You were WRONG on the Polls !

[marc71178]

6. Kumble by me is perhaps the most OVERRATED cricketer in the world.

Agreed but wrong thread!

But I add the clause "Away from home"

 

[Anil]

1. SA practically is better than SL and all past records & future records will prove it.

Ceo, do please read my post before coming up with arguments. I specifically mentioned "this tournament", "recent performances" and backed that with some stats(again recent). Do these words mean anything to you? Also, I know that SA's overall performance is better than SL's. That was never under contention.

2. SL like India has heaps of talent but lack killer instinct

Probably true. Do you mean that they are chokers? SA has as big a reputation as any other team for choking in crucial matches.

3. SA HAS TO BE on par with Aus. & their unconvincing win over WI can be compared to how Brazil started a tournament- SA do not have a Tendulkar or Murli or Warne, they're mechanical & as they progress they improve. Every motorbike machine needs some smooth pickup before it can get going.

No team is on par with Aus right now. Are you comparing Brazil in football with SA in cricket? That has to be the wierdest comparison ever. The latter part is more believable. They are largely a mechanical team although they do have a few players with some flair and dynamism and they might improve as the tournament progresses.

4. I agree with Warrior & so would most of us, the Newcomers in the Indian team did more than what a psychiatrist would, and if they continue to have those 3-5 guys, they'll remain a World-beater.

I don't know about world beaters, but they will be a team to reckon with.

5. Considering the Natwest final between Eng//Ind. it seems both are World-beaters.
And both have their trumps in just the batting dept.

Again world beaters is not a term which can be assigned to either England or India right now. Totally agree with the last bit.

6. Kumble by me is perhaps the most OVERRATED cricketer in the world.

Kumble has certainly been overrated, I don't know whether he is the most overrated though. There are several more deserving candidates for that post and they are even now being discussed in another thread.

 

[ceo]

Ceo, do please read my post before coming up with arguments. I specifically mentioned "this tournament", "recent performances" and backed that with some stats(again recent). Do these words mean anything to you? Also, I know that SA's overall performance is better than SL's. That was never under contention.

Anil, I was never putting up an argument to your post. I do not even know what you said specifically.
My post was just a number of summarised points, all my opinions as comments, not directed to any particular person, unless named.
It was keeping with the topic and giving my take on how I feel some teams compare.

You maybe 100% right in what you said.
I just never did reply to anything you said in particular yet.

 

[Anil]

Anil, I was never putting up an argument to your post. I do not even know what you said specifically.
My post was just a number of summarised points, all my opinions as comments, not directed to any particular person, unless named.
It was keeping with the topic and giving my take on how I feel some teams compare.

You maybe 100% right in what you said.
I just never did reply to anything you said in particular yet.

You didn't name me, but you definitely quoted me, the first 3 points you mentioned were directly countering my post, so how was I to know that you weren't replying to me?

[Edited on 9/18/02 by anilramavarma]

 

[marc71178]

Probably true. Do you mean that they are chokers? SA has as big a reputation as any other team for choking in crucial matches.

Except of course the World Cup Semi Final in 1992 when we all know they were all but certain to win until the rains fell!

When I used the SA choking argument it was shouted down.

 

[Anil]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Probably true. Do you mean that they are chokers? SA has as big a reputation as any other team for choking in crucial matches.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Except of course the World Cup Semi Final in 1992 when we all know they were all but certain to win until the rains fell!

When I used the SA choking argument it was shouted down.

When did you use that argument? to prove what? that SA wouldn't have won even if it hadn't rained? I don't think they had acquired that reputation at that time. In any case, being chokers doesn't mean that you never win anything. Classic example, high quality chokers like India(choked in 9 consecutive finals) pulled it off that too under extreme pressure against England in the Natwest final. So, even chokers have their day in the sun.

I was responding to Ceo's suggestion that Lankans lack killer instinct. I took it to mean that he was saying they choke in tough and crucial matches. Atleast that's one end result of lacking killer instinct. My point was that SA had just as bad a reputation when it comes to choking. You are trying to twist something totally out-of-context to suit your argument and it won't work.

[Edited on 9/18/02 by anilramavarma]

 

[marc71178]

When did you use that argument? to prove what?

To suggest that I felt it was likely they wouldn't have scored the runs had it not rained.

If they didn't have that moniker then it was because they were very inexperienced in ODI's, so weren't used to the pressure, and so that is another reason why I don't think they'd have done it!

 

[lankadesilva]

[

So the fact that England outplayed the opposition can be discounted then - I notice you ignored my comments regarding India - 4 out of 9 suggests they are far more closely matched than you'll give credit for.

IMO there is a group containing all but Aus, SA and Bangladesh where all nations can beat each other depending largely on luck on the day.

The gap seems to be getting WIDER.!

 

[marc71178]

It is still 4 wins for England out of the last 9 results - so the stats haven't changed.

When will you learn

Swallow<>Summer

 

[lankadesilva]

Originally posted by marc71178
It is still 4 wins for England out of the last 9 results - so the stats haven't changed.

When will you learn

Swallow<>Summer

Its time for u to learn buddy, to learn that stats doesn't tell the whole picture.The manner in which England have lost the last two onedayers, doesn't it reflects India's superiority?

England couldn't even make a match out of it, its a sad state of affair, soon England will be bracketed with teams like Bang,Zimb and Kenya

 

[luckyeddie]

Its time for u to learn buddy, to learn that stats doesn't tell the whole picture.The manner in which England have lost the last two onedayers, doesn't it reflects India's superiority?

I agree with this bit (albeit with one or two reservations).
However.....

England couldn't even make a match out of it, its a sad state of affair, soon England will be bracketed with teams like Bang,Zimb and Kenya

sorry, that's just plain silly.

Ah well, one out of two.

[Edited on 23/9/2002 by luckyeddie]

 

[aussie_beater]

Originally posted by marc71178
It is still 4 wins for England out of the last 9 results - so the stats haven't changed.

When will you learn

Swallow<>Summer

Actually its 4 wins for England in the last 10 results.So the stats have changed.

 

[marc71178]

It is still 4 wins to England, 5 to India and 1 rained off.

I used that to point out that had England won (which we all know they didn't) they would have gone ahead of India 5-4 from the past 10 games.

 

[aussie_beater]

Originally posted by marc71178
It is still 4 wins to England, 5 to India and 1 rained off.

I used that to point out that had England won (which we all know they didn't) they would have gone ahead of India 5-4 from the past 10 games.

10 matches have produced results in the not so distant future between the two teams....6 went to India and 4 to England, correct ? One got rained off and so we can forget about that.

 

[BengalCat]

England should throw out bowlers like Cork and Hoggard from onedayer team



[Edited on 24/9/2002 by BengalCat]

 

[luckyeddie]

I'd throw Cork out period.....

and that's saying a lot coming from me.

 

[Kimbo]

and you didn't even have to initiate it this time eddie...

 

[marc71178]

Originally posted by aussie_beater

Originally posted by marc71178
It is still 4 wins to England, 5 to India and 1 rained off.

I used that to point out that had England won (which we all know they didn't) they would have gone ahead of India 5-4 from the past 10 games.

10 matches have produced results in the not so distant future between the two teams....6 went to India and 4 to England, correct ? One got rained off and so we can forget about that.

You cna't just change the basis of comparing teams just because it aids your argument.

Before that game we were using the last 10, so after that game we should use the last 10 for consistency sake.

 

[marc71178]

Originally posted by BengalCat

England should throw out bowlers like Cork and Hoggard from onedayer team

Why Hoggard, he's not that bad a bowler.

 

[aussie_beater]

Originally posted by marc71178
You cna't just change the basis of comparing teams just because it aids your argument.

Before that game we were using the last 10, so after that game we should use the last 10 for consistency sake.

Who introduced that as a basis ?? I didn't and I don't consider it to be any basis whatsoever.10 or 12 as a number doesn't matter but we should be looking at a logical context which is represented by a series of matches played between the team with more or less the same set of players and with the minimum of interval between the matches.