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Where will Steve Smith end up being ranked?

kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
centurymaker said:
But he is not averaging 50+ since pitches got more difficult.

Since 1 Jan 2018 -
(last 7 years)
View attachment 42740

Since Ashes 2019 -
(last 5 years)
View attachment 42741

Yes you can move the timeline back more to push up the stats but in the last many years now, he's not been at world class level overall except 1 or 2 series. By the way, his home avg since 2018 is 45.02, including 3 tons in 44 inns. End of year 2013-2017, home avg was 94.39, including 12 tons in 36 inns.

Bottomline is any player ever is only as good as the pitches they play on, no matter who that player is.
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Yeah basically agree with the above, probably a slight twist.

Think batsmen are more impacted by bowlers than bowlers are impacted by batsmen. But bowlers are the ones impacted by pitches.

subshakerz said:
Smith's career trajectory matches Viv and Ponting, an ATG peak followed by a somewhat middling long dip.

However, 42 for a post dip period is still respectable.

I agree pitches helped Smith significantly which is why he deserves to be behind Viv. But we shouldn't forget just how top notch his peak was.
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Yeah, Viv having his peak during a live pitch era is a definite plus. Can't imagine what he would have done in his prime on those pitches.
 
Johan

Johan

International Debutant
The_CricketUmpire said:
What about Lara scoring 798 runs in a Test series against England in 1994 or the 765 runs pace again against England in 1995
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while I rate the 1995 English tour, the 2019 Ashes blows it out of the water, English bowling was substantially superior and conditions were much more difficult, Lara averaged 77 while Smith 110 too
 
A

Ali TT

International Vice-Captain
peterhrt said:
I am only going by my own perception of opinions in England, which may not line up with what others think. Folk watch a lot of cricket on television now so it is not only about how a cricketer performs in a particular country, or even in a particular format. Smith is an ideal checklist batsman in that he has decent Test stats around the world, which may have contributed towards his high rating by some.


@Red posted this yesterday and I think there are quite a few in England who would agree.

One factor may be Smith's fidgety, quirky style that leads him to play so much across the line. He doesn't give the impression of cool command that Chappell did. Nor can he take a game away from you quite like Ponting. Harvey would be the best of this group on bad wickets, though he did have most experience of them. Waugh and Border were also very good in difficult conditions.

My impression is that Ponting was called the best Australian since Bradman more often than Smith, and that he might lead this group in English eyes. But all six are close. How they are regarded in Australia is more relevant.
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This is a good assessment. When you look at his stats its hard to spot a weakness like Ponting in India. Two tests in Bangladesh aside he averages over 40 everywhere, and 50 in Australia, England, India, the Carribbean, NZ, Pakistan and all but in Sri Lanka (49.75). That might change a little if he has a couple of poor tours before he retires but it's a remarkably consistent record. However, I can't say I'll ever warm to his style and while his 2019 Ashes were remarkable his batting won't stick in the mind like the far more graceful Pontings, Laras, Tendulkars, Sangakkaras. Aesthetics does come into it for me. Cricket is entertainment after all.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
Ali TT said:
This is a good assessment. When you look at his stats its hard to spot a weakness like Ponting in India. Two tests in Bangladesh aside he averages over 40 everywhere, and 50 in Australia, England, India, the Carribbean, NZ, Pakistan and all but in Sri Lanka (49.75). That might change a little if he has a couple of poor tours before he retires but it's a remarkably consistent record. However, I can't say I'll ever warm to his style and while his 2019 Ashes were remarkable his batting won't stick in the mind like the far more graceful Pontings, Laras, Tendulkars, Sangakkaras. Aesthetics does come into it for me. Cricket is entertainment after all.
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So very true.
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Smith had some friendly home decks but he averages a lot everywhere, and England/SA/NZ/India have been prepping a variety of tracks since very early in his career.

He still has a strong case for second best ever, especially given his value in his era. 40+ batsmen are a rarer breed than in the 00s.
 
centurymaker

centurymaker

Cricketer Of The Year
Ali TT said:
This is a good assessment. When you look at his stats its hard to spot a weakness like Ponting in India. Two tests in Bangladesh aside he averages over 40 everywhere, and 50 in Australia, England, India, the Carribbean, NZ, Pakistan and all but in Sri Lanka (49.75). That might change a little if he has a couple of poor tours before he retires but it's a remarkably consistent record. However, I can't say I'll ever warm to his style and while his 2019 Ashes were remarkable his batting won't stick in the mind like the far more graceful Pontings, Laras, Tendulkars, Sangakkaras. Aesthetics does come into it for me. Cricket is entertainment after all.
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I think it's too early to call his away record spotless. He achieved it in his peak. Allow him to have some tours now to balance things out, to know how his stats change with greater sample size like other past greats.

Basically let him reach 140-150 Tests overall to get a fair assessment of his away averages. Away stats have a small sample size, and with Smith the sample is even smaller at the moment. Even Root has played 72 away tests.

Away Tests:
Tendulkar 106
Dravid 94
Waugh 79
Kallis 78
Ponting 76
V Richards 73
Root 72
Border 70
Lara 66

Smith 56

.
For instance, his average in South Africa is 41.10 from just 6 Tests. He hasn't played there in 7 years. Another series there in 2026/27 would allow us to see whether that goes up to 45.10 or down to 34.90. SA is one country which consistently has had the best fast bowlers excluding Australia and Smith has not played them much home or away.
 
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centurymaker

centurymaker

Cricketer Of The Year
PlayerComparisons said:
I doubt Smith will even be averaging 50+ overseas if he plays till 160 tests like Ponting and Dravid
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Australia don't have many away tests lined up until 2027.

2025: 2 vs SL, 2 vs WI
2026: 3 vs SA
2027: 5 vs IND, 5 vs ENG

Let's hope Smith plays until 2027 (2+ years at least) so that sample size isn't a thing. He should at minimum aim for that 150 year anniversary test vs England in March 2027, if not the away Ashes. But there's a possibility that he (along with a few others) may have to retire after the Ashes next yr itself, depending on how he fares with the bat and the results Australia have at home.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
centurymaker said:
For instance, his average in South Africa is 41.10 from just 6 Tests. He hasn't played there in 7 years. Another series there in 2026/27 would allow us to see whether that goes up to 45.10 or down to 34.90. SA is one country which consistently has had the best fast bowlers excluding Australia and Smith has not played them much home or away.
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Agree would like to see how Smith does in SA. Even Tendulkar was iffy there until he had a great last tour to silence doubts.
 
A

Arachnödouche2.0

U19 12th Man
vicleggie said:
Don't care.

His game possesses no beauty

He's not on my radar in terms of the greatest batters of all time
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Hope that's not a troll because I feel ya. Smith is the Jackson Pollock to Lara's Monet. Sometimes I think he was successful at all because of just how awkward he is to bowl to. Bowlers of the last ten years have a lot to answer for.
 
vicleggie

vicleggie

State Vice-Captain
Arachnödouche2.0 said:
Hope that's not a troll because I feel ya. Smith is the Jackson Pollock to Lara's Monet. Sometimes I think he was successful at all because of just how awkward he is to bowl to. Bowlers of the last ten years have a lot to answer for.
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Look I think he's very skilled, has a great eye. You could be right though, he would be somewhat annoying and distracting to bowl to.

Not so much an apex predator like the aforementioned players, more a venomous, spindly insect that claws on you and slowly stings you 1000 times till you die.
 
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