***Official*** South Africa in England

[pup11]

It truly is stupid, for mine, that a player can at one point be available for two countries, all they have to have done is not to have represented another team in the last 4 years. Absolutely and utterly ludicrous.

As long as the sports governing bodies of any country don't pick blokes, who can't decide for themselves with which country their loyalties lie, then such a ludicrous situation can surely be avoided.

 

[Precambrian]

If kevin does it, will it be the first white wash by a captain in his debut full series of any length?

 

[wpdavid]

If kevin does it, will it be the first white wash by a captain in his debut full series of any length?

Worth checking Steve Waugh & Viv Richards

 

[GIMH]

Impressive nonetheless. I can honestly say I don't think anyone expected a rout in the ODIs, well not with England on the winning end anyway

 

[stumpski]

Impressive nonetheless. I can honestly say I don't think anyone expected a rout in the ODIs, well not with England on the winning end anyway

I saw the preview of Sky's coverage in the Mail on Sunday's TV supplement and it said something like "hopefully, Kevin Pietersen and his men will have more than just pride to play for by this stage"

So you could say, expectations weren't exactly Sky-high.

 

[Uppercut]

I saw the preview of Sky's coverage in the Mail on Sunday's TV supplement and it said something like "hopefully, Kevin Pietersen and his men will have more than just pride to play for by this stage"

So you could say, expectations weren't exactly Sky-high.

Maybe they expected his honeymoon to pieter out.

 

[wpdavid]

Impressive nonetheless. I can honestly say I don't think anyone expected a rout in the ODIs, well not with England on the winning end anyway

Oh absolutely: I was expecting 4-1 to SA at best, and fearing 5-0. And I don't know for certain that Waugh & Richards started with whitewashes - they just seemed likely candidiates.

It'll be interesting to see how we go after this series. Our one flop to date has been Anderson, so I wonder if he'll open in the Indian series of onedayers if Sidebottom is fit. And I don't know how successful GBH will be first change out there.

 

[GIMH]

Don't think Anderson necessarily needs to be a cert in the ODIs; his Test place is nailed on now for the time being and I think if we can let anyone be tired and out of form at the end of the season it's him, he's been our best bowler this summer and possibly is the only one to play every Test & ODI - can't remember if he did play all the NZ ODIs but would imagine that he did, certainly none of our other bowlers have played this much, though Broad hasn't missed too much either. Would imagine Jimmy has bowled more overs than him though.

Certainly we can't write Sidebottom off in either format, quite a tantalising thought picking our attack now actually, just hope it fires in India.

 

[tooextracool]

Why? People can be dual nationals so its fair they can pick either country.

Playing for your country and being a part of the best XI in your country is supposed to be the biggest honor any sportsman can possibly achieve. I cant think of any other sport where players have been able to represent 2 countries in their life span, and I dont see why cricket should be an exception. Its fine for players like Pietersen to decide very early to play cricket for England, but the likes of Saqlain or Stuart law who have already represented another country being eligible to play for England and play against the countries that they formerly represented, that leaves a poor mark for international cricket. It would be equivalent to the likes of Nathan Bracken moving over to Bangladesh and opening the bowling for them in a couple of years.

I would never pick a player who makes himself available for 2 countries and 'doesnt mind' representing either. It suggests a serious lack of commitment and I would feel that such a player would never be able to play with the sort of pride and loyalty that is required to be a team player at this level of cricket.

 

[Goughy]

I cant think of any other sport where players have been able to represent 2 countries in their life span, and I dont see why cricket should be an exception.

Firstly, I was addresing players being eligible to play for more than 1 team. Not acually playing for more than 1 team.

Secondly, you ned to think harder. It has happened in many sports.

 

[tooextracool]

Don't think Anderson necessarily needs to be a cert in the ODIs; his Test place is nailed on now for the time being and I think if we can let anyone be tired and out of form at the end of the season it's him, he's been our best bowler this summer and possibly is the only one to play every Test & ODI - can't remember if he did play all the NZ ODIs but would imagine that he did, certainly none of our other bowlers have played this much, though Broad hasn't missed too much either. Would imagine Jimmy has bowled more overs than him though.

Certainly we can't write Sidebottom off in either format, quite a tantalising thought picking our attack now actually, just hope it fires in India.

Anderson's record in ODIs since and including the last world cup is truly woeful in ODIs. Hes a genuine swing bowler and the fact of the matter is that there is no place for bowlers that pitch it up searching for swing in ODIs at the moment.
Sidebottom is much of the same, his ODI record is hardly earth shattering either, but hes worth a shot at being able to adapt to the ODI cricket than Anderson.

 

[tooextracool]

Firstly, I was addresing players being eligible to play for more than 1 team. Not acually playing for more than 1 team.

Then the logic behind the attempted analogy made about someone having dual citizenship becomes invalid.

Also, the original argument from Richard was that any player being eligible for 2 teams at the same time is a joke. I have addressed that in my post as well, as I genuinely dont believe that any player should be able to make himself eligible for 2 teams. Pick one and try to make it.

 

[Goughy]

Then the logic behind the attempted analogy made about someone having dual citizenship becomes invalid.

Also, the original argument from Richard was that any player being eligible for 2 teams at the same time is a joke. I have addressed that in my post as well, as I genuinely dont believe that any player should be able to make himself eligible for 2 teams. Pick one and try to make it.

They will do when they make an appearance for a country.

Until then they dont have to make a choice and its noones place to force them to.

However, even after commiting to a nation, changes may lead an athlete to change nation. Whether it be Saqlain (who hasnt actally played), Martina Navratilova from Czechoslovakia to USA (Tennis) , Diego Domínguez with Italy and Argentina (Rugby), Samuel Francis from Nigeria to Qatar (sprinting) and di Stéfano who played football for Argentina, Colombia, and Spain.

 

[Richard]

Worth checking Steve Waugh & Viv Richards

Seem to remember Waugh's first fixed-captaincy appointment was a C&U Series, not a bilateral. And Australia were thrashed regularly by SA thoughout it, before fluking the trophy through their small number of victories happening to come in the last 2 games.

 

[Richard]

Don't think Anderson necessarily needs to be a cert in the ODIs; his Test place is nailed on now for the time being and I think if we can let anyone be tired and out of form at the end of the season it's him, he's been our best bowler this summer and possibly is the only one to play every Test & ODI - can't remember if he did play all the NZ ODIs but would imagine that he did, certainly none of our other bowlers have played this much, though Broad hasn't missed too much either. Would imagine Jimmy has bowled more overs than him though.

Anderson's only rarely been that good a ODI bowler though - you can't say it's just this series.

 

[Top_Cat]

Seem to remember Waugh's first fixed-captaincy appointment was a C&U Series, not a bilateral. And Australia were thrashed regularly by SA thoughout it, before fluking the trophy through their small number of victories happening to come in the last 2 games.

Same could be said about South Africa in 01/02 when they came back a few years later, only making the finals on the back of beating NZ regularly (and gaining a couple of bonus points in the process) because they couldn't beat Australia. Was a weird series in general; Aust only took won game off NZ because of a monumental Bevan knock and were beaten in their other three matches against them. Aust lost a close first-up game against SA but then had the wood on them for the rest of the series and if they'd made the finals would almost certainly have won. NZ, who dominated Aust, couldn't buy a win against SA and, true to form, were annihilated in the finals.

SA just peaked too early in 1998. They won the first final but lost the next two. No fluke about it.

 

[pup11]

Same could be said about South Africa in 01/02 when they came back a few years later, only making the finals on the back of beating NZ regularly (and gaining a couple of bonus points in the process) because they couldn't beat Australia. Was a weird series in general; Aust only took won game off NZ because of a monumental Bevan knock and were beaten in their other three matches against them. Aust lost a close first-up game against SA but then had the wood on them for the rest of the series and if they'd made the finals would almost certainly have won. NZ, who dominated Aust, couldn't buy a win against SA and, true to form, were annihilated in the finals.

SA just peaked too early in 1998. They won the first final but lost the next two. No fluke about it.

Yeah that series was weird one for sure, Australia just couldn't beat NZ no matter what they tried (due to a certain Mr.Bond), and still Australia kept beating RSA and RSA kept thrashing NZ, so no one team were in complete control in the league stage of that tri-series, but when RSA and NZ meet in the finals, NZ were easily beaten 2-0 in the best of three finals(which was a fair result, tbh).
BTW i think SA just didn't only peak early in the 98 series during the best of three finals, they also took the foot of the paddle in a way i guess, Australia looked a much more intense side out of the two sides during the 2nd and 3rd final in that series.

 

[GIMH]

Sort of hoping South Africa bat first and put a decent target on the table. We haven't had to chase anything substantial in this series, and it's a challenge I'm interested in seeing us take on.

Hoping to see Flintoff score at least 13 not out to finish with a series average of 200. What a guy

 

[superkingdave]

Sort of hoping South Africa bat first and put a decent target on the table. We haven't had to chase anything substantial in this series, and it's a challenge I'm interested in seeing us take on.

Hoping to see Flintoff score at least 13 not out to finish with a series average of 200. What a guy

Nah, bat first and Fred to score 213 tbh

 

[pup11]

Sort of hoping South Africa bat first and put a decent target on the table. We haven't had to chase anything substantial in this series, and it's a challenge I'm interested in seeing us take on.

Hoping to see Flintoff score at least 13 not out to finish with a series average of 200. What a guy

Jokes apart hasn't Flintoff been just great in this Odi series, its really a treat to watch him play when he performs like this, i think KP also has a role in reviving Freddie, lets hope he can carry on with this form for sometime to come.