Official Rugby Thread

[Francis]

Greatest fullbacks ever...

1. Serge Blanco (France)
2. J.P.R. Williams (Williams)
3. Andy Irvine (Scotland)
4. H.O. de Villiers (South Africa)
5. Gavin Hastings (Scotland)
6. Matt Burke (Australia)
7. Roger Gould (Australia)
8. Chris Latham (Australia)
9. Gerry Brand (South Africa)
10. I don't know...

 

[Francis]

Wingers!!!

1. David Campese
2. Tony O'Reilly
3. Gerald Davies
4. David Duckham
5. Rupeni!!!
6. Shane Williams
7. Ieuan Evans
8. J.J. Williams
9. Carel du Plessis
10. Ray Mordt

 

[Francis]

CENTERS (second-fives and outside-centres)

1. Philippe Sella (France)
2. Danie Gerber (South Africa)
3. Mike Gibson (Ireland)
4. Jeff Butterfield (England)
5. Tim Horan (Australia)
6. Brian O'Driscoll (Ireland)
7. John Gainsford (South AFrica)
8. Mannetjies Roux (South Africa)
9. Trevor Allan (Australia)
10. R.H. Williams (Wales)

Sella... was the most capped player for a long time - the first player to make it to 100 Tests. He did it despite the French selectors being horrible.

Gerber was maybe the greatest rugby player ever... but we didn't see enough. Destroyed Walter Little in 1992 - D-E-S-T-R-O-Y-E-D!

Gibson... Lions legend - a contender for any all-time XV.

Butterfield... a throwback to those Lions I love.

Horan - best defensive back I ever saw. Tackled everything!

O'Driscoll... overrated. Umaga's attack on him ranks with Kevin Skinner's attack on two props, and I admired the classy way O'Driscoll handled that!

Gainsford... big... fast... straight runner...

Roux... the most underrated player of all time!

Allan - the ice man cometh!

Williams... Welsh legend!

 

[Francis]

Scrum-halves...

1. Gareth Edwards
2. Ken Catchpole
3. Danie Gerber
4. Joost van der stupid last name
5. John Hipwell
6. Nick Farr-Jones
7. Rob Howley
8. Dickie Jeeps
9. Haydn Tanner
10. George Gregan

Numer eights... EIGHTMEN!

1. Hennie Muller
2. Walter Spanghero
3. Mervyn Davies
4. Mourne du Plessis
5. Lawrence Dallaglio
6. Mark Loane
7. Dean Richards
8. Laurent Rodriguez
9. Scott Quinell
10. Steve Tuynman

What the people here don't realize is that I've had a few beers and am very drunk, so this is quite an effort to recall all these players!

 

[Hurricane]

CENTERS (second-fives and outside-centres)

1. Philippe Sella (France)
2. Danie Gerber (South Africa)
3. Mike Gibson (Ireland)
4. Jeff Butterfield (England)
5. Tim Horan (Australia)
6. Brian O'Driscoll (Ireland)
7. John Gainsford (South AFrica)
8. Mannetjies Roux (South Africa)
9. Trevor Allan (Australia)
10. R.H. Williams (Wales)

Sella... was the most capped player for a long time - the first player to make it to 100 Tests. He did it despite the French selectors being horrible.

Gerber was maybe the greatest rugby player ever... but we didn't see enough. Destroyed Walter Little in 1992 - D-E-S-T-R-O-Y-E-D!

Gibson... Lions legend - a contender for any all-time XV.

Butterfield... a throwback to those Lions I love.

Horan - best defensive back I ever saw. Tackled everything!

O'Driscoll... overrated. Umaga's attack on him ranks with Kevin Skinner's attack on two props, and I admired the classy way O'Driscoll handled that!

Gainsford... big... fast... straight runner...

Roux... the most underrated player of all time!

Allan - the ice man cometh!

Williams... Welsh legend!

We have discussed this before. Please Francis. It is the Great Serge Blanco, and The Great Phillippe Sella.

Same also goes for Porta.

 

[Francis]

SECOND-ROWERS!

1. FRIK DU PREEZ
2. John Eales
3. Martin Johnson
4. Willie John McBride
5. Gordon Brown
6. John Claasen
7. Mark Andrews
8. Bill Beaumont
9. Paul Ackford
10. Steve Cutler

All I'll say is this... FRIK DU PREEZ IS THE GREATEST RUGBY PLAYER THAT EVER PLAYED THE GAME! BOKKE!

 

[hendrix]

Weird dude.

 

[Furball]

Nobody cares what you think

 

[Fuller Pilch]

I came here to see if anyone was discussing Super Rugby but instead there of been pages of hypothetical best players without All Blacks

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Just briefly... South Africa is a truly amazing rugby nation in terms of producing amazing prop-forwards.

Mof Myburgh seems to be the first amazing prop - a star of the first side to beat New Zealand
"Okey" Giffen kicked goals during the 1949 series against New Zealand
Boy Louw mostly played in the second row, but sometimes played in the front-row
Chris Koch had amazing ball skills for his day
Jaap Bekker was the best rugby player in the world in his day
Hannes Marias had an incredibly long career in the toughest of circumstances
Os du Randt also belongs to this phenomenal group

A few amazing thugs too - Johan Le Roux, Dean Greyling...

 

[Fuller Pilch]

That's good - I agree that the four best sides are there. It is a shame that the travel factor may determine the winner. As a fan of the Highlanders I am pretty annoyed at the Crusaders - first they let the Hurricanes get a bonus point and stop us getting a 1/4 final in Dunedin, then they lose to the Lions and stop us getting a semi in Dunners! Admittedly we were pretty lucky to hold on against the Brumbies in Canberra.

 

[Spark]

Francis, please use the edit button instead of making half a dozen posts in a row.

Also, easy on the fonts.

 

[Furball]

Francis, please use the edit button instead of making half a dozen posts in a row.

Also, easy on the fonts.

*log out button

 

[Lillian Thomson]

Lots of very corny jokes about Bath having a cunning plan.

Todd Blackadder named Bath director of rugby, with Tabai Matson head coach - BBC Sport

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Lots of very corny jokes about Bath having a cunning plan.

Todd Blackadder named Bath director of rugby, with Tabai Matson head coach - BBC Sport

a

Might not be a very cunning plan - Blackadder had the world-class teams with the Crusaders McCaw, Carter, Read, Whitelock, Brad Thorn, Dagg, Crotty, Owen Franks etc etc (sides as good as the Lions) and never once won the Super rugby title

 

[Zinzan]

We have discussed this before. Please Francis. It is the Great Serge Blanco, and The Great Phillippe Sella.

Same also goes for Porta.

As great as Sella was, I do actually with Francis that if there was one better centre to have played the game than he, it had to be Danie Gerber, almost the most perfect physique a centre could have.

 

[Francis]

As great as Sella was, I do actually with Francis that if there was one better centre to have played the game than he, it had to be Danie Gerber, almost the most perfect physique a centre could have.

YouTube has been spoiling us recently with both Springboks videos and Danie Gerber videos. Some Springbok fan has been collecting clips from great players and posting them in one long video - which I love!

I honestly believe, but for the apartheid boycotts (which were moral and necessary) Danie Gerber would have become the greatest rugby player of all time. The thing about Gerber is: I don't actually know whether he was a good passer of the ball. He never seems to need to pass the ball! The first video shows two instances where Gerber should have passed the ball to an unmarked player on the inside who would have scored, but instead he just runs over the defender and scores the try himself. Honestly, he has no weaknesses and no flaws. He's big, incredibly fast, can step off both feet...

The impact he had in the few Tests that he did play in is remarkable! That try he scored against Ireland, causing two defenders to run into each other! The four tries he scored against England. The four tries he scored against the Barbarians. In 1992 he scored two tries against *** ******* in that one off Test, and practically engineered an incredible comeback all by himself, setting up the winning try, only for the pass to be dropped and *** ******* to win the Test 26-23.

I really honestly think he would have been the greatest rugby player of all time!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tf8d5omZFoU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UXN3bJxDKU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE7sXwcbOgY

It's scary how good South Africa were in the 1980s - Nass Botha, Michel du Plessis, Danie Gerber, Ray Mordt, Carel du Plessis and Andre Joubert - that's a better backline that the Welsh had in the 70s!

---------------------------

EDIT: It would be wonderful if we could have seen that backline against the 1984 Grand Slam Wallabies' backline... Farr-Jones, Ella, Lynagh, Slack, Moon, Campese, Gould.

It would have been even better if Wally Lewis never converted to rugby league after the 1978 Schoolboys Tour to the UK. The same goes for Michael O'Connor.

The Aussies could have had a backline: Farr-Jones, Ella, Moon, Lewis, O'Connor, Campese, Gould.

It would have been wonderful to see the best Springboks backline face the greatest ever Wallabies backline.

 

[Zinzan]

*** me is this dude human? I get the odd cricket can play past 40, but a Rugby player?

Former All Black lock Brad Thorn is coming out of retirement at the age of 41 | Stuff.co.nz

 

[Francis]

Unfortunately, I can't use the edit button, and I want to do a fullbacks list again...

1. Serge Blanco
2. J.P.R. Williams
3. Andy Irvine
4. H.O. de Villiers
5. Andre Joubert
6. Gavin Hastings
7. Matt Burke
8. Chris Latham
9. Roger Gould
10. Pierre Villepreux

I forgot about Joubert and Villepreux last time. The problem with Joubert is that, like Gerber, we didn't see enough of him. It's scary, but if you were picking the greatest South African XV of all-time, you could argue that with the exception of the scrumhalf and Michel du Plessis, the backline should be the same as the Springboks backline from the 80s. Mordt and du Plessis are often cited as SA's two greatest wingers. Joubert may have been the best SA fullback ever. Gerber walks it in. Michel du Plessis was apparently awesome, but is he as good as Gainsford or Roux?

Here's a clip of Roux - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMECop9k0hA

I honestly believe, when selecting a 12 in an all-time side, that after Sella and Gibson, Roux would be the next best pick.

 

[Francis]

BLEDISLOE CUP


Alright! It's time for the Bledisloe Cup! Australia v *** *******. No Nonu, no Smith, no McCaw, no Carter... *** ******* really need Dagg to continue his good form heading into this series. It should be much closer. Pocock will be back after injuring his eye-socket. I might be going to the Auckland Test as a treat to myself. Here are my 10 favourite Bledisloe Cup moments:

10. Mortlock makes a break and outs Staniforth over the line - 2007.
9. Kefu reaches out and scores off an outrageous Larkham pass - gives John Eales a good send-off.
8. Topo Rodriguez tackles Hika Reid and changes momentum in deciding Test -1986.
7. Matt Burke totally fakes out Christian Cullen!!! 1996! George Gregan is celebrating as he races toward the line.
6. Peter Grigg... chip and regather - 1980.
5. Ella passes the ball around Andy Haden's body
4. 1982 - The greatest try in Bledisloe Cup History! Passed through 11 hands! Ella supports his wing! Campese scores!
3. Greg Cornelson scores four tries - not one of them come from a pass, and he travels less than a meter for all of them!
2. John Eales kicks the winning penalty in 2000, after the ref nearly blew the whistle waaaaay tooo early!
1. George Gregan humiliates Jeff Wilson by making that incredible tackle

And here's my all-time Australia XV:

1. Topo Rodriguez
A contender for an all-time XV, if you ask me. THE MOLE!

2. Phil Kearns
In terms of rugby commentary, he's the equivalent of 10 Bill McLarens. He's always objective and always insightful. His line-out throwing and scrummaging weren't as good as Tom Lawton Jr's... but he was like a fourth backrower, very mobile, and had some mongrel in him.


3. Jon White
Propped against the best in South Africa in 1963. Had epic battles with Hannes Marias. Made Ken Gray look stupid several time in 1964.

4. Rob Heming
Just beats Steve Cutler for me. Heming was spotted late in life, but his line-out throwing won it in SA in 1963.

5. John Eales
Nobody is perfect.

6. Willie Ofahengaue
Has a winning record against *** *******, and he was Australia's best player in the 1991 World Cup Final.

7. Con Windon
He just beats George Smith for me. Smith beat McCaw in just about every battle they had, but "Breeze" held the record for most tries by an Australian before Brendan Moon broke that 40 years later. His support play was immaculate.

8. Mark Loane
Like Buck Shelford, only tougher and better.

9. Ken Catchpole
But for Colin Meads, we would be calling this man greater than Gareth Edwards.

10. Mark Ella
Couldn't kick, couldn't step, wasn't very fast, but changed the way rugby could be played. Deprived himself of so much room so he could give opportunities to his outside backs, and once the ball came to them, he appears as if from no where to take the ball back. He was truly unique!

11. Brendan Moon
Underrated. Had no weaknesses. Scored many tries off Mark Ella cross-field kicks.

12. Tim Horan
The best defensive number 12 ever!

13. Trevor Allan
What makes his accomplishment even more special is that the Wallabies weren't full-strength in 1949, and yet they swept NZ 3-0. NZ also lost to South Africa 0-4 that year - not a great year at all for *** *******.

14. David Campese
The Pele, the Maradonna of rugby all rolled into one.

15. Matt Burke
Made Christian Cullen look stupid when he faked him out in 1996. He's going to be my goal-kicker for this side.

Substitutes


16. Tom Lawton Jr
Sean Fitzpatrick rates him the toughest opponent he ever had.

17. Bill Cerutti
"Wild" Bill... the original sledger.

18. Steve Cutler
When Andy Haden wasn't cheating, *** ******* couldn't do anything against him.

19. George Smith
Beat the pants off Richie McCaw so many times it's not even funny. He could play any position in the back-row, including eightman.

20. Nick Farr-Jones
Ouch! I don't know whether I should have NFJ or John Hipwell.

21. Michael Lynagh
The best tactical kicking game of any five-eighth. Outplayed Grant Fox all the time!

22. Cyril Towers
Mindful that Campo could probably play fullback, I've gone for this man who made Bert Cooke look stupid.

And here is a composite of Australia and South Africa to beat New Zealand


1. Topo Rodriguez
2. Uli Schmidt
3. Chris Koch
4. Frik du Preez
5. John Eales
6. Jan Ellis
7. Col Windon
8. Hennie Muller
9. Ken Catchpole
10. Mark Ella
11. Carel du Plessis
12. Tim Horan
13. Danie Gerber
14. David Campese
15. H.O. de Villiers