***Official*** South Africa in England

[Richard]

You don't know that though, they could know something you don't. It could be perceived mental toughness, or raw physical attributes that they feel could be moulded into a top-class bowler.

In which case - take him on an England A tour this winter. But don't pick him for a crucial Test after half a good season.

In any case, it's certainly not the move i'd have made, but if he plays and succeeds it would be unfair to write it off as pure luck. Only if and when the expected flop materialises will i join in the selector-bashing.

As I say - I don't do things with hindsight. If it works, all well and good - but it has all the signs of a disaster waiting to happen. IMO, if it doesn't, it's pure luck.

 

[GIMH]

The Nottinghamshire seamer, Darren Pattinson, has been drafted into the England squad ahead of the second Test against South Africa at Headingley, after James Anderson reported a stiff back during training... [Cricinfo]

I swear I thought you were taking the piss when I read this

If we weren't sure that Hoggard & Harmison were never going to play for England again, we should be now.

I don't mind this selection too much as Tremlett is next in line. It seems unlikely the selectors will actually have to drop anyone for this game now, with both Sidebottom and Anderson doubts. Could well end up with an attack of Flintoff-Tremlett-Broad-Panesar

 

[Uppercut]

Ah well, it's all elementary really since he's so unlikely to play.

As for the match itself, i'm utterly stumped for a prediction, but i'd still have South Africa as favourites for the series. Any thoughts?

 

[Uppercut]

I don't mind this selection too much as Tremlett is next in line. It seems unlikely the selectors will actually have to drop anyone for this game now, with both Sidebottom and Anderson doubts. Could well end up with an attack of Flintoff-Tremlett-Broad-Panesar

Strike what i said above, if that's the England attack that turns out i'd like to think i have a fairly good idea of who would come out on top...

 

[GIMH]

3-0 England

 

[jammay123]

awta. flintoff to go mental.

 

[GIMH]

10 wickets and a ton FTW

 

[Uppercut]

Mental with frustration, as a result of breaking down in the middle of his first over and scoring a pair with the bat?


I could certainly see it happen

 

[Uppercut]

He doesn't actually have a 10fer yet. And only two 5fers in 67 matches. The big fella' cant do it all on his own.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Not sure if this icon status thing is that relevant TBH. What if in 10 years on so one of SA or ENG go through a rebuilding phase thus making the series a fairly one-sided contest.

You look at WI/AUS clashes between 1960-1996 i am sure the supporters from both sides would accept it makes no sense having a long series between the sides anymore due to lack of competitiveness.

If any series should always maintain 5-test its the Ashes. All the others can be altered when needed.

Err, in which case it's stripped of the icon status. Obviously. West Indies doesn't play 5-Test series against Australia anymore. Or South Africa. Or England. Or anyone, really.

 

[GIMH]

Why doesn't India V Pakistan have icon status?

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Probably because they play each other so often. And because Tests aren't 100 overs long.

 

[GIMH]

 

[Richard]

He doesn't actually have a 10fer yet. And only two 5fers in 67 matches. The big fella' cant do it all on his own.

He's not often had the chance, during the time he's been a good bowler, to bowl in such an inept attack.

If he truly does walk out alongside Tremlett (who's not really threatened this season), Broad (who's not really threatened in his Test career) and MSP (who's a fingerspinner at Headingley) and conditions conform somewhere close to expectations, I'll be pretty disappointed if he doesn't get his maiden 10-for.

If, that is, SA don't score 600 for 8 in their only innings.

 

[Richard]

Could well end up with an attack of Flintoff-Tremlett-Broad-Panesar

One thing you can say there - that'll bounce.

Might well not do much else, but there'll be bounce aplenty there.

 

[Pup Clarke]

Haha, would be one of the tallest attacks to take a field possibly?

 

[Uppercut]

He's not often had the chance, during the time he's been a good bowler, to bowl in such an inept attack.

Those stats certainly need qualifying, yes, but they're still very relevant. I definitely don't think he can carry an attack, especially not given his lack of cricket over the past year and a half.

 

[zaremba]

He doesn't actually have a 10fer yet. And only two 5fers in 67 matches.

... and outside Test cricket just ONE 5-fer in 101 First Class matches. For such a good bowler this is an extraordinarily poor return.

 

[Prince EWS]

Have complete faith in Tremmers. Won't hear a bad word about him.

 

[Richard]

Those stats certainly need qualifying, yes, but they're still very relevant. I definitely don't think he can carry an attack, especially not given his lack of cricket over the past year and a half.

I think the only way we'd know would be to find-out. You can't carry an attack that doesn't need carrying. Nor can you carry an attack if you're as inept a bowler as he mostly was 2001/02 to 2003 (and good God how he was 1998-2000 ). Although TBF, I think he's come fairly close to doing such a thing more than once - never more than The Oval 2005.

The amount of time out, though, does make the prospect a far more worrying one than if he'd been happily taking his 3-40s and 4-90s for the last year, you're absolutely right.