Where will Steve Smith end up being ranked?

[The_CricketUmpire]

your fault for not watching Lara in SL in 2001.

What about Lara scoring 798 runs in a Test series against England in 1994 or the 765 runs pace again against England in 1995

 

[Coronis]

What about Lara scoring 798 runs in a Test series against England in 1994 or the 765 runs pace again against England in 1995

Gotta love 90’s England.

 

[peterhrt]

Why, I already have Bradman, Ponting and Chappell as my 3-5 in the first ATG XI and Smith is not getting any better

This would be a view shared by a number of English followers, especially older ones, who also place Border higher. Smith seems to be most popular in India. No doubt Root takes a similar hit in Australia.

There are similarities between Smith and Harvey. Eight years after debut Harvey was averaging 61, having scored most runs for Australia after Bradman with 15 hundreds in 39 matches. On several occasions he had seemed to be batting on a different level from his teammates, especially on difficult pitches.

However, frequently playing across the line and against the spin led Freddie Brown to remark that Harvey was the worst great player he had seen, and others to predict that his form would fade with age, which it did.

 

[govinda indian fan]

This would be a view shared by a number of English followers, especially older ones, who also place Border higher. Smith seems to be most popular in India. No doubt Root takes a similar hit in Australia.

There are similarities between Smith and Harvey. Eight years after debut Harvey was averaging 61, having scored most runs for Australia after Bradman with 15 hundreds in 39 matches. On several occasions he had seemed to be batting on a different level from his teammates, especially on difficult pitches.

However, frequently playing across the line and against the spin led Freddie Brown to remark that Harvey was the worst great player he had seen, and others to predict that his form would fade with age, which it did.

But smith has atg 19 ashes in england. Why do people in england don't rate him like they rate punter border or chappell if you dont mind can you explain the reason. Would love to know who is considered best Australian bat since sir don in England

 

[govinda indian fan]

But smith has atg 19 ashes in england. Why do people in england don't rate him like they rate punter border or chappell if you dont mind can you explain the reason. Would love to know who is considered best Australian bat since sir don in England

Smith is rightfully popular in india because he put greatest performance by visiting batsman since clive Lloyd and sir viv in 74 against bedi chandra and prasanna

 

[peterhrt]

But smith has atg 19 ashes in england. Why do people in england don't rate him like they rate punter border or chappell if you dont mind can you explain the reason. Would love to know who is considered best Australian bat since sir don in England

I am only going by my own perception of opinions in England, which may not line up with what others think. Folk watch a lot of cricket on television now so it is not only about how a cricketer performs in a particular country, or even in a particular format. Smith is an ideal checklist batsman in that he has decent Test stats around the world, which may have contributed towards his high rating by some.

even in Australian terms, he’s not necessarily above G.Chappell, Ponting, Border, Harvey, S. Waugh imo

@Red posted this yesterday and I think there are quite a few in England who would agree.

One factor may be Smith's fidgety, quirky style that leads him to play so much across the line. He doesn't give the impression of cool command that Chappell did. Nor can he take a game away from you quite like Ponting. Harvey would be the best of this group on bad wickets, though he did have most experience of them. Waugh and Border were also very good in difficult conditions.

My impression is that Ponting was called the best Australian since Bradman more often than Smith, and that he might lead this group in English eyes. But all six are close. How they are regarded in Australia is more relevant.

 

[govinda indian fan]

I am only going by own perception of opinions in England, which may not line up with what others think. Folk watch a lot of cricket on television now so it is not only about how a cricketer performs in a particular country, or even in a particular format. Smith is an ideal checklist batsman in that he has decent Test stats around the world, which may have contributed towards his high rating by some.


@Red posted this yesterday and I think there are quite a few in England who would agree.

One factor may be Smith's fidgety, quirky style that leads him to play so much across the line. He doesn't give the impression of cool command that Chappell did. Nor can he take a game away from you quite like Ponting. Harvey would be the best of this group on bad wickets, though he did have most experience of them. Waugh and Border were also very good on difficult surfaces.

My impression is that Ponting was called the best Australian since Bradman more often than Smith, and that he might lead this group in English eyes. But all six are close. How they are regarded in Australia is more relevant.

Thanks for your explanation

 

[Blenkinsop]

If we are not going to allow aesthetic considerations to sway us, should we then say that Shivnarine Chanderpaul is an ATG and better than Smith? Similar average over a longer career and often carried an increasingly crap Windies team.

 

[CodeOfWisden]

He was number one for me before his decline started, he has actually been as bad as Virat in the last 4 years except that he played on flatter tracks. The only great innings he has played in last 4 years came in the WTC final.

Now, he is behind Sachin but ahead of Lara, and on a different tier to Ponting.

 

[Flem274*]

You guys are overrating the past. Both the eyes and stats say this has been the hardest era to bat since arguably ever (2017ish to now), and blokes who average 50+ are rare.

This guy has been casually averaging 60. Even if he's cooked he has dominated an era like few have.

 

[The_CricketUmpire]

I still have Lara and Tendulkar ahead of Smith but only my opinion. That aside he's still a champion and old age has caught up to him I think - how long he stays in the game....who knows.

 

[honestbharani]

Even if he's cooked he has dominated an era like few have.

Its those few who are being rated ahead of him, tbf.

 

[GotSpin]

You guys are overrating the past. Both the eyes and stats say this has been the hardest era to bat since arguably ever (2017ish to now), and blokes who average 50+ are rare.

This guy has been casually averaging 60. Even if he's cooked he has dominated an era like few have.

I reckon he needs one final purple patch or run to cement his status. Its been a serious decline over the past few years

 

[centurymaker]

You guys are overrating the past. Both the eyes and stats say this has been the hardest era to bat since arguably ever (2017ish to now), and blokes who average 50+ are rare.

This guy has been casually averaging 60. Even if he's cooked he has dominated an era like few have.

But he is not averaging 50+ since pitches got more difficult.

Since 1 Jan 2018 -
(last 7 years)


Since Ashes 2019 -
(last 5 years)


Yes you can move the timeline back more to push up the stats but in the last many years now, he's not been at world class level overall except 1 or 2 series. By the way, his home avg since 2018 is 45.02, including 3 tons in 44 inns. End of year 2013-2017, home avg was 94.39, including 12 tons in 36 inns.

Bottomline is any player ever is only as good as the pitches they play on, no matter who that player is.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Smith had some of the flattest pitches of all time at home for most of his career

 

[subshakerz]

But he is not averaging 50+ since pitches got more difficult.

Since 1 Jan 2018 -
(last 7 years)
View attachment 42740

Since Ashes 2019 -
(last 5 years)
View attachment 42741

Yes you can move the timeline back more to push up the stats but in the last many years now, he's not been at world class level overall except 1 or 2 series. By the way, his home avg since 2018 is 45.02, including 3 tons in 44 inns. End of year 2013-2017, home avg was 94.39, including 12 tons in 36 inns.

Bottomline is any player ever is only as good as the pitches they play on, no matter who that player is.

Smith's career trajectory matches Viv and Ponting, an ATG peak followed by a somewhat middling long dip.

However, 42 for a post dip period is still respectable.

I agree pitches helped Smith significantly which is why he deserves to be behind Viv. But we shouldn't forget just how top notch his peak was.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Smith's career trajectory matches Viv and Ponting, an ATG peak followed by a somewhat middling long dip.

However, 42 for a post dip period is still respectable.

I agree pitches helped Smith significantly which is why he deserves to be behind Viv. But we shouldn't forget just how top notch his peak was.

Smith is atg. Must be only player other then sachin to average 40 vs every nation except bangla. As indian fan it gives chill whenever he comes to crease think would do well in rest of matches

 

[govinda indian fan]

IIRC Smith averaged something like 21 after 38 ODI, Got played everywhere from 3-8 and basically didn't know his role. Has been a fairly exceptional Odi player since then.
On the earlier discussions re. Ponting, I always felt it was his India record that let him down more the poor end to his career.
Even when he was at his peak averaging nearly 60, he averaged something like 16 in India. Just too big a hole in his record for a top 10 all time batsman for me.

Punter was unlucky. Missed out on 2004 tour when he was at his peak surprising thing is even lara averaged 33 in india shocking considering he was greatest player of spin he should have naturally dominated india.

 

[subshakerz]

Punter was unlucky. Missed out on 2004 tour when he was at his peak.

Wow many poster won't admit this

 

[govinda indian fan]

Wow many poster won't admit this

Ponting is legend no shame in admitting it