Graham Thorpe?Prince EWS said:And Andy Flower....
Richard said:Typical misunderstanding here.
It's not the case that certain players peform under pressure and others don't - it's simply that some players feel pressure more easily than others. In certain situations, Michael Bevan won't feel under any undue pressure while most others would be worrying their heads off.
Perhaps a better term would be who performs best when external observers perceive there to be pressure.
What the feck, you can't say sh*t like that. Some people still love Hansie. Comments like that have caused threads to be closed pretty recently..Slow Love™ said:Yes, he fell to pieces afterwards (and literally too)
Can't quite believe what im hearing.. He commited a crime and he repented and served his punishment.. Last thing I expect to hear is members (who i quite respect) joking about him dying in a bloody plane crash...Richard said:Non-South Africans do rather tend to give Cronje less of the human respect he deserves.
Like I say, some people don't seem to realise he deserves the respect any human-being deserves - and that means people not joking about your death.Langeveldt said:Can't quite believe what im hearing.. He commited a crime and he repented and served his punishment.. Last thing I expect to hear is members (who i quite respect) joking about him dying in a bloody plane crash...
Yes, he was - he proved himself more than capable of smashing the ball all over the place during the field-restrictions - he simply wasn't given the chance to do that very often in ODIs. He was stereotyped as being good only at the "finishing" role.Camel56 said:Michael Bevan was over rated. Very good one day player for a while but cmon his stats were hugely inflated by many not outs and he never really had the ability to score at a very fast pace. He was solid and handled the pressure cooker that is limited overs cricket very well but hewas never as good as the hype merchants made out.
Yes the not outs count for something of course but they have just added to the inflatted average that people always crap on about. Highest average in ODI history? Who cares it was inflated. IVA Richards' average is far more impressive and he was a far better one day (and test match for that matter) player to boot.Richard said:Yes, he was - he proved himself more than capable of smashing the ball all over the place during the field-restrictions - he simply wasn't given the chance to do that very often in ODIs. He was stereotyped as being good only at the "finishing" role.
The large number of not-outs, meanwhile, do actually count for something given that not getting dismissed is a rather important part of batting, and it's something hardly anyone has ever come close to him on doing.
Bevan was capable of turning his hand to any situation required in a limited-overs game - far more capable than anyone else has ever been.
Heh, thanks for trying to bail me out on that one mate, but I'll willingly plead guilty to disrespect when it comes to Cronje.Top_Cat said:On a side note; as far as Cronje's death goes, don't misunderstand Slow Love's comment to be a lack of respect. As someone who works in an environment where I and my colleagues deal with the results of traumatic crimes daily (*** Crimes Branch of SA Police but I've worked murders with Major Crime too), it's quite commonplace for somewhat tasteless jokes to be the norm. If there was a tape-recorder present sometimes, well people who don't do the job would be mortified I'm sure. It's a release mechanism for dealing with such horrible things in a lot of ways and a method of getting 'outside' the trauma associated with it because if you are 'in' it all the time with no way of getting 'out', well I can almost stone-cold guarantee a breakdown is well underway.
I don't know for sure Slow Love's motivation on that one but I can understand the motivation to 'joke' about traumatic events. Everyone does it. There have been jokes about traumatic events since traumatic events began. That's my take on it anyway.
this has been done 1 million times, but the fact that his average goes up when he bats at 4 proves that his average is not inflated.Camel56 said:Yes the not outs count for something of course but they have just added to the inflatted average that people always crap on about. Highest average in ODI history? Who cares it was inflated. IVA Richards' average is far more impressive and he was a far better one day (and test match for that matter) player to boot.
while i dont expect him to be loved by many, i do expect him to be respected. he made south africa one of the best teams in the world, and did everything possible to make them do well as a team. personally i think at least half the people playing in that era were in some way involved in match fixing, certainly many that were even more involved than cronje. how someone like akram came out with a clean sheet is quite beyond me, yet how many people here hate him?Slow Love™ said:To be honest, it kinda appalls me the things that can be said about Murali, a player that only ever inadvertently brought himself into question, and yet, Cronje, who deliberately, willingly, corrupted the game and worse still, corrupted others less experienced is still "loved by many". Not by me, and I call into question how much pressure that guy was ever under on the international stage, outside of whether he was going to please his bookies. I think, to be honest, I was riled at his inclusion with decent players in the poll who didn't sell out the game.
Go and look up "integrity" in the dictionary (it's between "imbecile" and "intolerable"; familiar words for you?)tooextracool said:id also like to say that at least 9/10th of the people in the world today would, if a bookie offered them a very large sum of money to fix one series, take up the offer without hesitation. you and i might not though......