Players Who You Predicted Would Be Great................

[lord_of_darkness]

anyone heard about he and Sachin's partnership of 646* at the age of 12?

i wonder what the quality of opposition was like....

 

[aussie_beater]

Vinod Kambli could have been an unbelievably good player - anyone heard about he and Sachin's partnership of 646* at the age of 12? Haven't seen a lot of him, but from what I hear there didn't seem to be a good reason why he wouldn't make it - just another case of unfulfilled potential, I guess.

I have pretty much seen all the test matches that Kambli played and a good number of his ODIs as well. He had the traditional Indian batsman's weakness outside the offstump and against short pitched stuff, but his weakness outside the offstump was not compensated in any way by something other southpaws like Ganguly have, where if anything is overpitched around or outside offstump, they can play the most well-timed and glorious cover drives that can be seen in the game.Kambli was very strong on the leg side, and was excellent against spinners, but could mostly push and prod on the off side against the quicks to his own detriment and ofcourse playing short pitched bowling wasn't his forte either. The term "flat track bully" stuck with his name a little too early in his career and his attitude to the game didn't help either and he faded out from the national squad. And with the advent of Ganguly and Dravid, the Indian middle order filled up because Azharuddin was still around and so there just was no available slot for Kambli in the team, although I believe he deserved another shot at it.

 

[royGilchrist]

yeah Viv was just spectacular,

I think Imran once narrated, that Viv once came on the front foot a little too early to a ball that was short of length. The pace was fast, and he did not have the time to go back on the back foot, so using his sharp eye, he went on to pull the ball for a six over square leg.

I think one of the things with viv that is so rare these days, was the sheer sense of superiority. No one could dare intimidate him, and no matter who is bowling, he knew that he was better. Indomitable.

 

[Richard]

So it's impossible that he could've improved as a player then?

Oh, no, it's not impossible, but he clearly didn't improve at all, given that the faults were still causing his regular cheap dismissals afterwards, too.
Of course, he could have got rid of the faults then let them back in again, but that strikes me as just a little unlikely.

 

[Richard]

yet you just said that he failed time and time again against the better attacks

He did.
In the early 1990s and from 1996 onwards.
But not in the mid-90s.

 

[Richard]

hold on a second here....first you say that you were certain that players like hick were going to fail when you were 3 years old because he was heavy footed, and that "There are limitations that are easy to work around (eg Graeme Smith - plenty, some on this board, refuse to accept that as limited a player can be so brilliant).
There are weaknesses that are far less so (eg heavy-footedness)."
then you say that viv richards could get around the same weakness as hick, another contradiction from mr 'know it all' then?

No, just another attempt at manufacturing one from Mr. Not-Very-Good-At-It.
If you notice I said "less so" (ie less easy to work around). I did not say impossible to.

 

[tooextracool]

He did.
In the early 1990s and from 1996 onwards.
But not in the mid-90s.

you fool, you just said that he failed time and time again against the better attacks, then you modify it by saying that he actually succeeded against them from the early 90s-96. incase you havent realised,the phrase 'time and time again' means that he failed everytime he faced a quality attack. by your use of the phrase 'time and time again' i could say that ramprakash failed against quality attacks time and time again too then?
how many more directions are you going to twist your own statements in?

 

[tooextracool]

No, just another attempt at manufacturing one from Mr. Not-Very-Good-At-It.
If you notice I said "less so" (ie less easy to work around). I did not say impossible to.

no you said that it was fairly obvious that he was going to fail with that weakness and that you could have predicted his failure even before he played at the international level. and of course when i suggested that there have been players with the same weakness who have succeeded at the intl level you say that its 'not impossible to' do so. if its not impossible then why even suggest that something like ' he was always going to have problems with the short ball at the international level' then?

 

[Richard]

you fool, you just said that he failed time and time again against the better attacks, then you modify it by saying that he actually succeeded against them from the early 90s-96. incase you havent realised,the phrase 'time and time again' means that he failed everytime he faced a quality attack. by your use of the phrase 'time and time again' i could say that ramprakash failed against quality attacks time and time again too then?
how many more directions are you going to twist your own statements in?

I'm not going to do anything of the sort, I never do - you, on the other hand, make many, many, many very poor attempts to.
Here is yet another example.
"Time and again" means not "every time" - if I meant "every time" I would have said something along the lines of... oh... "every time", probably.
"Time and again" means, quite simply, enough times for it to be considered of note.
How many more phrases are you going to try and use incorrectly?

 

[Mingster]

I am sorry Mr Dictionary....

It's just that most people consider the phrase, "time and again", as a generalistion to "everytime".

 

[Richard]

no you said that it was fairly obvious that he was going to fail with that weakness and that you could have predicted his failure even before he played at the international level. and of course when i suggested that there have been players with the same weakness who have succeeded at the intl level you say that its 'not impossible to' do so. if its not impossible then why even suggest that something like ' he was always going to have problems with the short ball at the international level' then?

I never once said "I could have predicted it" - that's just your fifty-times-daily attempt at putting words on my keyboard.
I pointed-out that someone did predict it, so it was not as if everyone expected him to be a Test-match success.
It was about as certain to lead to the problems it did as anything is ever certain to lead to anything. No-one can be certain about anything. But in Paul Hancock (the writer of this particular 1990 article)'s case, he guessed right.
Anyone who guessed the same thing about Viv Richards (and I've never heard anything of anyone who did) would have turned-out to have guessed incorrectly.
And I don't think I've ever heard anyone else compare the two of them - so it's just possible that Viv was a bit more nible-footed than you give him credit for.

 

[Richard]

I am sorry Mr Dictionary....

It's just that most people consider the phrase, "time and again", as a generalistion to "everytime".

Exactly.
And as so often with tooextracool, he attempts to use his own mistakes against me.

 

[luckyeddie]

"Time and again" means, quite simply, enough times for it to be considered of note.

I totally agree with Richard here, as my use of the phrase in the following sentence suggests:

"Time and again, Marcus Trescothick has demonstrated that having a great eye can more than make up for paucity of footwork"

 

[dro87]

love and scuderi

What about Martin Love? I think he is sytill contracted but he's not playing very much is he? I saw him against England during the last Ashes, looked superb...
And what about Scuderi? Most people don't even know him, but he was suppost 2 be the Austrialian leading all rounder for the '90...

"CRICKINFO:Of Italian heritage, Joe Scuderi was born and raised in Queensland and seemed destined for a successful career as an all-rounder from as early as his school cricketing days. The extent of his potential was first reflected on a national scale with selection as an inductee of the Australian Cricket Academy in Adelaide in 1988; so promising did he in fact look at that time that his services duly became the subject of an intense bidding war between Queensland and South Australia in the lead-up to his first class debut (which was ultimately made with the latter) in 1988-89. From that point onward, though, such promise sadly remained substantially unfulfilled. Over the next four seasons, he was a reasonably regular member of South Australia's Sheffield Shield team and was a handy contributor, consistently averaging at close to thirty with both bat and ball. Frustratingly, though, the combination of his very correct technique with the bat and his combative medium pace never took him to the heights that were once imagined. He did string together seven matches in 1996-97 but, aside from that, played a bare six first class matches for the Redbacks beyond the 1992-93. It is a statistic that is instructive of his decline. Instead, Scuderi has since had to limit his horizons to Italy's national team and to the odd appearance for Lancashire at English domestic level around some league cricket in that county. (John Polack, April 2000) CRICKINFO"

http://www.cricinfo.com/db/PLAYERS/AUS/S/SCUDERI_JC_02006281/

 

[marc71178]

I am sorry Mr Dictionary....

It's just that most people consider the phrase, "time and again", as a generalistion to "everytime".

Richard doesn't do generalisations, he's a pedant.

 

[Richard]

And what about Scuderi? Most people don't even know him, but he was suppost 2 be the Austrialian leading all rounder for the '90...

"CRICKINFO:Of Italian heritage, Joe Scuderi was born and raised in Queensland and seemed destined for a successful career as an all-rounder from as early as his school cricketing days. The extent of his potential was first reflected on a national scale with selection as an inductee of the Australian Cricket Academy in Adelaide in 1988; so promising did he in fact look at that time that his services duly became the subject of an intense bidding war between Queensland and South Australia in the lead-up to his first class debut (which was ultimately made with the latter) in 1988-89. From that point onward, though, such promise sadly remained substantially unfulfilled. Over the next four seasons, he was a reasonably regular member of South Australia's Sheffield Shield team and was a handy contributor, consistently averaging at close to thirty with both bat and ball. Frustratingly, though, the combination of his very correct technique with the bat and his combative medium pace never took him to the heights that were once imagined. He did string together seven matches in 1996-97 but, aside from that, played a bare six first class matches for the Redbacks beyond the 1992-93. It is a statistic that is instructive of his decline. Instead, Scuderi has since had to limit his horizons to Italy's national team and to the odd appearance for Lancashire at English domestic level around some league cricket in that county. (John Polack, April 2000) CRICKINFO"

http://www.cricinfo.com/db/PLAYERS/AUS/S/SCUDERI_JC_02006281/

Good Lord, I never knew he was predicted such great things - he always looked like a wholly mediocre player to me, on the 4 or 5 occasions I saw him.

 

[dro87]

well i played against him... he is just soooo good! there's no way you'll get him out... Every time i see him play i just think why the **** is he here in italy????

 

[Richard]

Guess he must be pretty mean by Italian standards!

 

[dro87]

well in the european B championships he avg 127... not bad eh?
However our Totaly Home grown wicket-keeper Gabriele Passaretti got voted man of the tournament with 19 dismissals in 5 games... not bad either?

 

[luckyeddie]

well in the european B championships he avg 127... not bad eh?
However our Totaly Home grown wicket-keeper Gabriele Passaretti got voted man of the tournament with 19 dismissals in 5 games... not bad either?

Them's fine stats.

And don't be put off by Richard - he's what we English call 'a man of strange ideas' - and you are more than welcome to tell him to 'va fancu...' (voice trails off into distance) - well, you would be if we condoned swearing.

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