• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Why is Lillee rated above Imran?

ankitj

Hall of Fame Member
I have seen Aussies are quite defensive of Lillie possibly more defensive for him rather then someone like Mcgrath Warne is another guy that gets defended a lot.I wonder what might be the reason.
So much that they go on to create official "insecure threads" :ph34r:

No offence but this defensiveness is quite similar to how Tendulkar or Akram fans respond when someone says Lara/McGrath (respectively) are better than them. No one would acknowledge it though.

McGrath requires no defence however, he has a record that is heads and shoulders above all his contemporaries (only for purely personal tastes, I prefer Ambrose over McGrath)
 
Last edited:

smash84

The Tiger King
Imran was very able to do the same, and more importantly, to understand his fellow fast bowlers and use them for the same purpose. Imran basically was telling Wasim what to bowl, ball by ball. He was such a "proteus" when coming to getting in to any other players boots.
However I think this doesn't come into play when considering who was a better bowler
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
I have seen Aussies are quite defensive of Lillie possibly more defensive for him rather then someone like Mcgrath Warne is another guy that gets defended a lot.I wonder what might be the reason.
I'll say something people might not have anticipated me saying but as a cricketer and a character I adore Imran. More than Lillee and almost as much as Miller and Warne. He dragged Pakistan almost to the top of the Test arena (he did it in ODIs) through sheer force of character and ability as a cricketer.

The sensitivity with Lillee is due to the fact that his record, because of various factors, are all over the place. Some don't consider these factors and you hear people calling him overrated, etc, and that's where it starts. But if you do take into account everything then you'll start beginning to understand why he is so highly rated, not just by Australians but by all. The WI of that era, both their batsmen and their bowlers, rated Lillee the greatest. Not because they were absolutely creamed by him and not because they didn't have bowlers themselves to compare, but in that upper echelon of players I think he had a slight gear above the others.

Personally, I don't consider Imran better than Lillee and a few other of his contemporaries. But I have no problem if people want to rate him that high - as I said to Smali, I'd disagree, but it is fair enough. Statistically all these players are pretty close. I have been putting forward arguments why others (and myself, too) usually put Lillee so high and why so many have him as top pick.
 
Last edited:

Shri

Mr. Glass
The real question question is. why are Imran and Lillee rated behind ABHIMANYU MITHUN as test bowlers?
 

smash84

The Tiger King
I'll say something people might not have anticipated me saying but as a cricketer and a character I adore Imran. More than Lillee and almost as much as Miller and Warne. He dragged Pakistan almost to the top of the Test arena (he did it in ODIs) through sheer force of character and ability as a cricketer.

The sensitivity with Lillee is due to the fact that his record, because of various factors, are all over the place. Some don't consider these factors and you hear people calling him overrated, etc, and that's where it starts. But if you do take into account everything then you'll start beginning to understand why he is so highly rated, not just by Australians but by all. The WI of that era, both their batsmen and their bowlers, rated Lillee the greatest. Not because they were absolutely creamed by him and not because they didn't have bowlers themselves to compare, but in that upper echelon of players I think he had a slight gear above the others.

Personally, I don't consider Imran better than Lillee and a few other of his contemporaries. But I have no problem if people want to rate him that high - as I said to Smali, I'd disagree, but it is fair enough. Statistically all these players are pretty close. I have been putting forward arguments why others (and myself, too) usually put Lillee so high and why so many have him as top pick.
So is that FINALLY an admission that stats can't (and shouldn't always) be used in certain ways to prove that one player is better than another? :p
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
So much that they go on to create official "insecure threads" :ph34r:

No offence but this defensiveness is quite similar to how Tendulkar or Akram fans respond when someone says Lara/McGrath (respectively) are better than them. No one would acknowledge it though.

McGrath requires no defence however, he has a record that is heads and shoulders above all his contemporaries (only for purely personal tastes, I prefer Ambrose over McGrath)
Buffoon. Read the opening post of that thread.
 

Shri

Mr. Glass
Interestingly enough, Trumper was one of Daemon's first victims. He later signed up as Trumper's Ghost from the beyond. His amnesia has saved Daemon some flogging.
 

Daemon

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Interestingly enough, Trumper was one of Daemon's first victims. He later signed up as Trumper's Ghost from the beyond. His amnesia has saved Daemon some flogging.
Thanks for helping me prove my point.
 

Jono

Virat Kohli (c)
I'll say something people might not have anticipated me saying but as a cricketer and a character I adore Imran. More than Lillee and almost as much as Miller and Warne. He dragged Pakistan almost to the top of the Test arena (he did it in ODIs) through sheer force of character and ability as a cricketer.

The sensitivity with Lillee is due to the fact that his record, because of various factors, are all over the place. Some don't consider these factors and you hear people calling him overrated, etc, and that's where it starts. But if you do take into account everything then you'll start beginning to understand why he is so highly rated, not just by Australians but by all. The WI of that era, both their batsmen and their bowlers, rated Lillee the greatest. Not because they were absolutely creamed by him and not because they didn't have bowlers themselves to compare, but in that upper echelon of players I think he had a slight gear above the others.

Personally, I don't consider Imran better than Lillee and a few other of his contemporaries. But I have no problem if people want to rate him that high - as I said to Smali, I'd disagree, but it is fair enough. Statistically all these players are pretty close. I have been putting forward arguments why others (and myself, too) usually put Lillee so high and why so many have him as top pick.
There are very few people who say this though. The great majority, without ever seeing him bowl much or seeing his stats, will just believe (rightly) that Lillee is one of the best fast bowlers of all time because he gets SO much press, compliments etc. Cricketweb is definitely not the majority view on Lillee.

I'd say Lillee gets far far more attention and praise than Marshall.
 

smash84

The Tiger King
There are very few people who say this though. The great majority, without ever seeing him bowl much or seeing his stats, will just believe (rightly) that Lillee is one of the best fast bowlers of all time because he gets SO much press, compliments etc. Cricketweb is definitely not the majority view on Lillee.

I'd say Lillee gets far far more attention and praise than Marshall.
awta
 

smash84

The Tiger King
I'll say something people might not have anticipated me saying but as a cricketer and a character I adore Imran. More than Lillee and almost as much as Miller and Warne. He dragged Pakistan almost to the top of the Test arena (he did it in ODIs) through sheer force of character and ability as a cricketer.

.
Yes. I don't think people would have anticipated that :p
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
There are very few people who say this though. The great majority, without ever seeing him bowl much or seeing his stats, will just believe (rightly) that Lillee is one of the best fast bowlers of all time because he gets SO much press, compliments etc. Cricketweb is definitely not the majority view on Lillee.

I'd say Lillee gets far far more attention and praise than Marshall.
There's probably a far greater majority on CW who never saw him bowl than in the general community (in Australia obviously).
 

Top