South Africa team selection

[Bahseph]

Thought I'd bring my thoughts here. Rassie has exceeded expectations, and the four main bowlers were good last night, not excellent, but they bowled well. That's all the positives I have.

I think we went indepth about the problems after the second and third losses and now it's just a repeat of the same issues. Although I was really counting on Andile yesterday. He has been one of our best players at the tournament but he almost single handedly lost the game with his bowling. I don't get Faf's thinking either, I would have tried to sneak in a Markram over or two knowing how poor Andile was.

Miller had some tough chances but I've seen him take tougher ones. It really hit home that we wouldn't be winning when Tahir could have had three wickets in an over and he didn't get any.

The sad part is there really isn't anything that can be done for the last three games. Keep playing Markram, QDK, Rassie, Ngidi, Rabada and Phehlukwayo. The others probably won't be around for very long. I'd say play Shamsi but I don't think he is the answer. I see us turning to Bjorn or Keshav soon,heck, maybe even a Muthusamy if he can contribute more with the bat.

 

[StephenZA]

Players have bad days. Not gonna blame Andile. We were 20 runs short because the batsmen kept getting out at the wrong time. So our batting, not unexpectedly, gave us problems. We had hoped that our bowling would be able to get us out of tight jams but it has no happened.

Just keep on playing the same team, not going to find anything out by bringing Shamsi in. Nobody else to really give experience too...

Unless Faf brings his hammer into the back room....

 

[StephenZA]

In all honesty I lost interest from a SA point of view in this WC after we lost to Bangladesh.... I`m looking forward to the future which should have started 2 years ago but hopefully will start in India. I want to see a complete overall for the Indian tour, a look towards the future and I don't care if we get completely pommelled I want to see them give the youngsters and future opportunities.

 

[Bahseph]

Definitely. But other than the innings against Bangladesh I don't think the bowlers have been bad. They have been perfectly okay and if we had more runs in us we could have beaten New Zealand today and possibly Bangladesh and England.

I won't be too harsh on Andile because I genuinely feel he has been one of our best players, but the make up of the team doesn't afford one of our guys having an off day with the ball. New Zealand can call on Neesham, India have Kedhar Jadhav and Shankar, England have Stokes etc. We don't have that extra option.

 

[MrPrez]

Definitely. But other than the innings against Bangladesh I don't think the bowlers have been bad. They have been perfectly okay and if we had more runs in us we could have beaten New Zealand today and possibly Bangladesh and England.

I won't be too harsh on Andile because I genuinely feel he has been one of our best players, but the make up of the team doesn't afford one of our guys having an off day with the ball. New Zealand can call on Neesham, India have Kedhar Jadhav and Shankar, England have Stokes etc. We don't have that extra option.

Therein lies the problem. A bowling attack with KG, Lungi and Tahir should ensure our bowling is much better than "OK."

Realistically we need them to be ripping batting line-ups apart so our batting gets lower targets. Batting has unfortunately been about what was expected of it. Bowling has not carried us as much as we needed.

 

[StephenZA]

@ Bahseph. I don't disagree with anything you said there, and the bowlers have been good. But we needed Rabada and co to be great to give us a chance this WC. For whatever reasons/excuses/unfortunate events that has led to this poor performance I don't really care at the moment (other than for players and administration to learn lessons).

What I care about now is how are we going to rebuild. And I am of the opinion that we need to be brutal at every level, no *****footing around.

 

[Bahseph]

I agree with both of you @MrPrez and StephenZA. They shouldn't have been okay. They were our guns. And we have been saying for over a year that our chances hinge on our bowlers. My point is that good teams have a plan B,hence the extra bowling option comment. Our bowlers have had no support from our batting. I think we are all making the same point here though haha.

Once QDK got out i knew it was an uphill struggle because he transfers pressure back onto the bowlers. I am excited about an overhaul. I just hope they don't wait until after the T20 WC to do it. I REALLY don't want to see Duminy there. And I acknowledge that he has been a gun for us in T20 cricket.

 

[Heboric]

I was never a fan of Jennings

https://www.sport24.co.za/Cricket/C...-world-cup-u-turn-is-a-rubbish-story-20190621

 

[MrPrez]

I was never a fan of Jennings

https://www.sport24.co.za/Cricket/C...-world-cup-u-turn-is-a-rubbish-story-20190621

"I'd expect something like this from an arrogant Kevin Pietersen or Graeme Smith, but definitely not AB."

Wow. What a prick.

 

[harsh.ag]

How did Graeme Smith get lumped in with KP

 

[Bolo]

How did Graeme Smith get lumped in with KP

Personal bad blood. Rsa captains have never picked coaches, but Smith got Jennings sacked after he took the captaincy. Jennings is not the most personable character- not particularly surprised he holds a grudge.

 

[SeamUp]

Personal bad blood. Rsa captains have never picked coaches, but Smith got Jennings sacked after he took the captaincy. Jennings is not the most personable character- not particularly surprised he holds a grudge.

Yeah loads of truth.

He used to hit catches for discipline. Hard one's and they got harder.

Once he did it with Graeme Smith and actually injured him on the morning of a test.

Also Makhaya has a few stories to tell about Ray. He felt he was being picked on and of course Ray was saying he was pushing his buttons to get the best out of him.

 

[Prince EWS]

One of the most disappointing things for South Africa would be that most of the players who would've come into the tournament with the most question marks over them in terms of experience/team balance/overall quality - Rassie, Morris and Lucky - have actually been pretty good. Lucky did have that one shocker and his stats are slightly padded by bossing Afghanistan but he's still averaging 32 with the bat and 34 with the ball which they definitely would've taken, Rassie is averaging over 50 with the bat at a strike rate well above his career figure and Morris has actually been more effective in this tournament than pretty much every other decent quality international series he's ever played.

Duminy, Miller, Amla and Rabada - and to a lesser extent de Kock too - who have been staples for ages have been the biggest disappointments, along with I Markram I suppose.

 

[GoodAreasShane]

Morris bowling well is bad news really for South Africa as he will probably be retained after the tournament to keep on being a spud for a couple of years longer. Makes Wayne Parnell look reliable.

 

[StephenZA]

One of the most disappointing things for South Africa would be that most of the players who would've come into the tournament with the most question marks over them in terms of experience/team balance/overall quality - Rassie, Morris and Lucky - have actually been pretty good. Lucky did have that one shocker and his stats are slightly padded by bossing Afghanistan but he's still averaging 32 with the bat and 34 with the ball which they definitely would've taken, Rassie is averaging over 50 with the bat at a strike rate well above his career figure and Morris has actually been more effective in this tournament than pretty much every other decent quality international series he's ever played.

Duminy, Miller, Amla and Rabada - and to a lesser extent de Kock too - who have been staples for ages have been the biggest disappointments, along with I Markram I suppose.

Markram has been the biggest disappointment. Rabada has not been bad just not good, he actually looks tired... i`m not sure maybe he is just down. Ngidi should not be playing, the way he is running in the field and bowling makes me feel he is still fighting injury or something. Duminy and Miller have had a question over them for years, just performed sporadically that gave us hope. We've known that Amla has been cooked for awhile. We just hoped he could stabilise the top order. Andile has been good he has actually being doing the job for awhile now, relatively consistent performer. Rassie and Morris performances have been great, but worry they may give a life span to a career when we need to rebuild from scratch.

Of this team/squad Andile, Markram, Ngidi and Rabada and maybe Dusssen is the only members I want to see again in a LO squad.

 

[harsh.ag]

"Maybe" Dussen. What are you on that makes you think there are better options?

 

[MrPrez]

One of the most disappointing things for South Africa would be that most of the players who would've come into the tournament with the most question marks over them in terms of experience/team balance/overall quality - Rassie, Morris and Lucky - have actually been pretty good. Lucky did have that one shocker and his stats are slightly padded by bossing Afghanistan but he's still averaging 32 with the bat and 34 with the ball which they definitely would've taken, Rassie is averaging over 50 with the bat at a strike rate well above his career figure and Morris has actually been more effective in this tournament than pretty much every other decent quality international series he's ever played.

Duminy, Miller, Amla and Rabada - and to a lesser extent de Kock too - who have been staples for ages have been the biggest disappointments, along with I Markram I suppose.

You're sort of right, but I somewhat see it as a plus that guys like Duminy, Miller, and Amla haven't been great (as opposed to others failing instead) as they'll hopefluly not get many more opportunities moving forward anyway. Guys like Rassie and Quinton will surely be around next world cup, so them doing okay is a REALLY small positive to take from the valley of death.

Morris bowling well is bad news really for South Africa as he will probably be retained after the tournament to keep on being a spud for a couple of years longer. Makes Wayne Parnell look reliable.

Woah there, lets not go over the top.

 

[MrPrez]

"Maybe" Dussen. What are you on that makes you think there are better options?

A lot of us want to see a radical shift to youth. VDD is already 30.

He will probably be around still at 34 but he's in his form of his life atm and is unlikely to keep it up for particularly long over the next four years.

I'd absolutely play him in the near future, however, but I doubt he's seen as a likelihood in 2023.

 

[SeamUp]

Of this team/squad Andile, Markram, Ngidi and Rabada and maybe Dusssen is the only members I want to see again in a LO squad.

Quinton too of course ?

 

[SeamUp]

A lot of us want to see a radical shift to youth. VDD is already 30.

He will probably be around still at 34 but he's in his form of his life atm and is unlikely to keep it up for particularly long over the next four years.

I'd absolutely play him in the near future, however, but I doubt he's seen as a likelihood in 2023.

I think he will have to stay around. I guess he deserves 2 years and we re-assess which gives another young player 2 years before the WC if necessary.

The crazy thing in the press is that there are people that think Bavuma is going to make a difference to the team. That is the worry and it is a massive one.