So what does the future hold for West Indies?

[WindieWeathers]

Only way Deonarine plays is if we drop the spinner IMO but this topic isn't about the South Africa series anyway.

That theory is merely your opinion because your mentality is "Nash plays at all costs", the truth is Deo has worked with Gibson AND IMPRESSED while Nash hasn't, so nothing is set in stone until the team is named.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Jason Holder bowls at 125 clicks. Not many seamers of that speed are test class, and there's only been one world class seamer of that pace that I recall (Sid Barnes). He's also still a teenager.

Playing him anytime soon would be a bad idea.

Well apparently the speed gun at the recent u19 world cup had Holder at 80-82mph, whatever the case we also have to take into account the lad's height which is 6 foot 8, bowling from that height can be a massive weapon, he's gonna be in the A-team and we'll see how he gets on, if he impresses then i see no reason whatsoever why he shouldn't be in the test side, he may be young but he's built like a monster.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Jason Holder has two first-class wickets and he's close to being in the test team, and some people think he'll come in and do well right away It's Tim Southee all over again barring the domestic success. Southee took a bucket load of wickets against a strong Indian under 19 team during their tour to New Zealand, he was then named player of the tournament at the 2008 under 19 world cup, he also took a bucket load of domestic wickets that season and made the test team a month later. Barring his game against England he's been inconsistant and in and out of the team for two years.

Young bowlers take a long time to develop, if I had to guess Holder wouldn't be test class for at least five years, bowlers just take so long to develop at the next level.

With all due respect comparing every young bowler to Southee is futile, you only have to look at what Aamer is doing for Pakistan for evidence, Holder may be young but he's already built like Pollard so one could argue that physically he could handle test cricket right now, i know he lacks experience but the kid is the real deal, as i said before if he impresses for the A-team then he should be considered, he'll be under the guidence of one of the best bowling coaches in the world in Ottis Gibson so i'm confident he'll be looked after.

 

[shivfan]

That theory is merely your opinion because your mentality is "Nash plays at all costs", the truth is Deo has worked with Gibson AND IMPRESSED while Nash hasn't, so nothing is set in stone until the team is named.

Nash hasn't impressed?

Under which rock were you living when Nash was the second-highest run-getter for the West Indies in the last Test series?

You're clutching at straws, and hoping against hope that Gibson has the same warped standards for selecting players that you do....

 

[WindieWeathers]

Well said, roseboy, guys....

So what if Holder or Gabriel take a string of wickets against Zimbabwe? There is a vast difference in quality between Zimbabwe and South Africa. I'm sure Gibson has his head screwed on (unlike someone I know ) and will keep that promising pacer in the squad for the tours of Bangladesh and England. Players like Holder need quite a bit more FC experience before they're subjected to run-making machines like Smith and Kallis. There's a significant difference between bowling at Smith, Kallis and deVilliers on one hand, and Mazakadza, Mahmudullah and Denly on the other....

Different day but you're still spinning the same record i see Mike!! , erm so what exactly was Roach doing before he got into the test team? was he taking wicket after wicket for Barbados? nope, these young bowlers have that thing called TALENT, i guess i shouldn't be surprised that you're against the youngsters getting a chance because you've apparently set your heart on "grandpa" Pedro Collins getting a recall!!, the same man who Lionel Baker totally blew out of the water last season!! , even if i wanted youngsters like Brandon Bess or Nelon Pascal to get a chance, who've played loads of FC cricket and have taken wickets you'd still find excuses, because like i've said in the past you just can't let go of the status quo.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Nash hasn't impressed?

Under which rock were you living when Nash was the second-highest run-getter for the West Indies in the last Test series?

You're clutching at straws, and hoping against hope that Gibson has the same warped standards for selecting players that you do....

Are you not reading my posts properly now Mike? i said Deonarine has "WORKED WITH GIBSON and impressed", has Nash worked with Gibson yet?

 

[WindieWeathers]

Oh, haven't you heard? He impressed in a T20 against Lancashire.

He's the real deal.

You forgot to mention that he also took three wickets for only six runs against the University of West Indies in the same competition ,

Where's Hazlewood these days?!!


P.S. is posting for effect a trend on this forum now?!! .

 

[Craig]

You forgot to mention that he also took three wickets for only six runs against the University of West Indies in the same competition ,

Where's Hazlewood these days?!!


P.S. is posting for effect a trend on this forum now?!! .

Enjoying his off season since the Australian season finished on Sunday

 

[Flem274*]

Well apparently the speed gun at the recent u19 world cup had Holder at 80-82mph, whatever the case we also have to take into account the lad's height which is 6 foot 8, bowling from that height can be a massive weapon, he's gonna be in the A-team and we'll see how he gets on, if he impresses then i see now reason whatsoever why he shouldn't be in the test side, he may be young but he's built like a monster.

Jacob Oram is a beast, if not quite as tall (I'm not sure on his height). He bowled for the majority of his career at 125-135kmh and got tennis ball bounce, and he was only a test class seamer.

Holder being a beast doesn't mean he'll have success.

With all due respect comparing every young bowler to Southee is futile, you only have to look at what Aamer is doing for Pakistan for evidence, Holder may be young but he's already built like Pollard so one could argue that physically he could handle test cricket right now, i know he lacks experience but the kid is the real deal, as i said before if he impresses for the A-team then he should be considered, he'll be under the guidence of one of the best bowling coaches in the world in Ottis Gibson so i'm confident he'll be looked after.

Holder cannot be compared to Aamer. Aamer is light years ahead of Holder (and so is Southee).

 

[GotSpin]

Do you have a personal vendetta against him? I believe this thread is meant to discuss the future of the West Indies. Not Hazlewood's

 

[WindieWeathers]

Enjoying his off season since the Australian season finished on Sunday

I wasn't asking NZ fans!!

 

[Prince EWS]

Do you have a personal vendetta against him? I believe this thread is meant to discuss the future of the West Indies. Not Hazlewood's

Yeah, I don't know why he always replies to my posts with stuff about Hazelwood. I don't think I've posted much on this forum about Hazelwood at all; certainly not anything favourable. Maybe he's just pigeon-holed me as "lives in Australia so must love Hazelwood" or something; I don't get it.

 

[Flem274*]

I wasn't asking NZ fans!!

Just coz you got shot down in flames.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Holder cannot be compared to Aamer. Aamer is light years ahead of Holder (and so is Southee).

Things change quickly in this game, Aamer and Holder are close in age and of course Aamer has had a massive headstart, but i believe once Holder is settled in test cricket that there won't be much between them, that's how much talent Jason has in his locker, they've got two different styles of bowling anyway.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Do you have a personal vendetta against him? I believe this thread is meant to discuss the future of the West Indies. Not Hazlewood's

No it was a genuine question , btw this thread isn't for sarcastic mockery either but certain posters don't seem to have realised that too.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Yeah, I don't know why he always replies to my posts with stuff about Hazelwood. I don't think I've posted much on this forum about Hazelwood at all; certainly not anything favourable. Maybe he's just pigeon-holed me as "lives in Australia so must love Hazelwood" or something; I don't get it.

If you're mocking Holder than it's only fair to ask questions about one of the young Aussie bowlers is it not?!! unless you're another kiwi who resides in Australia?!!.

 

[Flem274*]

Things change quickly in this game, Aamer and Holder are close in age and of course Aamer has had a massive headstart, but i believe once Holder is settled in test cricket that there won't be much between them, that's how much talent Jason has in his locker, they've got two different styles of bowling anyway.

left arm swing at 150kph vs right arm whack it in at 125kph...

One is heavily condition reliant, the other a lot less so.

 

[slippyslip]

Why do people argue and debate the quality of West Indian cricketers as if that is the sole determining factor in the West Indian cricketing future?

Not until the West Indian administration improves and becomes more professional and accountable will West Indian cricket improve. Same with Pakistan. We've had a whole generation of players show potential but fall well short. Franklyn Rose and Reon King spring to mind. West Indies have not had a decent fast bowler debut since Ian Bishop.

Compare that to Australia. Australia did not get to where it is purely by talent alone. If you look back Australia went from one of the best sporting nations in the world up until the mid 70's to a mediocre one. 1976 Montreal Olympics Australia won 0 gold medals. We went from the best mens tennis country to not winning a grand slam for a decade and 7 years between 1980-87 when you include men and women. And the decline of Australian cricket is well known.

But if you look at the changes in sport (and entertainment) in the mid to late 70's things changed. Things became much more professional and Australia was caught out. As a result things like the AIS, Cricket Academy were built and sport overall became more professional.

But I see little changes in West Indian cricket. They still seem to be stuck in their glory days of the past. It could be a money thing where they dont have enough to go fully professional in all aspects. It could be a population thing, the countries of West Indies tally around 4 million people I think. Similar to that of NZ. Problems because West Indies is a group of nations rather than 1 single country.

 

[WindieWeathers]

left arm swing at 150kph vs right arm whack it in at 125kph...

One is heavily condition reliant, the other a lot less so.

I told you there's mixed reviews regarding Holder's pace, i already said they've got very different styles but what's special about Holder is the length he bowls and the way he can swing the ball too, he's also got a mean bouncer from that height. technically the kid is sound, all he needs now is experience at the higher levels of the game IMO which is why i'm looking forward to seeing how he does for the A-team if/when he's selected.

 

[Prince EWS]

If you're mocking Holder than it's only fair to ask questions about one of the young Aussie bowlers is it not?!! unless you're another kiwi who resides in Australia?!!.

Lol. I wasn't mocking Holder; I was mocking your line of argument more than anything. Even if I was mocking Holder though, it doesn't make Hazelwood in any way relevant unless I make some sort of comparison between them. I wasn't suggesting that Hazelwood was better than Holder (which probably should have been obvious given I didn't mention Hazelwood at all..); I was suggesting that impressing in one unofficial T20 game against Lancashire shouldn't get someone any closer to a Test team.

CricketWeb is a place to objectively discuss cricket; not represent your team in the great supporters war.