***Official*** India in Australia

[Pratters]

Would be a good idea if a separate thread is created for this with posts moved in my opinion.

 

[pup11]

There are some reports that Harbhajan's remarks were racist in nature but the offspinner denied making such comments. "I haven't done anything - we were just talking. It wasn't even sledging - it was just normal talk out on the cricket field. I was concentrating on my batting," he told the Age. "I did not say anything racist. I do not know what is going on. I am here to play well for my country, to bowl well and to win this Test match.

"This is an important game for us and we have a chance to win - that's what I'm focused on." - CI.

If Harbhajan gets banned would he play any further part in this game, or whatever action that needs to be taken against him would take place after this test.
Anyways if Harbhajan had said something racist to Symonds he should have accepted it and apologised about it, by denying that he even said such a thing he is just making sure this thing turns into a huge controversy and now if he is found guilty then he should severely punished.
Since denying that he said anything racist to Symonds he is basically saying that Symonds is lying and he is cheat, would be interesting to see what Symonds has to say in reply.

 

[Bracken]

Agreed. If you're going to look at 'past offenses', you have to look at what Lehmann said. I thought he was banned from tests, but some are saying he was only banned from ODIs? Well, whatever punishment they gave Lehmann, they should give to Harbhajan. I thought Lehmann got off way too lightly for what he said tbh. If I said what he said at work, I'd be fired on the spot.

What Bhajji allegedly said is just as bad, so its hypocritical to be any less upset about his outburst than Lehmanns. If you don't realize that (Cevno), you're just being foolish.

Yep. Both Lehmann's case and Harbhajan's alleged case are as atrocious as each other. That said, I certainly wouldn't be calling for the exact same penalty regardless.

I don't know if the code (and the penalties that a breach would attract) has changed or not. Whether the potential penalty would be more or less severe than that given to Lehmann I have no idea, but as long as the allegation is heard and the code is applied, I'll be happy.

By the way, unless memory fails Lehmann was banned for six ODIs, which put him out of a game or two of the 2003 World Cup. How that sort of penalty would translate to Test matches, I have no idea. Apparently, the penalty for the alleged breach is 2-4 tests, or 4-8 ODIs.

 

[Turbinator]

What did Lehmann do?

EDIT: Hey Nishant I see your viewing this thread. Dude you're in first year medicine right? Can I catch you on msn, if you're not busy, had a few questions.

 

[silentstriker]

What did Lehmann do?

EDIT: Hey Nishant I see your viewing this thread. Dude you're in first year medicine right? Can I catch you on msn, if you're not busy, had a few questions.

SDN is your friend.

 

[Turbinator]

SDN is your friend.

Student Doctor Network? Yeah I am on there tbh, that and premed101, but it was just some specific questions I had for him, or else I could've just asked you .

Anyways, what did Lehmann do?

 

[Unattainableguy]

What did Lehmann do?

EDIT: Hey Nishant I see your viewing this thread. Dude you're in first year medicine right? Can I catch you on msn, if you're not busy, had a few questions.

You're in HS or doing your undergrad( UofT?)?

 

[Evermind]

I agree that it shouldn't happen, but Indians do call other Indians who are darker than them monkeys all the time. Would you consider that racist?

It's not racist, but it's an ignorant and stupid thing to do. India is full of such little prejudices, where fairness is valued above all else and paler people are generally considered to be more attractive - obviously it isn't racism because it's the same damn race.

The issue is that in India there is almost open racism towards black people. I don't think I'm exaggerating in this regard. India has not gone through what say America has gone through, and race relations and sensitivity there are of a completely different nature. In America, because of the tremendous history of racial tensions and cultural assimilation, there are laws in place and society understands and deals with race issues - India is totally different in that regard.

If Harbhajan was racist, there's no excusing it, but it's qualitatively and fundamentally different from a westerner being racist - it's not better, it's not worse, just very different, and I would think it's a lot less laced with issues of inferiority/hatred/genocide/etc. It's more of a puerile, childish, stupid thing, not as consciously malicious.

Australia really need to stop their stupid sledging. When are they going to understand the cultural differences at play here? Indians just don't say rude **** to each other on the field -there's no "mate culture" and "fishing trips" in India - they should understand that and refrain from it. Maybe it's something the English or the Black Caps would be more accepting of, but I'd definitely think the subcontinentals would not take it the same way. I'm not condoning Harbhajan's behaviour, but I can't help but think it was sadly inevitable.

 

[Turbinator]

You're in HS or doing your undergrad( UofT?)?

HS (gr 12), going to start undergrad later this year.

 

[Unattainableguy]

HS (gr 12), going to start undergrad later this year.

Same here. I'm having a hard time deciding whether to go to a less reputable university( for higher GPA) or UfT or Queen's. I hear everyone saying don't go to UfT for Life Science(harder marking, large classes, everyone wants to be a doctor ), and I always wanted to there since grade 9, so now I'm really confused.

 

[jeevan]

This is rich. I suppose now we need a whole bunch of rules on culturally accepted sledging. Something like:

Symonds (possibly repeatedly) : "Hey Harbhajan, you are a **** ."

Harbhahan: "Dude, I am trying to bat like I've never done and you are bothering me needlessly. I need to make you stop or go away so I can focus. The umpires are
not going to ask you to shut up because 'a little bit of fun is OK' per rules of the game.
Where I come from, I could just tell you to stop being a monkey. But I dont have good knowledge of world history to know what someone else's ancestors did to your ancestors which would cause you terrible emotional distress.

Let me consult the match referee on what would be an ICC accepted synonym."

The question I have is, this will take 5 or 10 minutes to resolve. Does that come out of
the bowling sides over rate fine or the batting sides over rate fine?

ps From what I can piece together, what happened was:

Symonds: "Hey Harbhajan, you are a **** ."
Harbhajan "Please stop monkeying around with me."

 

[Turbinator]

Same here. I'm having a hard time deciding whether to go to a less reputable university( for higher GPA) or UfT or Queen's. I hear everyone saying don't go to UfT for Life Science(harder marking, large classes, everyone wants to be a doctor ), and I always wanted to there since grade 9, so now I'm really confused.

Nah man do yourself a huge favour and don't go UofT. Whatever you've heard, is all true. The thing is, UofT generally accepts almost everyone that applies, they take in over a 1000 students and then "weed" out the unfit for 2nd year. But obviously the fact remains, if you can't survive first year UofT, no way you'll get by in med school. But then again, you want to be as competent as possible, especially these days when almost every single kid coming out of high school wants to be a doctor. Going to a less reputable Uni is a much smarter choice (higher GPA), despite their being less research spots, because Med school's don't care which Uni you did your undergrad at.

 

[Bracken]

Student Doctor Network? Yeah I am on there tbh, that and premed101, but it was just some specific questions I had for him, or else I could've just asked you .

Anyways, what did Lehmann do?

Back in 2003 (I think- could have been late 2002) Lehmann was in the ODI team playing Sri Lanka in the Australian Tri-Series when he was run out. When he entered the Australian dressing room, he apparently yelled out "black (insert colourful profanity literally translated as ******s)". In his autobiography, his explanation was that he was inside the rooms, and didn't think that he would be heard outside of the rooms. He also accepted that his words were atrocious (and didn't challenge the punishment), apologised to all and sundry, and pleaded that it was essentially a momentary brain fart that didn't reflect the content of his character.

Needless to say, he WAS heard outside the rooms, most notably in the Sri Lankan rooms.

At the time of the offence, he went into the Sri Lankan rooms to apologise, and the ICC official (I'm pretty sure it was Clive Lloyd) decided that as the apology was accepted by the Sri Lankans, the matter would be laid to rest without any further sanction.

The story then hit the media, and Malcolm Speed stepped in and instructed Lloyd to convene a hearing, at which Lehmann was found guilty and banned from 6 ODIs.

The extended fallout of this was the incident shortly afterwards between Latif and Gilchrist at the World Cup, when Gilchrist claimed that Latif called him the same thing, with "white" substituting for "black". On that occasion, Latif denied the charge, and it was dismissed as there was no supporting evidence.

Apparently (and again, this is from Lehmann's book) Lehmann asked Gilchrist if he was sure that he wanted to pursue the matter, and Gilchrist's response was along the lines of "you can't say that, so he shouldn't be allowed to either."

As far as my memory goes, that's pretty much the story.

 

[Unattainableguy]

Nah man do yourself a huge favour and don't go UofT. Whatever you've heard, is all true. The thing is, UofT generally accepts almost everyone that applies, they take in over a 1000 students and then "weed" out the unfit for 2nd year. But obviously the fact remains, if you can't survive first year UofT, no way you'll get by in med school. But then again, you want to be as competent as possible, especially these days when almost every single kid coming out of high school wants to be a doctor. Going to a less reputable Uni is a much smarter choice (higher GPA), despite their being less research spots, because Med school's don't care which Uni you did your undergrad at.

Yeah, you're right. I put UofT as my #2 choice( after Health Sciences at Mac ), but I'm sure after hearing all the horror stories, I'm gonna go to York in case I don't get into McMaster Health Sciences which is highly likely seeing how everyone making the cut-off has like 5-10% chance. Maybe I might consider UWO, but I want to stay in Toronto, so likely York.

 

[Turbinator]

Back in 2003 (I think- could have been late 2002) Lehmann was in the ODI team playing Sri Lanka in the Australian Tri-Series when he was run out. When he entered the Australian dressing room, he apparently yelled out "black (insert colourful profanity literally translated as ******s)". In his autobiography, his explanation was that he was inside the rooms, and didn't think that he would be heard outside of the rooms. He also accepted that his words were atrocious (and didn't challenge the punishment), apologised to all and sundry, and pleaded that it was essentially a momentary brain fart that didn't reflect the content of his character.

Needless to say, he WAS heard outside the rooms, most notably in the Sri Lankan rooms.

At the time of the offence, he went into the Sri Lankan rooms to apologise, and the ICC official (I'm pretty sure it was Clive Lloyd) decided that as the apology was accepted by the Sri Lankans, the matter would be laid to rest without any further sanction.

The story then hit the media, and Malcolm Speed stepped in and instructed Lloyd to convene a hearing, at which Lehmann was found guilty and banned from 6 ODIs.

The extended fallout of this was the incident shortly afterwards between Latif and Gilchrist at the World Cup, when Gilchrist claimed that Latif called him the same thing, with "white" substituting for "black". On that occasion, Latif denied the charge, and it was dismissed as there was no supporting evidence.

Apparently (and again, this is from Lehmann's book) Lehmann asked Gilchrist if he was sure that he wanted to pursue the matter, and Gilchrist's response was along the lines of "you can't say that, so he shouldn't be allowed to either."

As far as my memory goes, that's pretty much the story.

Ahh I see, interesting. Thanks.

 

[Turbinator]

Yeah, you're right. I put UofT as my #2 choice( after Health Sciences at Mac ), but I'm sure after hearing all the horror stories, I'm gonna go to York in case I don't get into McMaster Health Sciences which is highly likely seeing how everyone making the cut-off has like 5-10% chance. Maybe I might consider UWO, but I want to stay in Toronto, so likely York.

Yes I am considering YorkU too as one of my options (best place to rack a good GPA). So I guess I might see you there next year.

The thing with Mac Health Sci is, as long as you have that 90 percent average in your top six courses, they move on to the supplementary info form. And if you have an extensive list of extra circ., you will make it. In other words, they'll take a 92-93 all rounded student over a 98-99 not so rounded one. But yeah even if I get accepted to Mac Health Sci, I think I'll go ahead with YorkU.

 

[Unattainableguy]

Yes I am considering YorkU too as one of my options (best place to rack a good GPA). So I guess I might see you there next year.

The thing with Mac Health Sci is, as long as you have that 90 percent average in your top six courses, they move on to the supplementary info form. And if you have an extensive list of extra circ., you will make it. In other words, they'll take a 92-93 all rounded student over a 98-99 not so rounded one. But yeah even if I get accepted to Mac Health Sci, I think I'll go ahead with YorkU.

They don't ask for extracurricular activities, just 3 questions you have to answer so I'm kind of happy because I only volunteered once at a hospital( but lots of hours like 300), and for answers, I guess you have to come up with something creative, experiences etc. I'm sure I will 80% likely go there if I get in( because how >50-70% graduates get into med school) , but I would consider York also cuz they give you $10,000 entrance scholarship(90-94%) and also some bursaries and how I have to stay in Toronto.

 

[Agent TBY]

Gtfo.

 

[Unattainableguy]

Gtfo.

 

[Turbinator]

They don't ask for extracurricular activities, just 3 questions you have to answer so I'm kind of happy because I only volunteered once at a hospital( but lots of hours like 300), and for answers, I guess you have to come up with something creative, experiences etc. I'm sure I will 80% likely go there if I get in( because how >50-70% graduates get into med school) , but I would consider York also cuz they give you $10,000 entrance scholarship(90-94%) and also some bursaries and how I have to stay in Toronto.

Oh really, yeah I haven't filled out their supp form yet, actually I haven't even applied to the Unis yet, will do tonight. Yeah YorkU gives a lot in scholarships. Btw, you have msn bro?