***Official*** West Indies in New Zealand

[roseboy64]

Because you're biased.

Dillon > any fast/fast-medium/medium-fast/medium bowler in the region bar Collins and Collymore.

I'm not being biased. If he can perform well again next season he'd be in my team for sure but someone with his past can't get into the team after just one good season IMO.If I was biased I would have put Taylor in my team.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I'm not being biased. If he can perform well again next season he'd be in my team for sure but someone with his past can't get into the team after just one good season IMO.If I was biased I would have put Taylor in my team.

Mervyn Dillon may not be world class, but it's foolish to ignore him, because he's still one of the best we have. I was of the opinion that you pick your best team.

M Dillon
131 wickets in 38 Tests
33.57 average
3.03 econ
66.44 SR

CD Collymore
60 wickets in 19 Tests
31.36 average
2.91 econ
64.50 SR

PT Collins
96 wickets in 29 Tests
34.13 average
3.13 econ
65.26 SR

I keenly await your justification for leaving Dillon out of the picture, no less when Collymore and Collins aren't fit. Keenly await it.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Dillon's last 3 proper series (> 1 Test):

11 wickets (25.00) in 3 matches v India in India
11 wickets (44.54) in 3 matches v Aus in WI
- all Windies bowlers got smashed; his econ. of 3.97 was second only to Drakes among seamers.
4 wickets (89.75) in 3 matches v SA in SA
- all Windies bowlers got smashed; his econ. of 3.20 was second only to Drakes among seamers.

Basically, Dillon being dropped effectively sees him as a scapegoat for a crap bowling attack of which he was one of the best if not the best.

 

[Prince EWS]

Bravo isn't picked as a bowler.

That doesnt mean he isnt a medium-fast bowler though.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

That doesnt mean he isnt a medium-fast bowler though.

Dillon is never going to be picked over Bravo though, because they're two different types of players.

Bravo isn't picked as a bowler. I thought my point was obvious.

 

[roseboy64]

He was supposed to be the spearhead of the attack and didn't do his job. If he was a greenhorn I'd give him another chance but his experience dictates he shouldn't. Collins didn't really perform well in Tests before his unforced drop. Dillon was supposed to be something special and he wasn't. If he can do another good season he's in the team for me but not just yet. Taylor shoudn't be in the current squad either to let you know.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

He was supposed to be the spearhead of the attack and didn't do his job.

He did a damn sight better than others tried!
The man has 131 wickets in 38 Tests. I'd hardly call that a failure. What do you want from him? Miraculous salvation?

If he was a greenhorn I'd give him another chance but his experience dictates he shouldn't.

His experience dictates that he should be able to carry a crap attack?

Collins didn't really perform well in Tests before his unforced drop.

Collins returned from injury, bowled well without luck for a long time, THEN started to perform.

Dillon was supposed to be something special and he wasn't.

So we just pick players and drop them if they're not something "special"? In the mean time we just give voice to the Adam Sanfords, Daren Powells etc etc of the world?

The man has 131 wickets in 38 Tests. I'd hardly call that a failure. What do you want from him? Miraculous salvation?

Taylor shoudn't be in the current squad either to let you know.

Who was talking about Taylor?

I don't think you're biased toward Jamaicans. I just think you're biased against Dillon.

 

[sirjeremy11]

I would have thought it reasonably tough to drop one of your best bowlers after two average series against pretty strong Australian and South African batting line ups. My impression of Merv Dillon was that he was always a reasonably accurate toiler, something the Windies need fairly desperately at the moment.

 

[roseboy64]

He did a damn sight better than others tried!
The man has 131 wickets in 38 Tests. I'd hardly call that a failure. What do you want from him? Miraculous salvation?
He didn't do enough.
His experience dictates that he should be able to carry a crap attack?
Yes.
Collins returned from injury, bowled well without luck for a long time, THEN started to perform.
Don't remember him being too hot before his injury.
So we just pick players and drop them if they're not something "special"? In the mean time we just give voice to the Adam Sanfords, Daren Powells etc etc of the world?

The man has 131 wickets in 38 Tests. I'd hardly call that a failure. What do you want from him? Miraculous salvation?
To play Test cricket and garner as much wickets has he has you'd expect special. Thought special players were the ones who were supposed to play at the highest level. In the West Indies that's not so true.
Who was talking about Taylor?

I don't think you're biased toward Jamaicans. I just think you're biased against Dillon.
Really I'm talking about Taylor just doing well for one season and being brought back. Even though he wasn't the best bowler for his team.

There ya go.

 

[roseboy64]

I would have thought it reasonably tough to drop one of your best bowlers after two average series against pretty strong Australian and South African batting line ups. My impression of Merv Dillon was that he was always a reasonably accurate toiler, something the Windies need fairly desperately at the moment.

He wasn't supposed to be average. If he was above average well no problem then.

 

[sirjeremy11]

Let's look at it another way, from a NZ point of view. Dan Vettori has a similar average to Merv Dillon. He had an absolutely horrible time at one point, couldn't take a wicket at all. at one point, in 19 tests from Eng 2001/02 to Eng 2004, he took 33 wickets at 66.36.

Since then, 10 tests, 50 wickets at 24.48.

He had quite a few bad series in a row, but has bounced back well. Imagine if they had dropped him to try and find someone else. It would have been a bad move.

 

[roseboy64]

For some reason I wouldn't group Dillon and Vettori. Can't remember now(probably never will) but there's some difference there.

 

[sirjeremy11]

In terms of that they are both bowlers who lost form, there is no difference at all. My point is that you can't really drop a player with a good track record when they have hit hard times UNLESS there are ready made replacements. There certainly wasn't for Vettori, and by the way the Windies have been giving runs away this tour, I would suggest that they aren't queing up to take Dillon's place very well.

In fact you could compare them both to Mark Taylor. He had a horrible run, but they didn't drop him and he made 334*.

 

[roseboy64]

Dillon was really just inconsistent. He'd do well one match and not perform the next. If you're supposed to be the spearhead and 'role model' for the bowling, that's not really supposed to happen. Though based on his last FC season he's in my thoughts to come back but not in my team just yet.

 

[Prince EWS]

Bravo isn't picked as a bowler. I thought my point was obvious.

Your point was very obvious, however this statement, "Dillon > any fast/fast-medium/medium-fast/medium bowler in the region bar Collins and Collymore." is questionable, as I'd have Bravo over Dillon given equal batting. I know its not a practical situation, as Bravo is a) Injured, and b) Picked as an allrounder, but the fact remains.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

There ya go.

Another expert analysis there Xavier.

131 wickets in 38 matches = 3.44 per match.
Walsh took 3.93 per match.
Dillon is no Walsh, but he's still one of the best bowlers in the region whether or not you like him.

It's all well and good to have a bias, but when the bias is baseless, it's called ignorance.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

He wasn't supposed to be average. If he was above average well no problem then.

Among current West Indian bowlers, he IS above average. Context man... context...

 

[roseboy64]

Well you've convinced me I'm biased. I still need at least two good consecutive seasons or some injuries for him to make the team though.

 

[roseboy64]

Among current West Indian bowlers, he IS above average. Context man... context...

I'm the one who should be telling you context.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I'm the one who should be telling you context.

Because you're the one who's missing the context entirely?

Fair enough.