*Official* Zimbabwe in West Indies

[Beamer]

We agree on that. Will be disappointed in the tracks favor part time spinners.

Exactly. I'm trying to be happy for Zimbabwe as they have won their most significant match for ages and I have always had a soft spot for them (pre-crazy mugabe phase of course). But the reality is they are no closer to a return to test cricket. In most countries you cannot bowl part time spinners for the whole match and win.

As a proud Trini I am ashamed that a POS groundsman could produce something like that and I feel sorry for all the spectators that ignored post-carnival cost cutting and paid $300 TTD to attend that match.

 

[morgieb]

LOL @ WI losing to Zimbabwe's prank spinners. Can't serve well for them, especially their pitches.

 

[Chubb]

Zimbabwe, **** yeah!

 

[TT Boy]

Exactly. I'm trying to be happy for Zimbabwe as they have won their most significant match for ages and I have always had a soft spot for them (pre-crazy mugabe phase of course). But the reality is they are no closer to a return to test cricket. In most countries you cannot bowl part time spinners for the whole match and win.

As a proud Trini I am ashamed that a POS groundsman could produce something like that and I feel sorry for all the spectators that ignored post-carnival cost cutting and paid $300 TTD to attend that match.

WTF? That is over 30 pound sterling. Scandalous.

Hopefully tickets for the 20/20 WC are affordable for locals.

 

[roseboy64]

WTF? That is over 30 pound sterling. Scandalous.

Hopefully tickets for the 20/20 WC are affordable for locals.

Around 5 or 6 US for some tickets I've heard.

 

[shivfan]

How about score more than double the combined total runs of Barath, Fletcher, Pollard, and Bravo. Whan chasing 100, that isnt a bad thing

Exactly....

The problem with playing too many younger players in your side is that it leaves too much to be done by the few senior batsmen left in the side. We saw that problem with Gayle in Australia, and now with Shiv here at Trinidad.

These four guys were selected as batsmen. It's their job to make runs. And yet none of them could make it into double figures. At least Shiv made it into double figures....

The ODI side really needs the return of Gayle, Sarwan and Dwayne Bravo. Who knows, maybe Brathwaite will get a look-in for the final ODI....

But there's one very important thing to remember - the UWI VC team played on a totally different trinidadian pitch to the one the 20/20 was played on. Queens Park Oval was a turner where runs were hard to score on - totally different from the one at St Augustine.

It remains to be seen what the pitches in Guyana will be like, but traditionally run-scoring is usually easier. However, the WI selectors missed a trick when they didn't select more than one spinner, especially with Gayle not playing. The Zim selectors out-thought them on their home ground. I would expect both Miller and Gayle to play alongside Benn in the first ODI, unless the WI selectors have a good ODI replacement for Miller....

 

[shivfan]

While Chanderpaul is not exempt from criticism, he did get a start and possibly should have gone on to take WI closer, he should be the least of West Indian worries in that innings. He was one of the least guilty in playing brainless cricket, and if it is down to a lack of experience in the line-up, then perhaps the selectors have to look at themselves.

What Windie needs to understand is that this was a pitch where you had to graft for your runs, which were always going to be hard to come by. Rampaul's poor 19th over game the Zimbabweans a total they could defend.

Shiv made 20. If Barath, Darren Bravo, Fletcher and Pollard had each made 20 as well, the WI would've won this....

This performance showed the need for more experienced players in the lineup for the ODIs. Youth is fine, but as this performance showed, a good mixture of youth and experience is needed. Shiv was the only experienced batsman in the top five, and when he went, you felt there was no chance - much like when Gayle went in Australia, you felt that the rest of the batsmen would not put up much resistance.

 

[Langeveldt]

Great stuff from Zim.. I've been watching their domestic T20 competition which is on TV over here.. While the standard is low, the competition is a sound one, people are turning up, the games look fun, and it all looks legitimate.. Something I wouldn't have imagined happening a few years ago..

 

[WindieWeathers]

What Windie needs to understand is that this was a pitch where you had to graft for your runs, which were always going to be hard to come by. Rampaul's poor 19th over game the Zimbabweans a total they could defend.

Shiv made 20. If Barath, Darren Bravo, Fletcher and Pollard had each made 20 as well, the WI would've won this....

This performance showed the need for more experienced players in the lineup for the ODIs. Youth is fine, but as this performance showed, a good mixture of youth and experience is needed. Shiv was the only experienced batsman in the top five, and when he went, you felt there was no chance - much like when Gayle went in Australia, you felt that the rest of the batsmen would not put up much resistance.

You've been defending Shiv for the last month and still when he was poor with the bat yesterday you find a way to defend his performance again!! , yes the pitch wasn't good but if that's the case why are you putting down the youngsters? Shiv was the one who should have carried us to the finish line but yet again he got out cheaply, it's merely a continuation of the shocking form he's been in for WI for over a year, he better put things right in the ODI's otherwise i don't know how you can defend him any longer Mike.

 

[shivfan]

You've been defending Shiv for the last month and still when he was poor with the bat yesterday you find a way to defend his performance again!! , yes the pitch wasn't good but if that's the case why are you putting down the youngsters? Shiv was the one who should have carried us to the finish line but yet again he got out cheaply, it's merely a continuation of the shocking form he's been in for WI for over a year, he better put things right in the ODI's otherwise i don't know how you can defend him any longer Mike.

And your solution would be to replace him with a top four of Barath, Fletcher, Darren Bravo and Pollard!

I don't think the pitch wasn't good - it offered more assistance to the bowlers than the batsmen. It needed the batsmen to graft. If Barath made 20, Fletcher made 20, Darren Bravo made 20, and Pollard made 20, the Windies would've won. It's a bit silly to expect Shiv to score all runs for the batting side....

It's possible that Gibson may select both Braithwaite and Holder to get a feel of what it's like to be in a WI squad. We'll see....

 

[WindieWeathers]

And your solution would be to replace him with a top four of Barath, Fletcher, Darren Bravo and Pollard!

I don't think the pitch wasn't good - it offered more assistance to the bowlers than the batsmen. It needed the batsmen to graft. If Barath made 20, Fletcher made 20, Darren Bravo made 20, and Pollard made 20, the Windies would've won. It's a bit silly to expect Shiv to score all runs for the batting side....

It's possible that Gibson may select both Braithwaite and Holder to get a feel of what it's like to be in a WI squad. We'll see....

Erm who said i would have that top four you listed? come on Mike you know how i feel about people putting words in my mouth , my top four in these odi's would have been..

Brathwaite
Barath
Powell
Darren Bravo

Your last comment is very encouraging though, and it's the right thing to do imo, Gibson should look at as many options as he possibley can before South Africa come to town, i think Kraigg will grab his chance with both hands, and if he does that could be the end for "captain Gayle" , as for Holder, the kid was absolutely electric for the u19's and is clearly very talented, i knew Gibson would be licking his lips at the prospect of moulding Jason's game, i hope they also include another spinner like Kantasingh and i'd like to see Delorn Johnson given a chance so we can have a left arm pacer in the mix.

In hindsight i guess it was good that Zimbabwe won yesterday because i think our guys will be ready for war on Thursday!!, and as the comms said when we are in the mood we can destroy anyone.

 

[Beamer]

Ok, so I'm a sucker for punishment and when I got home I watched a recording of our run chase. Having watched it again dispassionately, I am a little less angry at the loss. The pitch was simply disgraceful and had a 2nd Windies spinner been picked Zimbabwe would have been bowled out for 50. The ball was turning square for Greg Lamb. Now I have seen him bowl before for Hampshire and he hardly turns a ball in anger usually.

Yes we should have made a better fist of it and yes there were some brainless shots on show when a bit of sensible batting was required. But look how much Shiv struggled to pick up singles in his innings. He has made a career out of that sort of batting, usually against much better attacks and yet just couldn't get it done and never looked like staying out there for too long tbh.

If I won the lottery and had some money to invest on West Indies cricket I would do 2 things:

1) I would pile money into the preparation of all wickets at the test grounds. Stadiums in Guyana will always be fairly slow and low as that is the nature of the soil but we could spruce up the wickets a little bit just to get a little bit more carry for the fast bowlers. Maybe drop-in pitches could be considered? Sabina Park and the Kensington Oval have pretty quick pitches more often than not even today but I would still like more grass to be kept on those wickets to help hold it together. The QPO needs to be dug up and burned pronto. Again I would consider a drop in pitch to solve this problem.

2) I would conduct 'batting against spin' clinics throughout the Caribbean and use the services of BCL (the best player of spin I have ever seen) and Shiv to try and get the message across to our current generation of FC players and various Under 19 players also. Yes conditions favour spin way too much but the block,block, bash approach that too many of our players use needs to be sorted.

 

[shivfan]

Windie, that top four would probably be four wickets down for ten runs after just two overs....

You have to have experienced batsmen in your batting lineup, as the 20/20 match showed. If you field a team of youngsters and just one experienced batsman in your top five, you're going to lose, as that match also showed. It's good to see that Gibson didn't take up your suggestion, and omitted both Darren Bravo and Powell.

Maybe it's wise to let Sarwan and Dwayne Bravo recover properly from their injuries....

As the 20/20 match shows, you shouldn't pack your side with too many inexperienced players.

This would be my XI:

1) Chris Gayle
2) Adrian Barath
3) Narsing Deonarine
4) Shiv Chanderpaul
5) Kieron Pollard
6) Dwayne Smith
7) Denesh Ramdin
8) Dave Bernard/Nikita Miller (depending on the pitch)
9) Darren Sammy
10) Suleimann Benn
11) Kemar Roach

From the 14 named, I would leave out Andre Fletcher, Ravi Rampaul and one of either Miller or Bernard....

Fletcher and Rampaul are both lucky to be in the squad, IMHO.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Windie, that top four would probably be four wickets down for ten runs after just two overs....

You have to have experienced batsmen in your batting lineup, as the 20/20 match showed. If you field a team of youngsters and just one experienced batsman in your top five, you're going to lose, as that match also showed. It's good to see that Gibson didn't take up your suggestion, and omitted both Darren Bravo and Powell.

Maybe it's wise to let Sarwan and Dwayne Bravo recover properly from their injuries....

As the 20/20 match shows, you shouldn't pack your side with too many inexperienced players.

This would be my XI:

1) Chris Gayle
2) Adrian Barath
3) Narsing Deonarine
4) Shiv Chanderpaul
5) Kieron Pollard
6) Dwayne Smith
7) Denesh Ramdin
8) Dave Bernard/Nikita Miller (depending on the pitch)
9) Darren Sammy
10) Suleimann Benn
11) Kemar Roach

From the 14 named, I would leave out Andre Fletcher, Ravi Rampaul and one of either Miller or Bernard....

Fletcher and Rampaul are both lucky to be in the squad, IMHO.

Funny because when the rumours were going around about Brathwaite and Holder coming in you wasn't saying anything!! , and that line-up is what i "would" have had before Sunday, the only person i would maybe leave out now is Powell, but anyway Mike you say the youngsters can't cope but didn't the youngsters push Zimbabwe better than the seniors the other day? didn't a certain Brathwaite get 80 runs against the same spinners who Shiv struggled against? not everything is black and white Mike!!.

 

[Woodster]

Windie, that top four would probably be four wickets down for ten runs after just two overs....

You have to have experienced batsmen in your batting lineup, as the 20/20 match showed. If you field a team of youngsters and just one experienced batsman in your top five, you're going to lose, as that match also showed. It's good to see that Gibson didn't take up your suggestion, and omitted both Darren Bravo and Powell.

Maybe it's wise to let Sarwan and Dwayne Bravo recover properly from their injuries....

As the 20/20 match shows, you shouldn't pack your side with too many inexperienced players.

This would be my XI:

1) Chris Gayle
2) Adrian Barath
3) Narsing Deonarine
4) Shiv Chanderpaul
5) Kieron Pollard
6) Dwayne Smith
7) Denesh Ramdin
8) Dave Bernard/Nikita Miller (depending on the pitch)
9) Darren Sammy
10) Suleimann Benn
11) Kemar Roach

From the 14 named, I would leave out Andre Fletcher, Ravi Rampaul and one of either Miller or Bernard....

Fletcher and Rampaul are both lucky to be in the squad, IMHO.

Seems a logical team selection, against a better side than Zimbabwe looks a batsman short imo, to come in at number five and shunt everyone below that down a place. I'm actually excited about Pollard but number six would be fine for him for now and should he show the necessary consistency then number 5 may be his future position.

I do agree about the experience needed, more so in 50-over cricket than 20 overs, but pretty essential in all forms. Players such as Gayle, Sarwan, Chanderpaul, and Bravo will be key in integrating the younger players in the side, allowing the inexperienced players to come in and express themselves.

 

[shivfan]

Yes, Windie...the different pitches need to be taken into consideration, when looking at both games....

This squad is not that old either. Only one player in it is over 30, and that's Chanderpaul.

 

[shivfan]

Taufel turned down that appeal by Pollard, even though the batsman gloved in down leg to Ramdin....

No harm done - Miller strikes, and Masakadza senior is out.

 

[Beamer]

Another slow/low pitch where even part timers can turn it square (Narsingh Deonarine has turned 3/4 massively already).

So you can count me out of this one. I am not watching 80/100 overs being bowled by spinners. That is rubbish cricket.

 

[Stapel]

Was that a no-ball?

 

[Jono]

Taibu

Zim gonna win this, I feel it.