The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[Red]

Take your point on Ramprakash, Crawley and Hick. Hick and Ramps averaged above 50 in FC cricket and Crawley averaged high 40s. But their test averages were poor.

Guess they came out of a relatively soft FC era in England and in the international arena came up against Australia at the peak of her powers, plus a WIs team containing Ambrose and Walsh, a Pakistan team containing Wasim and Waqar, and a SA team with Donald, DeVilliers and S.Pollock

 

[Burgey]

Name me 5 keepers from England with more dismissals than him.

Fmd this is a post of rarified idiocy.

 

[marc71178]

My point re Hick, Ramps and Crawley was yes they all failed in the end, but the thought was in the right place. They just didnt deliver with the goods. Still had higher ceilings with the bat then Russell did, and thats what you have to consider when selecting batsman surely

Its easy to point how bad a move it was in hindsight when they all ended up with super crappy career stats, especially in their final years post Russell retirement anyway

Funnily enough, some people were saying the same thing without hindsight, as in when it was actually happening.

 

[marc71178]

Take your point on Ramprakash, Crawley and Hick. Hick and Ramps averaged above 50 in FC cricket and Crawley averaged high 40s. But their test averages were poor.

Guess they came out of a relatively soft FC era in England and in the international arena came up against Australia at the peak of her powers, plus a WIs team containing Ambrose and Walsh, a Pakistan team containing Wasim and Waqar, and a SA team with Donald, DeVilliers and S.Pollock

Off the top of my head, almost all of those bowlers played county cricket back in that era. Their problem was that they just weren't good enough at the higher level.

 

[bagapath]

All-time SL Test XI


Sanath Jayasuriya
Tilakaratna Dilshan
Kumar Sangakara
Mahela Jayawardane
Aravinda De Silva
Angelo Mathews *
Chandimal +
Chaminda Vaas
Lasith Malinga
Rangana Herath
Muralitharan

Manager: Arjuna Ranatunga

 

[Zinzan]

Who wins my greatest Indian/Aust test combined XI vs. Pak/SA combined to be played on a typical Lords wicket?

Note: No Bradman

Ind-Australia

Trumper
Gavaskar
Ponting
Tendulkar
Border*
Miller
Gilchrist+
Davidson
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

Unlucky to miss out

Lindwall, O'Reilly, Chappell (Border shades him being a leftie), Kapil


Pak-Africa

Richards
Smith
Miandad
G Pollock
Kallis
de Villiers+
Faulkner
Imran*
Wasim
Steyn
Donald

Unlucky to miss out

Procter, Adcock, Waqar, Tayfield

 

[OverratedSanity]

It's Lord's. The team with McGrath wins.

 

[bagapath]

Who wins my greatest Indian/Aust test combined XI vs. Pak/SA combined to be played on a typical Lords wicket?

Note: No Bradman

Ind-Australia

Trumper
Gavaskar
Ponting
Tendulkar
Border*
Miller
Gilchrist+
Davidson
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

Unlucky to miss out

Lindwall, O'Reilly, Chappell (Border shades him being a leftie), Kapil


Pak-Africa

Richards
Smith
Miandad
G Pollock
Kallis
de Villiers+
Faulkner
Imran*
Wasim
Steyn
Donald

Unlucky to miss out

Procter, Adcock, Waqar, Tayfield

Throwing in a combined WI-ENG XI for a triangular tournament

Hutton *
Hobbs
V. Richards
Lara
Hammond
Sobers
Botham
Knott +
Marshall
Trueman
Laker

 

[Zinzan]

So hard to call between those 3 sides. Maybe I'll cancel it being played at Lords since I hadn't realised just how far ahead of the pack McGrath was there. So let's just be more general and say England or Australia.


Incidentally, as great as Trueman was, Marshall's sharing the new nut with Ambrose for mine. The rest I agree with.


Since we're covered the 'big 6', here's the best of the rest (SL, Bang, Zim, NZ)

Turner
Jayasuriya
Sangakkara+
Crowe*
de Silva
Willamson
Shakib
Cairns
Hadlee
Murali
Bond

Tempted to play Andy Flower, but hey when you can choose Sanga as your keeper & realise Flower wasn't a better pure batsman than Crowe, KW or de Silva (in spite of averaging more), he misses out.

Also unlucky to miss out are, Cowie, Vaas, Streak, Dempster & Jayawardene

Handy bowling attack of

Hadlee
Bond
Cairns
Shakib
Murali

On a seamers deck I'd probably play Streak, Vaas or Cowie ahead of Shakib.

There's also probably a very good argument to play Jayawardene as opener above Turner.

 

[Red]

A team of the leftovers from all nations

Lawry
Greenidge
Ponting
G.Chappell
Flower +
S.Waugh *
Kapil
S.Pollock
Holding
SF Barnes
OReilly

 

[Zinzan]

I had Ponting in my Ind-Aust XI above since Bradman didn't qualify.

 

[Red]

I'd probably go with Kanhai or Walcott at #3 then.

 

[watson]

I'd probably go with Kanhai or Walcott at #3 then.

Nice shot to get off the mark from Kanhai who is at his best in this video. The other batsman is the defensive Seymour Nurse.

 

[Red]

L.Hutton
S.Gavaskar
D.Bradman
S.Tendulkar
V.Richards
G.Sobers
A.Gilchrist
W.Akram
M.Marshall
S.Warne
G.McGrath


Can't imagine a combo of bowlers in an ATG team that would be better than this. Has everything.

 

[harsh.ag]

Sure you can:

Imran (instead of Sobers)
Wasim
Warne
Barnes
Murali

This is the attack with everything. Remove either of Imran/Wasim if the consideration is only 4 bowlers + Sobers.

 

[Zinzan]

I'm assuming he was meaning not using any of those same bowlers


So

Ambrose
Imran (as the AR)
Davidson
Hadlee
Murali

wWouldn't be bad if you wanted the leftie to match Wasim...

 

[Blocky]

L.Hutton
S.Gavaskar
D.Bradman
S.Tendulkar
V.Richards
G.Sobers
A.Gilchrist
W.Akram
M.Marshall
S.Warne
G.McGrath


Can't imagine a combo of bowlers in an ATG team that would be better than this. Has everything.

I'd still bin Tendulkar for Sangakkara and arguably Sobers for Kallis.

 

[Red]

I'd still bin Tendulkar for Sangakkara and arguably Sobers for Kallis.

It's not like more needs to be said about Sachin, so I'll be brief, but he is by far the best batsman I've seen in terms of adaptability to conditions and being equally adept against quality pace and spin. Near perfect technique. As good as Sanga was, he doesn't edge Sachin out imo.

Re. Sobers/Kallis....no way. Sobers was as dynamic as Lara, perhaps more, and you can factor in his bowling as well. Gun fielder too. Once again, as good as Kallis was, there is no way he is displacing Sobers in an ATG XI. If you think so, I'd like to hear your reasons.

 

[Red]

Sure you can:

Imran (instead of Sobers)
Wasim
Warne
Barnes
Murali

This is the attack with everything. Remove either of Imran/Wasim if the consideration is only 4 bowlers + Sobers.

By everything, I meant the ability to take 20 wickets in a test, rather than all varieties

McGrath and Marshall are peerless in terms of adaptability in all conditions. I've not seen two quicks less reliant on conditions being in their favour, because they were so good that most all conditions were in their favour.

Wasim because of his sheer pace, aggression, left armed-ness- but most importantly his ability with the old ball. Better than handy at #8 or #9 with the bat as well.

Warne because I've never seen a player with more will to win tests. Say what you like about him, he was ultra competitive, and gave everything he had. Add to that he was the greatest spinner of all time.

And Sobers to provide some overs if required.

 

[Coronis]

By everything, I meant the ability to take 20 wickets in a test, rather than all varieties

McGrath and Marshall are peerless in terms of adaptability in all conditions. I've not seen two quicks less reliant on conditions being in their favour, because they were so good that most all conditions were in their favour.

Wasim because of his sheer pace, aggression, left armed-ness- but most importantly his ability with the old ball. Better than handy at #8 or #9 with the bat as well.

Warne because I've never seen a player with more will to win tests. Say what you like about him, he was ultra competitive, and gave everything he had. Add to that he was the greatest spinner of all time.

And Sobers to provide some overs if required.

Bold claim. (pun intended)