it's seen as more insulting, dunno, this probably deserves its own thread.
 

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