*Unofficial* New Zealand Black Caps Thread

[Immenso]

Had an interesting chat with a friend at rhe cricket today. Without going into details, they has some inside information basically saying that Gary Stead isn't a big fan of Rachin, disliked the fame and popularity he built in the world cup and left him out of the Bangladesh tour for that reason.

Yeah. That sounds, umm, like complete horseshit.

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah. That sounds, umm, like complete horse****.

Yeah, I know. Unfortunately I can't make it sound less whacky without revealing the source of the info, and I don't think that's something I should do online.

 

[Flem274*]

If true, that's instant dismissal material. But as much as I think Gary Stead isn't the greatest coach ever, I don't think a professional man like him would turn out to be that petty.

What is the kid meant to do, get out more?

Anyway I came in here to pray for an NZ A tour before the test side goes to Asia, and how I want Rhys Mariu, Will Young, Mark Chapman and some fun bowlers in it. Mariu is by far the highest performing opener around atm, is a young guy, and he looks ok on live streams. I didn't actually realise how bad the openers were this season until I did that openers post.

Edit - get Severin in the A team too. I've had an affection for him ever since he played that stupid shot to throw away a great victory for Wellington when he was on like 200 million.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Yeah, I know. Unfortunately I can't make it sound less whacky without revealing the source of the info, and I don't think that's something I should do online.

It was nzfan wasn't it

 

[anonymouskefe]

If true, that's instant dismissal material. But as much as I think Gary Stead isn't the greatest coach ever, I don't think a professional man like him would turn out to be that petty.

What is the kid meant to do, get out more?

Anyway I came in here to pray for an NZ A tour before the test side goes to Asia, and how I want Rhys Mariu, Will Young, Mark Chapman and some fun bowlers in it. Mariu is by far the highest performing opener around atm, is a young guy, and he looks ok on live streams. I didn't actually realise how bad the openers were this season until I did that openers post.

Edit - get Severin in the A team too. I've had an affection for him ever since he played that stupid shot to throw away a great victory for Wellington when he was on like 200 million.

Big fan of Curtis Heaphy the young CD opener myself send him and Mariu to open with M Fisher in the bowlers

 

[RMBolton]

In fairness, without dropping Nicholls there's no way to get Rachin into the XI unless you're waiting for him to succeed Latham or Conway.
And, half century at the Cake Tin aside, I still don't rate him as a T20 player & struggle to see him in a future NZ T20 team. He's never shown consistency in T20; it's a couple of 50s surrounded by some middling scores & a lot of single digits. With that said, it's sad he never got a go at Eden Park to try & show that consistency.

And yeah, I've been a fan of Fisher's since that 4-fer vs India A. He's even improved on his economy a bit this PS round.

 

[straw man]

While I'd take that rumour with a large grain of salt, there's a long history of conservative NZ coaches falling out with star players who they think are too big for their boots. However Rachin also isn't one of those arrogant showboat type star players like Cairns, Parore, young Dion Nash - he seems remarkably staid for someone that's had the attention he has.

 

[straw man]

Anyway I came in here to pray for an NZ A tour before the test side goes to Asia, and how I want Rhys Mariu, Will Young, Mark Chapman and some fun bowlers in it. Mariu is by far the highest performing opener around atm, is a young guy, and he looks ok on live streams. I didn't actually realise how bad the openers were this season until I did that openers post.

Edit - get Severin in the A team too. I've had an affection for him ever since he played that stupid shot to throw away a great victory for Wellington when he was on like 200 million.

I'm off the Chapman train unfortunately, especially for test cricket where that short-ball weakness is always going to wreck him. He can have more white-ball chances though I suspect even if he's passable he'll fail in the big occasions vs big opposition. Even Will Young more likely to succeed imo.

Yeah there's a crop of 22-25 yr old domestic batters who look promising but need a lot of exposure in the next two seasons before all NZ's then-35-yr-olds retire.

 

[SteveNZ]

Had an interesting chat with a friend at rhe cricket today. Without going into details, they had some inside information basically saying that Gary Stead isn't a big fan of Rachin, disliked the fame and popularity he built in the world cup and left him out of the Bangladesh tour for that reason.

This sounds like weapons grade bullshit, to be fair.

You could protect the source and say how close he is to the team, but otherwise that's too hard to believe

 

[NZTailender]

This sounds like weapons grade bull****, to be fair.

You could protect the source and say how close he is to the team, but otherwise that's too hard to believe

Plot twist - it was stead himself who talks in the third person

 

[Flem274*]

I'm off the Chapman train unfortunately, especially for test cricket where that short-ball weakness is always going to wreck him. He can have more white-ball chances though I suspect even if he's passable he'll fail in the big occasions vs big opposition. Even Will Young more likely to succeed imo.

Yeah there's a crop of 22-25 yr old domestic batters who look promising but need a lot of exposure in the next two seasons before all NZ's then-35-yr-olds retire.

I'm a bit less concerned because I don't take performances against Australia as indicative of performance against others and he has been fantastic for the A side against the likes of Siraj and co. He's batting #3 atm for Auckland so we will find out very quickly if he can't play the short stuff again, especially when he meets Wellington/Central/Northern.

Will Young is still a player of interest, he's just not an opener. That means he'll have to wait patiently behind KW/Ravindra/Mitchell who are all better players. It's worth noting guys like Mitchell and Phillips have less lower level success and always looked less impressive coming up the ranks, so for Young it's less technical (there are compromises, but the low hands that get caught against bounce will help in Asia for example) and more mental. He needs to put the boot in like Mitchell and Phillips often do. Atm he's Tom Latham but in a harder era to break into the side. If it was 2012 he is getting an extended run yesterday.

But yeah agreed, we need to put miles into the likes of Mariu, Severin and Parkes. There are no shortcuts for young batsmen like there are for bowlers. You only show you're ready with runs.

 

[jcas0167]

Yeah, I know. Unfortunately I can't make it sound less whacky without revealing the source of the info, and I don't think that's something I should do online.

The other issue with this theory is that Stead wasn't in Bangladesh. Ronchi was acting coach with Flynn and Oram. Although Stead may of course have had input it sounds as though Ronchi and Southee would be tour selectors. Ultimately, they have stuck with Nicholls through thick and thin, he was coming off good Plunket Shield form and had a double ton in his last test. They were always going to give him a last chance.

Stuff

www.stuff.co.nz

 

[straw man]

Hmm, believe serious and plausible explanation, or conspiracy theory about Stead

It was the selection chicken imo

 

[Ghost75]

I’d love to see NZC invest in some young talent and put together an Emerging Players team of the best under 25 talent to do a decent tour every off season rather than them playing club cricket somewhere. Have them play proper first class games
A current team could look like
Cumming
Mariu
Bettleheim
Severin
Heaphy
Robinson
Abbas
J.Mckenzie
Tashkoff
Hay
Chu
Foulkes
Clarke
Fisher
Olliver
Ashok

 

[Bahnz]

Plot twist - it was stead himself who talks in the third person

Hole in one

 

[Flem274*]

Interesting from Ruben love on senz just now

"Long story short, I always wanted to be a cricketer growing up. If cricket was more receptive and more respectful I definitely would have chosen cricket but the Hurricanes came along and were more respectful. I'd love to do what Goldie did and give cricket a crack one day but rugby is my focus for now."

 

[James]

Simon Doull speaking to Martin Devlin today and comparing Kane's record against the big 3 (India, Australia, England) vs Crowe's record against the big 3 of his generation (Australia, West Indies , Pakistan) . And in the process, Crowe's record standing up better than Kane's who's runs are coming against easier opposition.. Food for thought at least when comparing the two greats on who comes out on top.

 

[RMBolton]

Australia is the better team on paper, & they translated that paper strength onto the field. I don't see where the "mental block" comes into it.

If NZ was the better team on paper & couldn't win a series at home, then you've got a case for a mental block, but otherwise it's just getting beaten. It's the severity of the beating that's embarrassing combined with the fact that most of the squad have near no experience in NZ conditions, certainly no Test experience (all except Smith, Khawaja, Hazlewood, Lyon & Marsh).

Now, does that mean the Test was unwinnable? Not by any means, but too many things needed to go right, & it's frustrating that it is like that, but it is what it is.

 

[SteveNZ]

Australia is the better team on paper, & they translated that paper strength onto the field. I don't see where the "mental block" comes into it.

If NZ was the better team on paper & couldn't win a series at home, then you've got a case for a mental block, but otherwise it's just getting beaten. It's the severity of the beating that's embarrassing combined with the fact that most of the squad have near no experience in NZ conditions, certainly no Test experience (all except Smith, Khawaja, Hazlewood, Lyon & Marsh).

Now, does that mean the Test was unwinnable? Not by any means, but too many things needed to go right, & it's frustrating that it is like that, but it is what it is.

You can still be the lesser team on paper and suffer a mental block. I can't agree with you that there's no mental block. In the last 32 Tests v Australia, we have won one of them. Lost 24 of them. To put that math in context, we could play 11 three-matches series, and win a single Test. If you were born in mid 1993 or later, you are coming up 31 and seen NZ beat Australia once. Is that playing the odds of how often we should compete and win, or is that a mental block against a nation that we either feel inferior to, are scared of, or are too desperate to prove ourselves against?

I watched us in the T20s and at the Basin, and simple skills were not being executed. Plans (if they exist) seemed to go out the window. That, to me, is a mental block. Yes, Australia are a good side. But we've competed with good sides recently - we beat a rampant England side and competed in all three Tests in 2022 on the crest of their wave (choked, though), won a WTC final, etc. I know Australia are probably a better side than us from 1 to 11, but we're just not competing, we're not executing our skills. We're not free. We're mentally blocked up.

 

[RMBolton]

In some fairness, I've never been up on the psychology side. It's something I've always struggled with.
I'll repeat that not winning a home Test in a generation is shameful, though, & with Australia touring less there are fewer opportunities to win in friendlier conditions:

• 2000s: 6 Home Tests in 2 series
• 2010s: 4 Tests in 2 series
• 2020s: probably 2 Tests in 1 series

Is there a reason that this team (that should be, on paper, one of the better NZ sides) seems to do worse than, say, Taylor &co in 2011, or Fleming &co in 2001? And why did they at least achieve more in Australia than they could at home, while this lot couldn't even do that? I can feel myself coming around to/beginning to understand the mental block idea in real time.

From what I've seen of the younger generation of players, they don't seem as affected. Hopefully those who'll join them share their outlook.