nz man4man better than australia

[MoxPearl]

Thats true. Because you are our Big Brother and we aspire to be a great sporting nation like you guys.

i really hope your being sarcastic

 

[Fiery]

Yet - his record is better than almost anyone who's played for NZ in the last decade - except Gavin Larsen of course.
It simply seems to me that people refuse to accept someone so unorthodox can be anywhere near as good as he actually is.
Tuffey's been good of times, yes, but I've always considered him exceptionally overrated in ODIs - and his domestic record ain't flash, either.

He has a record that's mainly due to his time in the game. He has done a good job in the middle overs for the past 10 or 12 years and has a good economy rate. As far as his batting goes, he has saved us from total embarrassment many times with the bat (usually in losing causes) has been prone to playing too conservatively sometimes, hence the large number of not outs which inflates his batting average like Michael Bevan and to wasting far too many balls at the start of his innings when he invariably scratches around thrusting his pad at the ball or playing across the line and getting hit on the pad. There are plenty of better players in NZ who can do the middle overs job like Vettori, Styris, Astle, etc so Harry has become a bit obsolete really.
Don't get me wrong, I like the guy and have enjoyed his career, especially the run-outs and superb catches but he's had his time now.

 

[benchmark00]

the results are gonna start coming any day now i reckon

New zealand better thatn australia man for man is such an outrageous comment and totally unbackable by logical facts...

If we take both teams from last game in their batting positions:

Gilchrist Vs Flemming... have to go with gilly
Hayden Vs Astle... very close, but hayden
Ponting Vs Sinclair... i wonder...
Martyn Vs Marshall... this would be close, but on batting levels alone, marto any day of the week, but if fielding comes into it then could go either way.
Symonds Vs McMillan... Symonds by a long way
Clarke Vs Cairns... Cairns, one of the best alrounders still
Hussey Vs McCullum... Hussey for me
Hogg Vs Vettori... Vettori by a fair bit
Lee Vs Wilson... Lee by a loooong way
Gillespie Vs Mills.... Dizzy by a looong way
Mcgrath Vs Tuffey.... no contest

 

[Fiery]

New zealand better thatn australia man for man is such an outrageous comment and totally unbackable by logical facts...

If we take both teams from last game in their batting positions:

Gilchrist Vs Flemming... have to go with gilly
Hayden Vs Astle... very close, but hayden
Ponting Vs Sinclair... i wonder...
Martyn Vs Marshall... this would be close, but on batting levels alone, marto any day of the week, but if fielding comes into it then could go either way.
Symonds Vs McMillan... Symonds by a long way
Clarke Vs Cairns... Cairns, one of the best alrounders still
Hussey Vs McCullum... Hussey for me
Hogg Vs Vettori... Vettori by a fair bit
Lee Vs Wilson... Lee by a loooong way
Gillespie Vs Mills.... Dizzy by a looong way
Mcgrath Vs Tuffey.... no contest

Agree with most of those except if I had to I would take McCullum over Hussey.

PS. I hate sounding like a spelling nazi but could people stop spelling Fleming with 2 mm's. It's mainly you bloody Aussies. I find it annoying and disrespectful. ( to fellow kiwis)

 

[cbuts]

hayden V astle=very clsoe, wtf wat planet areyou from. perhaps 2 or 3 years ago it may have been close. but at the mo, astle must be very clsoe to getting the axe. id take flem over hayden.

 

[Fiery]

hayden V astle=very clsoe, wtf wat planet areyou from. perhaps 2 or 3 years ago it may have been close. but at the mo, astle must be very clsoe to getting the axe. id take flem over hayden.

Easy tiger. Fair call from benchmark00 I thought.

 

[JASON]

Australia may be better man for man but on any given day if everything clicks NZ is quite capable of turning the tables on Australia, particularly in an ODI.

In 4-5 years time when the Aussie senior brigade's retirements have come to pass, (particularly McGrath, Warne, Kaspar, Gilly, Gillespie etc.) the then NZ team may have its best crack at beating the Aussies in both versions of the game.

But whether the NZ replacements coming through particularly in the bowling front can match the Aussies will determine the outcome at such time.

 

[_Ed_]

I agree with most of benchmark's comparisons, except I would have to disagree with this one:

Hussey Vs McCullum... Hussey for me

I would rate McCullum higher, but that's just my opinion.

 

[Somerset]

New zealand better thatn australia man for man is such an outrageous comment and totally unbackable by logical facts...

If we take both teams from last game in their batting positions:

Gilchrist Vs Flemming... have to go with gilly
Hayden Vs Astle... very close, but hayden
Ponting Vs Sinclair... i wonder...
Martyn Vs Marshall... this would be close, but on batting levels alone, marto any day of the week, but if fielding comes into it then could go either way.
Symonds Vs McMillan... Symonds by a long way
Clarke Vs Cairns... Cairns, one of the best alrounders still
Hussey Vs McCullum... Hussey for me
Hogg Vs Vettori... Vettori by a fair bit
Lee Vs Wilson... Lee by a loooong way
Gillespie Vs Mills.... Dizzy by a looong way
Mcgrath Vs Tuffey.... no contest

I agree with the majority of the side, with the exception being Chris Cairns. Michael Hussey's a decent player and would certainly earn a spot over Brendan McCullum but if the best XI between the two nations is selected, I would go with Cairns at seven, where I feel he is best suited anyway.

 

[Somerset]

I agree with most of benchmark's comparisons, except I would have to disagree with this one:

I would rate McCullum higher, but that's just my opinion.

Considering Gilchrist would easily make the side, two wicket-keepers wouldn't be necessary...

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

I think a better way to do it would be to pick a composite side from the two squads, which for me would be:

Gilchrist
Fleming
Ponting
Martyn
Symonds
Clarke
Cairns
Vettori
Lee
Gillespie
McGrath

Hayden a bit unlucky to miss out given his performances so far in the series, but the rest of it is pretty straightforward in my view. I can't see any other New Zealand player who would even come close to making this side.

 

[Fiery]

I think a better way to do it would be to pick a composite side from the two squads, which for me would be:

Gilchrist
Fleming
Ponting
Martyn
Symonds
Clarke
Cairns
Vettori
Lee
Gillespie
McGrath

Hayden a bit unlucky to miss out given his performances so far in the series, but the rest of it is pretty straightforward in my view. I can't see any other New Zealand player who would even come close to making this side.

Astle would have to come close as would Marshall. A fully fit NZ side might have 5 players in the 11 if you include Bond who's better than Lee and Oram who I would have instead of Gillespie

 

[Top_Cat]

Hayden a bit unlucky to miss out given his performances so far in the series

How about the rest of his career?

Oram who I would have instead of Gillespie

That's hilarious! I actually agreed with you on all of your selections until this point. Surely you don't rate Oram the better bowler and including him is more for the allrounder's role because he's a far better bat?

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Astle would have to come close as would Marshall. A fully fit NZ side might have 5 players in the 11 if you include Bond who's better than Lee and Oram who I would have instead of Gillespie

The only person Astle could possibly replace would be Fleming, and I rate Fleming much higher. Bond is neither here nor there as he hasn't played any cricket for a couple of years, and I can't see how anyone could justify replacing Gillespie with Oram, batting ability aside. Gillespie is 10 times the bowler, and that's what he's in the team for.

 

[Ming]

Harris, a has-been?
His record hasn't denegrated much recently as I've noticed - particularly his bowling (and I'd pick him as a bowler alone - far better than Tuffey and Mills)
It's not surprising he's currently struggling to get in, given that he's injured.

Harris has only averaged 19 in his past 25 matches with the ball, and 60 with the ball. Those figures are absolutely rubbish.

 

[Fiery]

How about the rest of his career?



That's hilarious! I actually agreed with you on all of your selections until this point. Surely you don't rate Oram the better bowler and including him is more for the allrounder's role because he's a far better bat?

If the current ODI rankings are anything to go by where Gillespie is 5 and Oram is 7 there's not much in it really. I'll admit that he's a better bowler but Oram's batting is a damn sight better than Gillespie's which tipped the scales in his favour for mine. (There's an Aussieism for ya, sound like Peter Sterling, eh?) Not quite as "hilarious" as you seem to think.

 

[Somerset]

Harris has only averaged 19 in his past 25 matches with the ball, and 60 with the ball. Those figures are absolutely rubbish.

He's a great competitor and the fans love him but I tend to agree that his form at international level hasn't been up to scratch over the past two-three years. It would be a shame if he never made into back to the side though, after all he's given New Zealand cricket over the years.

 

[Somerset]

The only person Astle could possibly replace would be Fleming, and I rate Fleming much higher. Bond is neither here nor there as he hasn't played any cricket for a couple of years, and I can't see how anyone could justify replacing Gillespie with Oram, batting ability aside. Gillespie is 10 times the bowler, and that's what he's in the team for.

I would select Hayden, Fleming and of course Gilchrist before Astle for the opening spot and considering Astle has been at the top of the order for the majority of his career, I struggle to see how he's to find a place in the combined side.

I would also pick Gillespie over Oram on most occasions but Oram is still improving as a genuine all-rounder and if it weren't for Cairns, would gain a spot in the side easily.

 

[Top_Cat]

If the current ODI rankings are anything to go by where Gillespie is 5 and Oram is 7 there's not much in it really.

Come on, man. Who's been in the top 10 for more of hs career? Gillespie is going to be considered one of Australia's best bowlers of the late 90's and 00's whereas Oram is having a great season with the ball. On pure bowling alone, they are just not comparable. Same goes with the batting but in the opposite direction.

There's an Aussieism for ya, sound like Peter Sterling, eh?

I'm from Adelaide; don't knwo Peter Sterling all that well so I'll have to take your word for it.

 

[marc71178]

Perish the thought, nationality is relevant to analytical ability.

Perish the thought that watching the players is relevant to analytical ability.