Trescothick - Why can't he take his home test form abroad?

[a massive zebra]

Why can't he take his home test form abroad?

During his ventures into NZ he averages 28.33, while in Australia he averages 26.10, WI he averages 23.71, Pakistan he averages 24.83 and in SL he averages 24.58. He does have good records in India and Bangladesh but you can hardly call the Indian pitches bowler friendy and Bangladesh are useless. Whereas his home record is superb with 2373 runs @ 53.93. I had no idea his career had encompassed such widespread failures across the board overseas. This is all the more fascinating because the pitches in England are far more bowler friendly than everywhere bar perhaps NZ.

But, I digress. Now this thread has been created he will probably make 500 runs in the SA series.

 

[Barney Rubble]

Had no idea the difference in his home and away form was that pronounced. I think it may be less to do with the pitches and more to do with his mindset - for example (this is just off the top of my head) I went to a Twenty20 game at Somerset, the only one he played last year, while he was in a pretty poor patch of form if I remember right - not a great ODI series v NZ and WI, after an average test series v NZ. People were starting to get on his back a little at that time, but then he comes back to Somerset where he is loved by the crowds, gets a little bit of support and confidence, and goes and smashes 56 off 29 balls - he reached his 50 after 5.4 overs!

I think he just needs to bat in an environment where he's comfortable, and foreign crowds perhaps intimidate him a little. It's strange that it's that pronounced though - for your home average to be double your away average, there's got to be something wrong.

 

[twctopcat]

Don't want to say it but plenty of others will: Flat tracks.

 

[Richard]

Personally I think it's just coincidence.
In the first 2 years of Trescothick's career he had a lot of luck - that luck gifted him most runs in the summers of 2000 and 2002. It didn't gift him quite so many in the winters of 2001\02 and 2000\01 (nonetheless he passed 50 on 4 occasions when he should not have done).
In 2003 he didn't actually bat well at all - it was part of a run of failures that encompassed the winters of 2002\03 and 2003\04. Except, of course, for that match at The Oval in 2003. Indeed, if you take his home record before this summer (when he bucked many trends) and look at his average in Oval Tests and elsewhere, you'll see that it's in fact a case of he's nowhere near as good away from The Oval as he is anywhere else.
I would not be at all surprised to see Trescothick fail in all the authentic Tests of the up-and-coming 10 months. Except, of course, these results will quite possibly be skewed by the fact that there are two Bangladesh games in the middle of them.

 

[Neil Pickup]

I'll agree with the first sentence of that.

 

[Legglancer]

His footwork is akin to one Aviska gunawdena

 

[Richard]

I'll agree with the first sentence of that.

Blimey, that's a pretty-unusual.

 

[Richard]

His footwork is akin to one Aviska gunawdena

Maybe.
Still, he's just a bit better than Dihan Avishka!
How he's got the number of ODIs he has totally baffles me. Same way the selection of Thilina Kandamby had to be one of the worst ever.
And don't even get me started on K Eric Upashantha. Certainly the worst bowler I've ever seen picked for international cricket.
Well, of those selected because the selectors believed he's a good bowler. Ie, Junaid Zia (paternal bias), Tinashe Panyangara, Elton Chigumbura, Blessing Mahwire and co. (skin colour) don't count.

 

[Langeveldt]

but then he comes back to Somerset where he is loved by the crowds, gets a little bit of support and confidence,

If you go to the old pavilion end and sit with some of the oldies (I have to because its the best photographing spot), you'll find out that Caddick and Trescothick are hated figures.. I find it a bit disgraceful really, but the whingers will die soon probably anyway...

 

[marc71178]

Personally I think it's just coincidence.
In the first 2 years of Trescothick's career he had a lot of luck - that luck gifted him most runs in the summers of 2000 and 2002. It didn't gift him quite so many in the winters of 2001\02 and 2000\01 (nonetheless he passed 50 on 4 occasions when he should not have done).
In 2003 he didn't actually bat well at all - it was part of a run of failures that encompassed the winters of 2002\03 and 2003\04. Except, of course, for that match at The Oval in 2003. Indeed, if you take his home record before this summer (when he bucked many trends) and look at his average in Oval Tests and elsewhere, you'll see that it's in fact a case of he's nowhere near as good away from The Oval as he is anywhere else.
I would not be at all surprised to see Trescothick fail in all the authentic Tests of the up-and-coming 10 months. Except, of course, these results will quite possibly be skewed by the fact that there are two Bangladesh games in the middle of them.

Of course, he's yet another lucky player isn't he?

A bit like Pollock and McGrath

 

[Richard]

Yep - except of course that's totally inconceivable, isn't it - Test-match statistics cannot be incorrect or misleading.
A player with good stats has to have performed well.

 

[marc71178]

Remind me how many wickets McGrath and Pollock have?

Now keep a straight face in saying that that is all down to luck.

 

[Richard]

I can quite easily keep a straight face when telling you that far more of McGrath and Pollock's wickets since 2001 have come due to poor strokes than good deliveries.
Of course, that translates, as far as you're concerned, into "they're lucky bowlers" - because that's what would suit you best if I'd said it.

 

[Camel56]

Not good enough. Simple as that.

 

[tooextracool]

Don't want to say it but plenty of others will: Flat tracks.

nope trescothick has problems against bowlers that are capable of getting it upto a high pace. hes a master of hammering medium paced trundlers on flat lifeless wickets. its no coinidence that gillespie,ntini,best and edwards have dismissed him 21 times in total and that the only test he succeeded against the WI in the recent series was the one in which neither of them played in at edgbaston. i wouldnt be surprised at all if tresco failed both in SA and against australia

 

[Magrat Garlick]

nope trescothick has problems against bowlers that are capable of getting it upto a high pace. hes a master of hammering medium paced trundlers on flat lifeless wickets. its no coinidence that gillespie,ntini,best and edwards have dismissed him 21 times in total and that the only test he succeeded against the WI in the recent series was the one in which neither of them played in at edgbaston. i wouldnt be surprised at all if tresco failed both in SA and against australia

Which fails to explain why he can dismiss pace with ease in ODIs - pace, surely, must be the same everywhere even though the ball lands in different positions?

I'm leaning more towards Barney Rubble's theory...there is a whole 12 point difference in averages in ODIs as well (44 at home, 32 away), and Tresco even struggled in Zimbabwe and Bangladesh (although one series doesn't say that much, statistically). It might be that he simply gets easily intimidated by unfamiliar conditions.

 

[tooextracool]

Which fails to explain why he can dismiss pace with ease in ODIs - pace, surely, must be the same everywhere even though the ball lands in different positions?

nope because most of them are played on flat lifeless pitches.....its a combination of pace and any amount of help from the wicket that hurts him.

 

[marc71178]

I can quite easily keep a straight face when telling you that far more of McGrath and Pollock's wickets since 2001 have come due to poor strokes than good deliveries.

Whilst ignoring the countless superb balls they bowl that don't get wickets...

Every ball is not an inddividual event, these 2 are the best at piling on the pressure and inducing the mistake, hence they have so many wickets.

 

[twctopcat]

nope trescothick has problems against bowlers that are capable of getting it upto a high pace. hes a master of hammering medium paced trundlers on flat lifeless wickets. its no coinidence that gillespie,ntini,best and edwards have dismissed him 21 times in total and that the only test he succeeded against the WI in the recent series was the one in which neither of them played in at edgbaston. i wouldnt be surprised at all if tresco failed both in SA and against australia

Speed isn't the key with trescothick, he's done fine against the likes of Akhtar etc.Its bounce off a length that does him, like a lot of batsmen. If he can read the pitch (i.e its flat and true) he can usually make a good fist of it: see edgbaston against mcgrath this year.

 

[Legglancer]

Maybe.
Still, he's just a bit better than Dihan Avishka!
How he's got the number of ODIs he has totally baffles me. Same way the selection of Thilina Kandamby had to be one of the worst ever.
And don't even get me started on K Eric Upashantha. Certainly the worst bowler I've ever seen picked for international cricket.
Well, of those selected because the selectors believed he's a good bowler. Ie, Junaid Zia (paternal bias), Tinashe Panyangara, Elton Chigumbura, Blessing Mahwire and co. (skin colour) don't count.

I have to agree with your assesment sir ..... I think thay did quite well in England playing for Sri Lanka A (especially Kandamby) which warrented their seletion perhaps unfortunately !