***Official*** West Indies in Australia

[chalky]

I don't wanna tempt fate too much, but that's extraordinarily pessimistic! Warne & Lee are both pretty tidy with the blade, but Bracken & McGrath definitely aren't. New ball's there ready as well.

If Oz get to 400 they'll have done well.

Yeah hopefully the West Indies will knock off the tail early with the new ball. (every run Australia gets costs me £3.00) However they really let Australia off the hook in that last half hour.

 

[social]

I'm not blindly supporting him. I'm saying it's too early to just drop the guy and he'll need some time and that there are few other alternatives to bat 4 right now. All of the alternatives put forward have far fewer years left at top-level cricket than Clarke has so I don't really see the point in just dropping him, particularly since he was far from the worst batsman during the Ashes series and today got a great ball.

I personally think that Clarke has had it much too easy.

He did nothing, in a relative sense, to get selected for Aus in the first place and, aside from the odd flash of brilliance, he's been very ordinary since he's been there.

My sources also tell me that he has an ego the size of Mt Everest and is not the pleasant young man the media would have us believe.

Yet, despite the above, the great minds of the Aus selection panel continue to reward his incompetence. How, in the name of all reason, they elevated him to no. 4 in front of any no. of better qualified contenders is totally beyond me.

The excuse that his competitors are older is pathetic.

Guys like Martyn, Hodge, Hussey and Love can easily play for another 5 - 6 years

Unfortunately, it's more a matter of whether your face fits.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Yeah hopefully the West Indies will knock off the tail early with the new ball. (every run Australia gets costs me £3.00) However they really let Australia off the hook in that last half hour.

What was the spread?

 

[Prince EWS]

Looks like rain, apparentely. From Rleague.com forums:

It's not looking good for cricket this morning.

Drove past the gabba a little while ago and it was belting down rain !
Just typical isn't it, in the middle of our worst drought in 100 years, and this happens !!!

 

[chalky]

What was the spread?

435-455 - Thought it was pretty generous considering no Langer & the poor middle order.

 

[BoyBrumby]

435-455 - Thought it was pretty generous considering no Langer & the poor middle order.

Not bad value at all! Windies bowl Oz out cheaply & you should turn a decent little profit there.

Pretty big stones you have there @ £3 a run tho. If Oz had made 600 that would've stung!

 

[sqwerty]

I personally think that Clarke has had it much too easy.

My sources also tell me that he has an ego the size of Mt Everest and is not the pleasant young man the media would have us believe.

QUOTE]

I bumped into Michael Clarke last week and had a quick chat to him. He wouldn't know me from a bar of soap but I found him to be just about the friendliest test player I've ever yakked to (along with Brett Lee). He didn't try to brush me, he was happy to chat, he looked at me when I was talking, had a smile on his face and he was forthcoming with his own points of view when he could have easily just listened to what I had to say and then p!ssed off.

Hardly gave me the impression that you describe.

 

[Slats4ever]

yeah it seems like the younger generation of aussie players are heaps more friendly. i've had the same kind of encounter as sqwerts... Bing's easily the friendliest but guys like Brad Hogg (he's not old but he's not cemented in the Aussie squad. Michael Clarke's a cool chap to.

 

[chalky]

Not bad value at all! Windies bowl Oz out cheaply & you should turn a decent little profit there.

Pretty big stones you have there @ £3 a run tho. If Oz had made 600 that would've stung!

I don't think this Aussie side is capable of scoring over 500, never mind 600, against any decent test side especially with Langer out.

(Knowing my luck Warne will hit his 1st 100 and Mcgrath will score a 50 just to make llok like an idiot)

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I don't wanna tempt fate too much, but that's extraordinarily pessimistic! Warne & Lee are both pretty tidy with the blade, but Bracken & McGrath definitely aren't. New ball's there ready as well.

If Oz get to 400 they'll have done well.

I agree, but I'm covering my bases pertaining to my point.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

I don't think this Aussie side is capable of scoring over 500, never mind 600, against any decent test side especially with Langer out.

(Knowing my luck Warne will hit his 1st 100 and Mcgrath will score a 50 just to make llok like an idiot)

Go back five tests, and a team that is the same bar having Martyn instead of Katich, and Australia scored 550+ against Pakistan. Couple of tests before that with Martyn instead of Watson, and Australia scored 550+ against New Zealand, and they did the same against the same opposition in New Zealand more recently.

You're suggesting that dropping Martyn for Katich or Watson from those teams makes such a huge difference that they are no longer capable of big scores? I agree Martyn should be in the team, but come on...

 

[marc71178]

Interesting to see that MacGill has been released from 12th man duties to be replaced by one Ryan Le Loux.

Is he a good fielder?

He's certainly not the reserve seamer as we're told they "always" use.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Go back five tests, and a team that is the same bar having Martyn instead of Katich, and Australia scored 550+ against Pakistan.

5 Tests ago Australia was being beaten by England... on a tour that they never passed 400.

 

[Prince EWS]

Hes not an awful fielder, but he hasnt been chosen with fielding solely in mind, like Pratt and Penney were.

If Symonds came on, you'd have a point.....

 

[Top_Cat]

I personally think that Clarke has had it much too easy.

He did nothing, in a relative sense, to get selected for Aus in the first place and, aside from the odd flash of brilliance, he's been very ordinary since he's been there.

My sources also tell me that he has an ego the size of Mt Everest and is not the pleasant young man the media would have us believe.

Yet, despite the above, the great minds of the Aus selection panel continue to reward his incompetence. How, in the name of all reason, they elevated him to no. 4 in front of any no. of better qualified contenders is totally beyond me.

The excuse that his competitors are older is pathetic.

Guys like Martyn, Hodge, Hussey and Love can easily play for another 5 - 6 years

Unfortunately, it's more a matter of whether your face fits.

I've heard similar things about the ego but I don't think he's been unbelievably bad. Certainly his ODI form has kept up so I guess the selectors are waiting for when form partity with Tests resumes. He's been figured out technique-wise (like I remember saying he would be well before his first Test) and on FC stats, it certainly was a gamble picking him. But I'm a great believer that a great gamble is a great risk and if it starts to show signs of not going the way you planned, that you ride out the storm a bit, especially when you can see signs that the investment will be worth it in the end.

The selectors did the same thing with Steve Waugh and if a player is showing signs that they want to improve, working hard in the nets, analysing their performances, etc. then that's what you look for because then you know they're mentally equipped to get themselves out of the form-trough their in. It's when they start slacking off at training, getting out to silly swipes across the line, staying out all night drinking, etc. that you start worrying. From what else I've heard about Clarke, he's good at working on something until he gets it right. He's already changed as a player; when he was first-picked, he was all shots. In England he still played his shots but also ground out a couple of tough short innings when Australia were in danger of collapsing into a huge heap. The slower-ball he got in the second Test put an end to what was a very gritty knock to that point. He did it later in the series too. Those are the signs which are good. If he had tried to knock Harmi out of the ground and been bowled middle-peg, that's the sign of someone who's not in the right headspace. Mark Waugh comes to mind in this instance.

I guess the short version is that although not getting to results and being found-out a bit, Clarke at least looks as if he's trying his guts out to figure out what's going so wrong for him. That's what I personally like to see in any player because I know they'll be better equipped for when the next form problems happen (and they will).

That said, he probably is reaching the point where the patience of the selectors will be stretched a bit. Basically he had a good home series against NZ last year, a not so great one against Pakistan, a pass-mark in England and hasn't started off well in this Test. If, at the the end of the summer, his series average is less than 40, I think the selectors will be taking a good look at whether he should remain in the side.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Hes not an awful fielder, but he hasnt been chosen with fielding solely in mind, like Pratt and Penney were.

If Symonds came on, you'd have a point.....

I'm convinced that the only reason Dwayne Smith is on tour is to be our travelling Pratt.

 

[chalky]

Go back five tests, and a team that is the same bar having Martyn instead of Katich, and Australia scored 550+ against Pakistan. Couple of tests before that with Martyn instead of Watson, and Australia scored 550+ against New Zealand, and they did the same against the same opposition in New Zealand more recently.

You're suggesting that dropping Martyn for Katich or Watson from those teams makes such a huge difference that they are no longer capable of big scores? I agree Martyn should be in the team, but come on...

Hayden is out of form, Langer isn't playing, Clarke is out form , Katich looks terrified at the crease. And I think the Ashes failures have knocked Australia's confidence - Players are worried for their place and you can see it at the crease - Katich a case in point.

And the fact that theyv'e struggled on flat pitch (baring Pointing), aginst the worst bowling attack out of any of the top test nations who are also bowling below their best sort of illustrates my point.

 

[Prince EWS]

I'm convinced that the only reason Dwayne Smith is on tour is to be our travelling Pratt.

Well at least that somewhat justifies his selection.

Bradshaw is by far a better bowler, and a more mature, if less skilled, batsman than Smith. I'd most likely back him to score more runs than Smith against the Australian attack.

Banks, IMO, is both a better bowler and a better batsman than Smith by a long distance, and he also offers variation with his bowling.

Then there are Ryan Hinds and Deonarine... are they injured by any chance?

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Hayden is out of form, Langer isn't playing, Clarke is out form , Katich looks terrified at the crease. And I think the Ashes failures have knocked Australia's confidence - Players are worried for their place and you can see it at the crease - Katich a case in point.

And the fact that theyv'e struggled on flat pitch (baring Pointing), aginst the worst bowling attack out of any of the top test nations who are also bowling below their best sort of illustrates my point.

Haha. Edwards/Powell/Collymore/Lawson isn't the worst bowling attack from a top test nation for one, I'd rather face Martin/Franklin/Mills/Oram/Vettori for one. The pitch is flat, but not an absolute road, it's got grass on it and Ponting was saying the pace was hard to judge, and the Windies didn't bowl brilliantly but they were a long way from "well below their best", aside from Lawson.

Hayden is coming off back-to-back centuries, Hussey's more than capable of opening for any test side in the world, and while Clarke and Katich are out of form both are capable of making runs. To suggest this team "can't" make a big score against a decent attack is ridiculous. It would be akin to suggesting that because England have Strauss, Bell and Pietersen who are inexperienced and Flintoff who averages in the 30s they have a rubbish batting lineup.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

5 Tests ago Australia was being beaten by England... on a tour that they never passed 400.

Yeah, mistake in expression, I meant five tests outside of the Ashes series.