****OFFICIAL**** Lara vs Tendulkar Debate Thread

[Pratters]

And yet Lara's record against India is patchy.

Yes. So what? It doesn't prove any thing.

 

[aussie]

Just because he was almost supreme against spin doesn't mean he is "iffy" against pace... You are just taking this to ridiculous levels now.

Word, Lara was just as good vs Tendy againts pace. Its just given his inferior technique which McGrath exposed, he wasn't as consistent againts them especially away from home.

 

[honestbharani]

He did not bat slower than required. (How'd you prove such a thing? ). Also note I am of the opinion that India's innings was stretched by atleast 15-20 overs due to the delayed declaration. In hindishgt Tendulkar should not have gone beyond 180 or max 200 in any case. Blame the captain for that, not Tendulkar.

I don't really care... Sachin batted slowly both in that game and in Multan as he was not in form but he was batting slowly even when he was set. Not holding it against him at all as he had other guys playing well at the other end but honestly, if you say Lara was selfish for that 400, it should be the same with SAchin and the way he batted in those two innings.. He was basically batting for the NO towards the end of both knocks.. And I watched every ball..

 

[honestbharani]

He was not supreme against raw pace. His poor record overseas against quality bowling attacks is proof of that.

He is a very good player of spin, just a good player of fast bowling.

care to illustrate this poor record? And what is Sachin's record against RSA away btw?

 

[Pratters]

McGrath - Lara slightly ahead of Tendulkar, best batsman I have bowled to.

Melbourne, December 23: Glenn McGrath named West Indies legend Brian Lara as the best batsman he ever bowled to in his international career, ‘just slightly ahead’ of Sachin Tendulkar.

When asked to pick his toughest opponent in his 13-year-old career, McGrath picked Lara ahead of Tendulkar and said he was always driven to give his best when bowling against those two.

"To me it was always about how you went against the guys who were classed the best in the world," McGrath said after announcing he would quit international cricket after the World Cup in April next.

"I feel, personally, that on his day Brian Lara was probably the guy who was the standout, just slightly ahead of Sachin."

 

[MrIncredible]

Ok I got it

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | Cricinfo.com

Tendulkar averages 63 in 8 tests against Ambrose and Walsh.

U mean either Walsh or Ambrose. Sorry to nit pick but Ambrose didnt play the 94 series in India. Cuffy, Cummins and Benjamin did. Ambrose played in the 97 series (as did a fadin Bishop) granted Tendy did very well but to assume Lara wouldnt have done just as well (particularly in the WI) is just way off base

 

[aussie]

89 as a matter of fact..

Yea no prob. No wonder they took him to PAK 90, that innings would have had them all excited ATT.

 

[honestbharani]

Word, Lara was just as good vs Tendy againts pace. Its just given his inferior technique which McGrath exposed, he wasn't as consistent againts them especially away from home.

He has scored HUGE runs against McGrath, so it is not as if McGrath always worked him out. There were juz two series in 96 and 2000 when that was the case. And even in 2000 after the 3rd test, he was getting the better of McGrath...

 

[subshakerz]

Ok I got it

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | Cricinfo.com

Tendulkar averages 63 in 8 tests against Ambrose and Walsh.

Ambrose never played in India.

 

[honestbharani]

U mean either Walsh or Ambrose. Sorry to nit pick but Ambrose didnt play the 94 series in India. Cuffy, Cummins and Benjamin did. Ambrose played in the 97 series (as did a fadin Bishop) granted Tendy did very well but to assume Lara wouldnt have done just as well (particularly in the WI) is just way off base

even in that 97 series Walsh didn't play in Barbados...

 

[honestbharani]

even in that 97 series Walsh didn't play in Barbados...

Apologies to all other posters here... Reading the last few posts, I can see how it might show up as if I don't rate Sachin. As many of the regulars here would understand, esp. Pratters ( ), that is not the case at all... But some of the stuff Precam has been throwing out here about Lara is stupid to say the least.... And hence I have been posting this way.

 

[MrIncredible]

Word, Lara was just as good vs Tendy againts pace. Its just given his inferior technique which McGrath exposed, he wasn't as consistent againts them especially away from home.

Agreed. And vs Donald as well. Im a huge Lara fan but i would be lying to u if i didnt admit that he got exposed in the 98 series away in RSA. Vs spin though i would give lara the edge though, if for nothing else his total domination of Murali home and away.

Aussie i acknowledge Laras shortcomings but then u have these Tendy groupies who make it seem like Tendy is the best thing since slice bread. I even remember a poster (Rivera or Riviera i think) who was debating that Tendy was comparable to Bradman (if not better).

Tendy is in that chase back fighting for 2nd best with the likes of : Sobers, Hutton, Lara, Viv, G Chappell, Ponting, Hobbs, Hammond etc.); he is not clearly the best no matter what Richard Hadlee may think.

Lara will always rate for me because when u talk about facing an all time attack only one of the 2 has shown that he could dominate:

Oz series at home '99. Lara dominated an attack containing 2 all time greats and a very very good pacer (Gillespie) and a very good spinner (macgill).

 

[Pratters]

Aussie i acknowledge Laras shortcomings but then u have these Tendy groupies who make it seem like Tendy is the best thing since slice bread. I even remember a poster (Rivera or Riviera i think) who was debating that Tendy was comparable to Bradman (if not better).

Bradman also felt their games were comparable.

 

[honestbharani]

Lara by the slightest possible bit imaginable, for me. But I agree, this thread is gonna get ugly. Let us hope the fact that these two gentlemen are very good friends and have always been magnanimous in their praise for each other makes sure that the members here don't get over excited and start treating this personally.

wanna bring this up again, esp. for Precam.

 

[aussie]

He has scored HUGE runs against McGrath, so it is not as if McGrath always worked him out. There were juz two series in 96 and 2000 when that was the case. And even in 2000 after the 3rd test, he was getting the better of McGrath...

Overall in all series vs 95 to 2005/06. I'd say McGrath won more contest TBF.

WI 95 - McGrath won for sure
AUS 96/97 - McGrath won most battles. Lara scored a hundred in the dead rubber 5th test
WI 99 - Even
AUS 2000 - McGrath
WI 2003 - McGrath was out of form, so this shouldn't be considered.
AUS 05/06 - Hmm it was a riveting battle. Lara got some bad decisions etc. But Lara wasn't dominant vs McGrath in the 1st two test. So i'll call it even here as well.

Plus he not so prolific runs vs PAK/SA in those countries. Not scoring a hundred againts Donald/Pollock - Wasim/Waqar.

 

[Pigeon]

wud probably be a good idea if u read those first before u post as if Lara did nothing in FC cricket while Sachin has...


BTW, excepting Kumble, we haven't had a "great" bowler throughout Sachin's career...

In FC matches against Curtly Ambrose, Lara averaged 26.3 in 10 innings.

 

[Pigeon]

Ambrose never played in India.

Oops I put "or" critieria. Surely he played in the series in WI then? Still Tendulkar managed a good avg of 56!

 

[aussie]

Bradman also felt their games were comparable.

Did he?. I have a DVD 'World of Cricket - Profiles of Cricket Legends". Where Bradman, Richards, Botham, Tendy, Crowe, Imran, G Pollock are profiled. In it Bradman says Tendy reminds him of himself technically & i think their is strong truth to that TBH.

 

[honestbharani]

Overall in all series vs 95 to 2005/06. I'd say McGrath won more contest TBF.

WI 95 - McGrath won for sure
AUS 96/97 - McGrath won most battles. Lara scored a hundred in the dead rubber 5th test
WI 99 - Even
AUS 2000 - McGrath
WI 2003 - McGrath was out of form, so this shouldn't be considered.
AUS 05/06 - Hmm it was a riveting battle. Lara got some bad decisions etc. But Lara wasn't dominant vs McGrath in the 1st two test. So i'll call it even here as well.

Plus he not so prolific runs vs PAK/SA in those countries. Not scoring a hundred againts Donald/Pollock - Wasim/Waqar.

no way was 99 even. That was Lara Vs the whole Aussie bowling line up and Lara won!!!


And why is that McGrath being out of form wont be considered and Lara being woefully out of form in 96 with all those disputes with the board and Richie Richardson will be considered?


Fact is:

95 in Windies - Even
96 in Aus - McGrath easily (that dead rubber hundred happens to be one of the greatest knocks of Lara. It was the last of the really quick Perth pitches and he was head and shoulders above the other batsmen in that test)
99 - Lara
2000- McGrath
2003- Lara
2005 - Lara

 

[Pratters]

Did he?. I have a DVD 'World of Cricket - Profiles of Cricket Legends". Where Bradman, Richards, Botham, Tendy, Crowe, Imran, G Pollock are profiled. In it Bradman says Tendy reminds him of himself technically & i think their is strong truth to that TBH.

Yeah they were comparable 'technique wise'. That's what Bradman had said - that Tendulkar's game reminded him of his own game. Tendulkar himself is humble and acknowledges Bradman is far superior like he should.

More on Bradman's take on Tendulkar here.