What would Ashwin and Jadeja's records look like if they debuted a decade earlier?

[CricAddict]

That's unfortunate. You have some good posts and we have had some good exchanges.

I have unignored you now man and just saw this message. But not continuing this discussion further so that I don't get worked up on something so trivial like an online discussion. All good.

 

[Adorable Asshole]

Although, you wouldn't be happy that Garner the batsman goes down from 12.44 to 9.94.

Still greater than Mcgrath

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Their records would've been absolutely terrible. Imagine them starting as 12 or 13 year-olds. The likes of Andy Flower, Hayden, Martyn, and Lara would've destroyed them.

 

[_00_deathscar]

Their records would've been absolutely terrible. Imagine them starting as 12 or 13 year-olds. The likes of Andy Flower, Hayden, Martyn, and Lara would've destroyed them.

Yea but not at home

 

[Migara]

Average of home and (away+neutral) matches:

Ashwin - 25.35
Jadeja - 26.59
Kumble - 30.37

Average of averages in every country they played in:

Ashwin - 30.49
Jadeja - 31.72
Kumble - 34.03

Ashwin and Jadeja have their issues but I wouldn't chose Kumble over them, home or overseas.

Kumble had a specially rough time in SL. Ashwin and Jadeja did not face the quality of Sanga, Mahela, Samaraweera and Tillekaratne in the way Kumble and Harbhajan has experienced in SL. Last three were bloody brilliant players of spin.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Batting was a lot better and pitches a bit flatter in general so probably would average a bit higher. Probably still have a similar number of wickets and such unless Kumble took one of their spots, which he probably would. Might even have kept both out of the side in SENA when they only played 1 spinner now that I think about it

 

[The_CricketUmpire]

Kumble has seven first class tons and was batting 6 or 7 in Ranji when he was first called up. If he needed to take his batting more seriously to get in the side he definitely could have done it IMO.

I think he was better bowler than Ashwin and would have been selected on that basis.

Kumble scored seven First-Class hundreds of which one of them was in Test matches. His batting average in Test matches was 17.77 whilst his average in First-Class cricket was 21.68. He was handy with the bat without being - probably a bit better than average. He was a "batsman who hung around"...his strike rate in Test's was 38.82.

 

[Shady Slim]

- Tahir 14 wickets @21

the concept of imran tahir averaging anything less than like 40 over course of an entire test series is so funny to me lmao

 

[TheJediBrah]

Imran Tahir was bad

 

[The_CricketUmpire]

He should have taken it seriously then. Indian tail was a joke during his time and he was part of it. There were very rare moments that he and Srinath did somewhat ok with the bat. Otherwise, it was always Sachin out, all out.

Yes, he might be the slightly better bowler but it does not outweigh what Ashwin gives with the bat over him. My Indian ATG XI will have Ash-Jaddu combination over Kumble, Bedi, Prasanna etc. to give that extra weight with the bat without losing anything with the ball.

Javagal Srinath averaged 14.21 in Test cricket and scored four 50s with a highest score of 76. In First-Class cricket he averaged 14.49 and scored seven 50s, highest score of 76. As you said, he had his moments but his average was a bit low.

Also, whilst we are talking about Indian bowlers who batted down the order.....Ajit Agarkar....he averaged 16.79 in Test's....didn't score a half-century but did score a century - 109 not out. In First-Class cricket he scored 3,336 runs at an average of 28.75.....he scored sixteen 50s and four 100s with a highest score of 145. He was better with the bat in my opinion than Javagal Srinath and Anil Kumble.

 

[Ali TT]

So many things to consider with this. A decade earlier was pre-T20, analytics and modern fitness training in it's infancy, outfielding a shadow of what it now is, salaries/earnings much smaller. Wickets were generally better for batting in the 00s but batting lineups were generally stronger as well (including India's). India's quick bowling was also generally weaker - would that lead them to playing both Ashwin and Jadeja overseas more often? However the Windies were less financially reliant on Indian cricket so might be less inclined to produce rank turners whenever India toured, which might dent the two spinners' overseas records

 

[Socerer 01]

So many things to consider with this. A decade earlier was pre-T20, analytics and modern fitness training in it's infancy, outfielding a shadow of what it now is, salaries/earnings much smaller. Wickets were generally better for batting in the 00s but batting lineups were generally stronger as well (including India's). India's quick bowling was also generally weaker - would that lead them to playing both Ashwin and Jadeja overseas more often? However the Windies were less financially reliant on Indian cricket so might be less inclined to produce rank turners whenever India toured, which might dent the two spinners' overseas records

do you also think that the West Indians produced bouncy pitches when South Africa toured to profit financially from them?

 

[Ali TT]

do you also think that the West Indians produced bouncy pitches when South Africa toured to profit financially from them?

Maybe, certainly often against England cause they know our batters can't handle it

 

[Kirkut]

That era had better players of spin, so the average would be around 28 ish.

Both would have had excellent records against England and South Africa who were comically bad against spin at that time.

 

[TheJediBrah]

However the Windies were less financially reliant on Indian cricket so might be less inclined to produce rank turners whenever India toured, which might dent the two spinners' overseas records

This is the first I've heard of this. I was under the impression that Windies wickets becoming more spin friendly was a widespread thing over the last decade, even in domestics. Hence why so many Windies domestic spinners of the 2010s had such great career stats

 

[OverratedSanity]

This is the first I've heard of this. I was under the impression that Windies wickets becoming more spin friendly was a widespread thing over the last decade, even in domestics. Hence why so many Windies domestic spinners of the 2010s had such great career stats

He's talking about the 2000s. They're definitely more spin friendly now.

 

[TheJediBrah]

He's talking about the 2000s. They're definitely more spin friendly now.

he's saying that WI are making spin friendly wickets now because they are supposedly reliant on India more than they sere in the 2000s isn't he

 

[OverratedSanity]

Oh if you're debating the cause of why the pitches became more spin friendly no idea

Definitely a domestic trend too though. Didn't nikita Miller pick up a million wickets @ Lohmann averages in the early 2010s?

 

[TheJediBrah]

Oh if you're debating the cause of why the pitches became more spin friendly no idea

Definitely a domestic trend too though. Didn't nikita Miller pick up a million wickets @ Lohmann averages in the early 2010s?

All I was questioning was the claim that the spinnifying of WI wickets was driven by a "reliance on BCCI money".

That they have become more spin friendly is definitely no secret

 

[Socerer 01]

All I was questioning was the claim that the spinnifying of WI wickets was driven by a "reliance on BCCI money".

That they have become more spin friendly is definitely no secret

its not as I said they made bouncy pitches when South Africa went there and i doubt they have any money to engineer pitches like that for their team