***Official*** New Zealand in Zimbabwe and South Africa 2015

[kiwiviktor81]

I think any concerns about Williamson's game is a bit premature given that his test output has gone through the roof at the same time as his SR's in ODI's and T20's have been rapidly rising.

Very premature. It doesn't reflect a change of approach, rather it reflects Williamson is adding more and more weapons to his arsenal as he learns to maximise his effectiveness in an ever-wider range of situations.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if Williamson ended his Test career striking at 80 plus.

Also, can anyone pick the starting XIs for the ODI tomorrow? If you can I'll run a simulation. I heard Faf du Plessis will likely miss the series due to a knee injury and they've brought Behardien in.

 

[Zinzan]

It's quite phenomenal just how bad Ronchi has been with the bat (and ordinary with the gloves for that matter) since that wonderful knock of 170 vs. SL.

In his 16 innings since then, he's amassed 196 runs @ an average of 13 and SR of 112. Who would have picked he'd deteriorate quite this badly after successful series vs. SA, in the UAE & then that SL series prior to the WC?

 

[Zinzan]

SKY are in the business of making money. A lot of people want to point to their profit margin as proof of why they should've bent over and paid whatever sum of money was asked...I'd suggest such a move would be indicative of a company who would regularly spend their time in the red.

SKY are not obligated to pay price X for everything that is out there. I find it impossible to believe they are the ones playing the 'we won't budge an inch and bugger what our subscribers think' card.

That's all well & good provided it's a calculated decision on their part that the extra 50K (if indeed that is the number) is worth more to them than any potential fall-out & decrease in goodwill that may eventuate from this. Clearly that seems to be their take on it (again, assuming those numbers are thereabouts) and that's their prerogative.

Personally I think it's extremely short-sighted, because once things get more competitive for them (which it invariably will) and there are alternative options for NZ'ders in the future...even if it's at about the same price, I think most cricket fans will go elsewhere now. I know I certainly will, because they'll have zero loyalty...not that they have much to start with tbf.

 

[Chewie]

I tried using the Hola extension through Chrome, which is how I've always accessed my US Netflix membership from NZ, but that didn't work on Ten Sports. Can you recommend any good VPN's that work in India. I don't mind paying if there's a small fee involved provided it works..

Offtopic, but hola is very dodgy and I wouldn't use them. Do a google search and you'll find lots of concerns people have with using it

 

[Zinzan]

Offtopic, but hola is very dodgy and I wouldn't use them. Do a google search and you'll find lots of concerns people have with using it

Cheers, I've heard this a few times, especially the part around them on-selling bandwidth. I haven't ever had issues around speed, spyware, viruses... certainly none I'm aware of, but I may looking at an alternative VPN.

 

[SteveNZ]

That's all well & good provided it's a calculated decision on their part that the extra 50K (if indeed that is the number) is worth more to them than any potential fall-out & decrease in goodwill that may eventuate from this. Clearly that seems to be their take on it (again, assuming those numbers are thereabouts) and that's their prerogative.

Personally I think it's extremely short-sighted, because once things get more competitive for them (which it invariably will) and there are alternative options for NZ'ders in the future...even if it's at about the same price, I think most cricket fans will go elsewhere now. I know I certainly will, because they'll have zero loyalty...not that they have much to start with tbf.

It's hard to take that 50k (or whatever figure, it may well be higher) as an isolated figure. You're either tight as a drum on those sort of things or you're letting every man and his network take you for an extra dosh in every sport you bid for.

In short I don't know enough, our media don't report effectively on it because all we seem to get in the Herald these days are Buzzfeed style stories and match reports/PR rewrites.

You're probably right though if you say SKY aren't seeing the big beast that is online streaming coming, especially when cable gets things roaring around NZ. If I get to a point in the future where I pay $200 for a streamed cricket service that gives me everything around the world, and another $200 for my golf, I'll do that. I already get my league online for $3 a week or $90 a season, and if I really want to watch rugby I go to a pub. I'm already using my old lady's SKY GO and refusing to pay $100 a month through the TV.

 

[SteveNZ]

It looks like his slogging has really developed to a new level. That concerns me.

New team
Guptil
Brendon
Elliot
Munro
Anderson
Neesham
Ronchi
Bracewell
Nmac
Mcleakinruns ( my phone now auto corrects to that)
Milne

Batting down to number 9

By the way apparently Munro has expressed an interest in leadership roles in the blackcaps limited overs set up.

I agree with your premise, and the side you've picked are all international players so that's solid. Then you could pick one flavour of the month domestic T20 player (or two, whatever) to compliment the guys with experience around them. Having said that, I abhor international T20 so I'm not best placed to speak on approach. Kane has every right to play because he's the best choice for whatever place he bats in the side, and he wants to play T20 I presume given he went to the IPL.

Just FYI, Manu has a very good cricket brain. It doesn't always show given his impulsiveness with the bat but he'd make a very good Auckland captain in my opinion.

 

[Zinzan]

It's hard to take that 50k (or whatever figure, it may well be higher) as an isolated figure. You're either tight as a drum on those sort of things or you're letting every man and his network take you for an extra dosh in every sport you bid for.

In short I don't know enough, our media don't report effectively on it because all we seem to get in the Herald these days are Buzzfeed style stories and match reports/PR rewrites.

You're probably right though if you say SKY aren't seeing the big beast that is online streaming coming, especially when cable gets things roaring around NZ. If I get to a point in the future where I pay $200 for a streamed cricket service that gives me everything around the world, and another $200 for my golf, I'll do that. I already get my league online for $3 a week or $90 a season, and if I really want to watch rugby I go to a pub. I'm already using my old lady's SKY GO and refusing to pay $100 a month through the TV.

Yup, that's true, we don't know the numbers for sure & that could just be speculation. I still feel Sky execs would do well to engage with some ex-Telecom execs from 10-15 years ago to understand just how important goodwill/loyalty with existing customers is when a company is moving from a monopolistic environment to a competitive one. Telecom have since conceded they really missed the boat 10 years ago when it came to protecting their goodwill and establishing loyalty.

It might be a touch simplistic labeling Sky a monopoly, but for all intents and purposes they are in my eyes considering it's live sports (rugby primarily) that give them their advantage. And let's be honest, all those meaningless default channels they dump on subscribers without a choice are sold on the back of their exclusive live sports coverage.

 

[Hurricane]

I think any concerns about Williamson's game is a bit premature given that his test output has gone through the roof at the same time as his SR's in ODI's and T20's have been rapidly rising.

Australian news: Michael Clarke quits Twenty20, Cameron White is new captain | Cricket | ESPN Cricinfo

Clarke's golden run began when he quit T20. Now Clarke's decision was easier because he sucked in that format nonetheless he benefitted from concentrating his training efforts on fewer forms of the game.

One of Kane's shots, for want of a better word, was a cross batted smash through mid off. It was at that point I came to the conclusion he, like Tim and Trent should only play in important T20 matches (if such a concept exists).

Who cares if we lose meaningless bilateral T20 encounters. I am starting to agree that T20 should only be played domestically anyway.

 

[SteveNZ]

Good points Zinzan, I actually do believe SKY have a monopolistic mentality. And there's too many dinosaurs in top management that won't see it coming until it's too late.

Cane, I would indulge you in a topic I truly believe in - that T20 shouldn't be an international format - but I also believe in not wasting breath, and we all know it's a cash cow that isn't going anywhere.

 

[JediNudist]

Too bad you guys cant see it. I have Foxtel and they have coverage of NZ in SA. They never bothered with NZ in Zimbabwe.

 

[Flem274*]

Online selective streaming is the future. I do it for horse stuff and there are several sites with free (limited access options) which make most of their dosh from advertising and they do bloody well for themselves. You provide live sport for free or a small fee and have a premium membership option for things like delayed coverage, full replays of anything from ten years ago etc and bombard viewers with advertising in between classes, overs or whatever and laugh on the way to the bank knowing Eurosport (Country TV over here) will get sweet **** all viewers below 30 years old.

Hey Sky

 

[Flem274*]

Sky would be dead in a week over summer if cricket was provided online by a streaming provider for a reasonable price.

 

[Hurricane]

Online selective streaming is the future. I do it for horse stuff and there are several sites with free (limited access options) which make most of their dosh from advertising and they do bloody well for themselves. You provide live sport for free or a small fee and have a premium membership option for things like delayed coverage, full replays of anything from ten years ago etc and bombard viewers with advertising in between classes, overs or whatever and laugh on the way to the bank knowing Eurosport (Country TV over here) will get sweet **** all viewers below 30 years old.

Hey Sky

Yeah the TV is actually a horse and buggy product. Hopefully that doesn't need a definition.

The future is web sites that offer streaming and conglomerate web sites that offer grouped packages of shows. Whatever show you want to watch at any time just watch it through your computer.

In the year 2000 a popular question I would ask at parties at MBA school was pick a technology - TV, phone, or the PC - which one will be the centre point of convergence (again hopefully doesn't need a definition)

One smart alec picked the phone after everyone else I spoke to picked the PC. No one went for the TV by the way. Even though at the time Internet access through the TV was having millions poured into from an R&D perspective.

Now the only question I would ask at parties is phone or PC - which will win out. I think most people would go for phones now. I think the only thing up for debate is what size these things end up being.

Oh yes what was my point of this post. Yes I AWTA with flem. Invest in companies that offer Internet Access. I pay $80 for my access a month. I used to pay $20 for dial up (and it was almost as fast for surfing) now I pay 4 times as much. In the future they will charge more if they possibly can. Internet Access - it is a ticket to print money.

 

[TheJammyTurtle]

Very premature. It doesn't reflect a change of approach, rather it reflects Williamson is adding more and more weapons to his arsenal as he learns to maximise his effectiveness in an ever-wider range of situations.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if Williamson ended his Test career striking at 80 plus.

Also, can anyone pick the starting XIs for the ODI tomorrow? If you can I'll run a simulation. I heard Faf du Plessis will likely miss the series due to a knee injury and they've brought Behardien in.

Guptill
Latham
Kane
Elliott
Neesham
Munro
Ronchi
NMac
Milne
Bracewell
McCleneghan


Amla
Van Wyk
Russow
AB
Miller
Behardien
Wiese
Philander
Steyn
Rabada
Tahir

 

[TheJammyTurtle]

I think the ICC should really work with boards to provide a subscription streaming services for all international cricket.Would definitely be something I would pay for.

 

[SteveNZ]

As I said earlier, part of SKY's issues is that they have dinosaurs in top and middle management. Richard Last, the director of sport, is about as antiquated as it gets. Martin Crowe makes a strong point of saying how much he hated working under him, and I've heard the same from others. And Fellett is the guy who employed him.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's a toss of the coin whether SKY exists in 10 years. I highly doubt anyone subscribes for sub-par movies with limited access to them on demand, and sport could go the same way. Maybe we'll look back at this series as the sliding doors moment.

 

[Kippax]

Guptill
Latham
Kane
Elliott
Neesham
Munro
Ronchi
NMac
Milne
Bracewell
McCleneghan

It was interesting to me how Hesson (kind of weirdly) listed KW at No. 4 on the official 1st T20 team sheet. I could see Worker debut at 3 tomorrow itbt.

 

[Bahnz]

Australian news: Michael Clarke quits Twenty20, Cameron White is new captain | Cricket | ESPN Cricinfo

Clarke's golden run began when he quit T20. Now Clarke's decision was easier because he sucked in that format nonetheless he benefitted from concentrating his training efforts on fewer forms of the game.

One of Kane's shots, for want of a better word, was a cross batted smash through mid off. It was at that point I came to the conclusion he, like Tim and Trent should only play in important T20 matches (if such a concept exists).

Who cares if we lose meaningless bilateral T20 encounters. I am starting to agree that T20 should only be played domestically anyway.

Ok, a few things:

a) correlation does not equal causation - BMac has had a golden run over the last 18 months in test cricket at precisely the same time as he's taken even more of a T20 style approach to his batting than he had previously.

b) Not all players are the same: just because Clarke may have benefitted from quitting T20's, doesn't mean that the same will hold true for everyone. Plenty of top-level batsmen from a number of countries (Sangakkara, Jayawardene, Kohli, Root etc.) have played and continue to play both tests and T20's to an extremely high standard. Furthermore, Williamson plays a lot less cricket in all formats than Clarke did, so the difficulties of switching back and forth between the formats in short timeframes is likely to be less severe on him.

c) We've yet to see any negative impact on Williamson's batting in any formats. He played a couple of pure, well-paced, classic-KW ODI-innings in the last couple of weeks (right down to being dismissed in the 90's), and he recently scored a superb hundred at Lords in a test-match against a high quality bowling unit. Until there's some evidence that T20 cricket is actually affecting his batting negatively (and I have to say that given his standards of professionalism, KW is likely to be a far better judge of that than you or me) I see absolutely no reason why he should restrict himself from playing T20's.

d) Just because he played a cross-batted slog at one stage doesn't mean that that's a sign that his skills are deteriorating. Ross Taylor was carving up in test cricket at the same time as he was playing his cow corner hockey-slog every other ball in the IPL.

So yeah, this strikes me as an overreaction to the continued expansion of KW's skills as a batsman. Furthermore - and I concede that this is tangential to the debate at hand - expecting him to give up T20 cricket like Clarke did is a hugely unrealistic expectation to have. Clarke could afford to quit T20's because he gets paid $1+ million by Cricket Australia. KW gets maybe $250k from NZ cricket, so it's only reasonable to expect that he's going to look to take advantage of the IPL and other T20 money-making opportunities where they arise. Given that he'll already be playing a lot of T20 cricket anyway, I don't really see the value in him cutting out a half dozen or so T20I's from his calendar (besides maybe the obvious benefit of getting a rest every now and then).

 

[Hurricane]

Ok, a few things:

a) correlation does not equal causation - BMac has had a golden run over the last 18 months in test cricket at precisely the same time as he's taken even more of a T20 style approach to his batting than he had previously.

b) Not all players are the same: just because Clarke may have benefitted from quitting T20's, doesn't mean that the same will hold true for everyone. Plenty of top-level batsmen from a number of countries (Sangakkara, Jayawardene, Kohli, Root etc.) have played and continue to play both tests and T20's to an extremely high standard. Furthermore, Williamson plays a lot less cricket in all formats than Clarke did, so the difficulties of switching back and forth between the formats in short timeframes is likely to be less severe on him.

c) We've yet to see any negative impact on Williamson's batting in any formats. He played a couple of pure, well-paced, classic-KW ODI-innings in the last couple of weeks (right down to being dismissed in the 90's), and he recently scored a superb hundred at Lords in a test-match against a high quality bowling unit. Until there's some evidence that T20 cricket is actually affecting his batting negatively (and I have to say that given his standards of professionalism, KW is likely to be a far better judge of that than you or me) I see absolutely no reason why he should restrict himself from playing T20's.

d) Just because he played a cross-batted slog at one stage doesn't mean that that's a sign that his skills are deteriorating. Ross Taylor was carving up in test cricket at the same time as he was playing his cow corner hockey-slog every other ball in the IPL.

So yeah, this strikes me as an overreaction to the continued expansion of KW's skills as a batsman. Furthermore - and I concede that this is tangential to the debate at hand - expecting him to give up T20 cricket like Clarke did is a hugely unrealistic expectation to have. Clarke could afford to quit T20's because he gets paid $1+ million by Cricket Australia. KW gets maybe $250k from NZ cricket, so it's only reasonable to expect that he's going to look to take advantage of the IPL and other T20 money-making opportunities where they arise. Given that he'll already be playing a lot of T20 cricket anyway, I don't really see the value in him cutting out a half dozen or so T20I's from his calendar (besides maybe the obvious benefit of getting a rest every now and then).

You forgot your most important point. NZ would lose these T20 matches without him.