nz man4man better than australia

[FaaipDeOiad]

Conditions are not seaming. Do you actually know what "seam" is? We have the seen the ball swing with Martin, Astle and Franklin bowling, but none of them have seamed the ball.

I've already discussed this in the other thread. Watch the game more closely, the ball was seaming around plenty in the first session.

Furthermore, referring to conditions as "seaming" does not refer only to actual seam movement off the wicket, but generally to "conditions conducive to seam bowling", meaning that it also refers to instances of dramatic movement in the air.

 

[Ming]

Seam bowling and swing bowling are entirely different.

I did watch the game closely. Don't you think it's funny that none of Cairns, Crowe, Slater, Coney, Smith, or even Waddle on Radio Sport said it was seaming?

It did not move off the deck the ball, it SWUNG in the air. Martin and Franklin are more swing bowlers while O'Brien is more of a seam bowler, looking for movement off the deck.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Seam bowling and swing bowling are entirely different.

Yes, I am aware. That doesn't mean that a) conditions where the ball is swinging around a great deal and therefore giving assistance to seamers are not referred to as "seaming" conditions or that b) conditions conducive to swing bowling cannot ALSO be conducive to the ball seaming - they are not mutually exclusve.

I did watch the game closely. Don't you think it's funny that none of Cairns, Crowe, Slater, Coney, Smith, or even Waddle on Radio Sport said it was seaming?

It did not move off the deck the ball, it SWUNG in the air. Martin and Franklin are more swing bowlers while O'Brien is more of a seam bowler, looking for movement off the deck.

Funny that you mention the commentators, when Martin Crowe just spoke a moment ago about the pitch "having a bit of moisture in it""and "seaming around". And I am aware that Martin is primarily a swing bowler, that doesn't mean he is incapable of getting movement off the seam.

 

[Zinzan]

the credibility is shown by his performances on seamer friendly wickets, you have to get rid of the notion that whatever the cricket fans, players etc say is right. decide for yourself, based on his record has he done anything to suggest that hes even remotely good on seamer friendly wickets?

If I always agreed with what other cricket fans thought and said, i'd think Flintoff was an all time great ....and I certainly don't think that.

It's just in this instance, what others think just confirms my belief that Hayden doesn't have a particularly "big" weakness on seaming tracks....No more than most other top batsmen anyway.

As I stated many times before, Your statistical evidence was paper thin.

If you actually put something conclusive evidence together, that would be different. Just stating 7-8 innings out of over 100 wouldn't convince a child.

 

[Zinzan]

Seam bowling and swing bowling are entirely different.

I did watch the game closely. Don't you think it's funny that none of Cairns, Crowe, Slater, Coney, Smith, or even Waddle on Radio Sport said it was seaming?

It did not move off the deck the ball, it SWUNG in the air. Martin and Franklin are more swing bowlers while O'Brien is more of a seam bowler, looking for movement off the deck.

Its not always black and white. Some pitches seam for an hour, some seam for days, some seam a lot early on and then just seam a little. Some seam a lot early and then don't seam at all. It's all very subjective

 

[tooextracool]

By the way, he's playing in what is undeniably seaming conditions now. Are you watching it?

nope theres a major difference between seaming and swinging, as someone already stated the conditions offered swing for the bowlers not seam, the pitch was as flat as you can imagine. even the swing lasted only for about 10 overs really, after which it got considerably easier to bat on.

 

[tooextracool]

If I always agreed with what other cricket fans thought and said, i'd think Flintoff was an all time great ....and I certainly don't think that.

only a select few actually think that, the vast majority of the people are far more cautious about doing anything of the sort.

It's just in this instance, what others think just confirms my belief that Hayden doesn't have a particularly "big" weakness on seaming tracks....No more than most other top batsmen anyway.

As I stated many times before, Your statistical evidence was paper thin.

If you actually put something conclusive evidence together, that would be different. Just stating 7-8 innings out of over 100 wouldn't convince a child.

it was actually 13%. regardless ive actually watched him and seen him look at all at sea on seamer friendly tracks at the intl level, and hopefully we'll get to see him on a seamer friendly wicket more often.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

nope theres a major difference between seaming and swinging, as someone already stated the conditions offered swing for the bowlers not seam, the pitch was as flat as you can imagine. even the swing lasted only for about 10 overs really, after which it got considerably easier to bat on.

The swing lasted all the way to lunch, and was sporadic for a while after that. It doesn't alter the fact that you have claimed in the past that Hayden can't handle the ball moving away from him, when he clearly did exactly that just yesterday.

 

[social]

nope theres a major difference between seaming and swinging, as someone already stated the conditions offered swing for the bowlers not seam, the pitch was as flat as you can imagine. even the swing lasted only for about 10 overs really, after which it got considerably easier to bat on.

No, the Kiwis just bowled poorly in favourable conditions.

Hayden played well - get over it!

 

[tooextracool]

The swing lasted all the way to lunch, and was sporadic for a while after that. It doesn't alter the fact that you have claimed in the past that Hayden can't handle the ball moving away from him, when he clearly did exactly that just yesterday.

it moved about for 10- 15 overs or so, in which he looked absolutely clueless for most of it, with the huge number of plays and misses and what not.

 

[tooextracool]

No, the Kiwis just bowled poorly in favourable conditions.

Hayden played well - get over it!

yes they bowled poorly further adding to how hayden survived those first few overs, and hayden certainly looked far from comfortable in that innings.

 

[Richard]

Agree with most of those except if I had to I would take McCullum over Hussey.

I just HAD to dig this up for this-'un!

 

[Fiery]

I just HAD to dig this up for this-'un!

OMG, you really are an asshole. I offer to send you my own copy of Nathan Astle's DVD halfway across the world out of the goodness of my heart and you respond by digging up an old thread from 2 years ago, (when Hussey was a nobody on the international stage I might add), to make me look like a fool. I was prepared to give your personality outside of this forum the benefit of the doubt but you have proven that you are really just a pommie git. This is now officially war Richard

 

[Richard]

Sorry mayn, just couldn't resist.

Should have had more of a heart given your recent kind offer, I know.

 

[Fiery]

You'll keep

 

[Francis]

Thats true. Because you are our Big Brother and we aspire to be a great sporting nation like you guys.

I think every New Zealander should be thankful they have rugby where they rock... except when they play South Africa...

HAIL SOUTH AFRICA~!

 

[Fiery]

I think every New Zealander should be thankful they have rugby where they rock... except when they play South Africa...

HAIL SOUTH AFRICA~!

See you in the final in October brother

 

[nibbs]

I still stand by this for the record

 

[Flem274*]

This is a great thread. So sad its an old one though i hope bond21 and SST get their chance to contribute.

I suspect Aussie would be interested in Mills, Oram (as an allrounder he's one of the better ones atm), Vettori, McCullum is current one day form, Taylor for the future, Ryder for the booze and *shock horror* Jamie How's one day record is pretty darn good atm.

Not all would make it however. All the red/hot blooded Aussies on the board will probably say they'd have none and thats fine, we'll keep em.

 

[Richard]

So... who else is out there who can bowl anywhere near the required standard in ODIs? Because one thing for sure - Tuffey and Mills can't.

Daym - on the Mills count.

He certainly can now.