**Official** South Africa in England 2012

[Cabinet96]

Yes but back then they didn't have Philander or Tahir!! , i can't see the current bowling unit letting England off the hook now, it also doesn't bode well when only Strauss was able to get a ton against our attack which isn't as good as SA's.

Paul Harris got a 5 fer that game, something Tahir has never done in a test, so I don't think you can argue that his inclusion makes them that much more clinical.

England weren't that great against Sri Lanka last year either. The bowling was regularly unthreatening. Then when India came over, there wasn't a single innings where India weren't on top of their game.

 

[akilana]

LOL lets be right about this SA didn't look to flash against NZ, they got knocked over cheaply for a couple of low scores in the first two test. If NZ can do that England must be fancying their chances and England wont be letting them off the hook like the NZ'ers did.

England didnt look that flashy against SL or Pakistan and maybe what you said below applies to SA against NZ. We will soon see but a drawn series here would be a disappointment for England.

It's a bit like last year when we played SL at the start of the summer, I didn't think we were at our best then but when the supposed bigger test came they upped their game.

 

[uvelocity]

england hasn't stopped playing for a while now have they, tiredness to be a factor?

 

[Jacknife]

England didnt look that flashy against SL or Pakistan and maybe what you said below applies to SA against NZ. We will soon see but a drawn series here would be a disappointment for England.

Don't know if it applies to SA, it was more a retort to what WW was saying about how the WI series doesn't bode well for England when SA come to town. In a round about way I'm saying it won't matter in the slightest what happened in past series when England & SA meet, it will be far higher intensity stuff in every minute of every game.

England will be absolutely disappointed if they don't win this series, you've got to go in to every series that way, particularly at home.

 

[WindieWeathers]

I agree with WW in that England do need to step up a level or two when we take on South Africa, we need to be more ruthless and not offer SA the opportunities to take control of a Test the way we did with WI, but we knew we were a far superior team to the recent tourists and could afford a poor session here and there, with SA we cannot afford such luxuries.

I think when challenged by a sterner test this group of England players will step up and find the necessary performance levels needed, but it promises to be a very exciting and closely fought contest. Cannot see SA flopping in the same spineless manner as India did last year.

Tbh though you lot had a "sterner test" against Pakistan and we all know how that ended!! , when challenged by a top team recently it hasn't gone well, WI without some of the gems was always gonna have it's limitations.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Paul Harris got a 5 fer that game, something Tahir has never done in a test, so I don't think you can argue that his inclusion makes them that much more clinical.

England weren't that great against Sri Lanka last year either. The bowling was regularly unthreatening. Then when India came over, there wasn't a single innings where India weren't on top of their game.

Tahir has more variations, so yes i think i could argue that his inclusion would make a difference, plus Philander is one of the best pacers around right now, so anyone thinking he wouldn't have something to say in a game like that are kidding themselves imo.

 

[Marius]

He's experienced in English conditions though!!

He's got a better record in FC cricket than Swann to be fair.

And he also hasn't really bowled on a pitch that will suit him, and has been pretty unlucky as well.

I think SA will do well to stick with him till at least after the home Tests against Pakistan and NZ.

If only to see him do his Usain Bolt impression every time he gets a wicket.

 

[Cabinet96]

Tbh though you lot had a "sterner test" against Pakistan and we all know how that ended!! , when challenged by a top team recently it hasn't gone well, WI without some of the gems was always gonna have it's limitations.

And by recently you mean 1 series in the last 3 years.

 

[WindieWeathers]

And by recently you mean 1 series in the last 3 years.

I guess the question is how many asia tours were included in those three years after your lot lost in the caribbean?

 

[Cabinet96]

I guess the question is how many asia tours where included in those three years after your lot lost in the caribbean?

3. In fact we had more away series in Asia, than all the other countries combined.

 

[WindieWeathers]

3. In fact we had more away series in Asia, than all the other countries combined.

So basically the two big challenges in asia that England have had recently they haven't won? ok then!! .

 

[grecian]

I think the main thing we need to up our game, over the Windies series is fielding, particularly catching, we can't give the likes of AB, Kallis and Amla too many let-offs. We were terrible in the slip cordons, apart from Jimmeh.

 

[Furball]

Struggling to see what relevance Test series in Asia have to England's chances in a home series.

 

[smash84]

I think what is being alluded to here is that whenever England need to up the ante they fail

 

[grecian]

I think what is being alluded to here is that whenever England need to up the ante they fail

Well that's a stonking argument isn't it. Can't think oif any key series we've won over the last couple of years.....

 

[flibbertyjibber]

I think what is being alluded to here is that whenever England need to up the ante they fail

Australia away and India home begs to differ.

 

[Furball]

I think what is being alluded to here is that whenever England need to up the ante they fail

And it's a rubbish argument, based on England struggling in one series where their achilles heel was a) spin and b) Asian conditions. That's utterly meaningless when England will be faced with a seam dominant South African attack, and playing in their own conditions where they've won the last 7 series against everyone bar New Zealand and South Africa, and when their recent home record is played 24, won 17, drawn 5 (4 of which were ruined by weather), lost 2.

WindieWeathers' argument is along the same logical lines as a stopped clock still being right twice a day.

 

[Scaly piscine]

South Africa still have little depth, that is still their major weakness and why they've looked vulnerable against mediocre sides. As I said before their batting hinges on 2-3 players. If they get in they can just bat and bat and you're looking at 200+ runs from them. If you get them early then they're in big trouble. In Test cricket clutches of wickets happen to every team, the best sides fight back. South Africa just don't have the depth to do that.

 

[Marius]

South Africa still have little depth, that is still their major weakness and why they've looked vulnerable against mediocre sides. As I said before their batting hinges on 2-3 players. If they get in they can just bat and bat and you're looking at 200+ runs from them. If you get them early then they're in big trouble. In Test cricket clutches of wickets happen to every team, the best sides fight back. South Africa just don't have the depth to do that.

Are you on drugs mate?

SA doesn't "fight back"?

Against Australia last year in Cape Town, we were bowled out for less than 100.

What did we do?

Bowled them out for less than 50 and chased down the target with room to spare.

Against SL at Centurion at the end of last year we were 170 for 5, we scored more than 400 and won by an innings.

In the third Test of that series SL were 180 for 4, we bolwed them out for less than 250 and won by 10 wickets, just missing out on an innings victory.

And that is just our last home season.

And I would argue that we have serious depth.

JP Duminy is probably our reserve batsman, and in his last Test innings he scored a century.

England's number 6, or probably first batting reserve is Johnny Bairstow. Steyn, Philander, and Morkel are going to have him for breakfast.

 

[Marius]

Guys, I think we can agree on two things.

Firstly it is going to be an absolute cracker of a series, and secondly it is ridiculous that it is only a 3 Test series.

I obviously want South Africa to win, but I think a draw may be a fair result. Both teams will probably feel hard done by if they don't win.