World Class list

[Furball]

Yep, agree. I'd certainly take the former, until England's attack proves itself over a few more Tests/different oppositions.

Prove themselves the way Morkel has?

 

[Furball]

And in any case, he's an opener, is facing Steyn + Morkel that much worse than Anderson + Tremmlett/Broad?

It might be more challenging, but the reward for seeing off their opening burst is much greater than seeing off England's opening pair. If you see off Steyn and Morkel, then you can feast on Harris and whatever garbage they're playing as the 3rd seamer.

 

[vcs]

Prove themselves the way Morkel has?

Elaborate? Isn't Morkel's record in SA very good? Out of the 3 major teams he has faced at home (England, India, Aus) he has done very well against 2 and sucked against Australia.

As of now, Tremlett, for me, hasn't proven himself for long enough to rate him at Morkel's level.

 

[vcs]

It might be more challenging, but the reward for seeing off their opening burst is much greater than seeing off England's opening pair. If you see off Steyn and Morkel, then you can feast on Harris and whatever garbage they're playing as the 3rd seamer.

That is certainly true of England's attack. There is very little respite. I'd say Lopsy did a good job as 3rd seamer in SA's attack after the first Test, was desperately unlucky in that series.

 

[akilana]

Not reading too much into Ghambhir's two 50s.. looked too uncomfortable and had lot of catches dropped. Will see how he goes in England.

 

[Teja.]

Not reading too much into Ghambhir's two 50s.. looked too uncomfortable and had lot of catches dropped. Will see how he goes in England.

Three tbf. Including a 90-odd and an 80-odd

 

[silentstriker]

It might be more challenging, but the reward for seeing off their opening burst is much greater than seeing off England's opening pair. If you see off Steyn and Morkel, then you can feast on Harris and whatever garbage they're playing as the 3rd seamer.

In the previous series, Tsotsobe bowled really really well much of the time. Swann is an improvement over Harris of course, but the Indian batsmen did not 'feast' on him and neither did he run through the Indian side. The same will likely be true of Swann.

Thus, even if you disagree about who has the better attack, in my opinion, it's extremely clear which attack is harder to face for an opening batsman.

 

[Migara]

In the previous series, Tsotsobe bowled really really well much of the time. Swann is an improvement over Harris of course, but the Indian batsmen did not 'feast' on him and neither did he run through the Indian side. The same will likely be true of Swann.

Thus, even if you disagree about who has the better attack, in my opinion, it's extremely clear which attack is harder to face for an opening batsman.

Nah, Indian batsmen only go after spinners, not slow bowling pretenders.

 

[Cevno]

It might be more challenging, but the reward for seeing off their opening burst is much greater than seeing off England's opening pair. If you see off Steyn and Morkel, then you can feast on Harris and whatever garbage they're playing as the 3rd seamer.

Who is likely to England's third seamer though?

Broad?

His record isn't too flattering till now .

I would certainly face him or Tremlett in England rather than Morkel in South Africa who has a very good record to Left handers in any case.

 

[Jigga988]

Yup Edwards hasn't played in over a year - back now (for T20's at least) as is Taylor for that same reason, tbh, in the year and a half odd before Edwards' injury he looked better than Taylor has really ever looked, I think Taylor's a bit over-hyped personally, he at times struggles to swing the ball, I remember he was bowling with a scrambled seem in NZ till Doully helped him out, bit too inconsistent for me. I would sooner have Edwards in England's attack - adds raw pace, and his ability to swing the ball quite prodigiously is often overlooked... and he's a given in all the others, so I guess he's world class by this definition IMO. This is all dependant on what Edwards comes back, but yeah, Edwards after he turned the corner>Taylor. Having said that Roach is probably better than both of them already...

 

[Cevno]

Yup Edwards hasn't played in over a year - back now (for T20's at least) as is Taylor for that same reason, tbh, in the year and a half odd before Edwards' injury he looked better than Taylor has really ever looked, I think Taylor's a bit over-hyped personally, he at times struggles to swing the ball, I remember he was bowling with a scrambled seem in NZ till Doully helped him out, bit too inconsistent for me. I would sooner have Edwards in England's attack - adds raw pace, and his ability to swing the ball quite prodigiously is often overlooked... and he's a given in all the others, so I guess he's world class by this definition IMO. This is all dependant on what Edwards comes back, but yeah, Edwards after he turned the corner>Taylor. Having said that Roach is probably better than both of them already...

Wrong thread?

 

[GIMH]

In the previous series, Tsotsobe bowled really really well much of the time. Swann is an improvement over Harris of course, but the Indian batsmen did not 'feast' on him and neither did he run through the Indian side. The same will likely be true of Swann.

Thus, even if you disagree about who has the better attack, in my opinion, it's extremely clear which attack is harder to face for an opening batsman.

Extremely clear? You make it sound like we have clowns first up. Steyn is the best in the world but Anderson is better than everyone else, and just took 24 @ 26 in Australia.

Who is likely to England's third seamer though?

Broad?

His record isn't too flattering till now .

I would certainly face him or Tremlett in England rather than Morkel in South Africa who has a very good record to Left handers in any case.

Yeah, an overall career record is a good way of assessing how good a player is now when they're only four years into their Test career

Check Broad's record in England for the last two years and get back to me

 

[Cevno]

Yeah, an overall career record is a good way of assessing how good a player is now when they're only four years into their Test career

Check Broad's record in England for the last two years and get back to me

Checked .

And he averages 26.85 in Those 2 years.

While Morkel Averages 26.70 in the same period in SA.


But the difference being that Broad's average is largely based on doing well against West Indies and Pakistan Batting lineups ,while Morkel has played England,India and Australia.

Extremely clear? You make it sound like we have clowns first up. Steyn is the best in the world but Anderson is better than everyone else, and just took 24 @ 26 in Australia.

Zaheer would run Anderson close ,but that is a different debate so won't get into that here.

But i think what SS meant was -

Steyn > Anderson
Morkel > Tremlett/Broad at the moment at least.

Plus Indians have traditionally struggled against Bounce and seam/swing in SA more than
Swing without that much Bounce in England.

So it is clear as what would be a bigger test for someone like ,from a Indian perspective.

 

[NUFAN]

Meh, stroke-less wonder. Much prefer Asad Shafiq myself

Congratulations.

 

[silentstriker]

Anderson is better than everyone else, and just took 24 @ 26 in Australia.

And that's very nice for him.

Extremely clear? You make it sound like we have clowns first up. Steyn is the best in the world but

Obviously not clowns but it's extremely clear that it's not as good as South Africa.

 

[Burgey]

Nah, Indian batsmen only go after spinners, not slow bowling pretenders.

We should stick with Doherty and Beer then

 

[silentstriker]

Yea, it's always nice to take eight wickets for thirty trillion runs.

 

[Uppercut]

Extremely clear? You make it sound like we have clowns first up. Steyn is the best in the world but Anderson is better than everyone else, and just took 24 @ 26 in Australia.

Well Steyn's definitely better than Anderson and Morkel's definitely better than Broad so I'm not sure you have a case.

Although Gambhir being a left-hander does change things a little.

 

[Burgey]

Yea, it's always nice to take eight wickets for thirty trillion runs.

Indeed. Historically, it was called "Indianism"

 

[GIMH]

Well Steyn's definitely better than Anderson and Morkel's definitely better than Broad so I'm not sure you have a case.

Although Gambhir being a left-hander does change things a little.

I wouldn't give Broad the new ball, personally. Think Tremlett could prove himself to be quite a bit better than Morkel, but it's early days.

I think our record with the new ball of late speaks for itself. Would be interested to see what the numbers say of course as that is purely my perception.