***Official*** India in Pakistan

[pug]

What is the new game plan of calling opponents favourites?

Yup, was beginning to irritate me until "they will be under heavy pressure" - Bhajji.

Long live the sons of Punjab!

 

[pug]

One more thread involving the Indian team goes down a similar drain.....there's so much to talk aobut Indian cricket, so why get back to this much-discussed (and much-abused) topic again?

Because its the biggest plague affecting Indian cricket right now and some people might see it really hurting indian cricket in the years to come. This should be a wakeup call to the bcci of the negative aspects of having zonal selectors (like pratyush said). And if we just move on from this critical issue to other things, it might well be let aside (as it has always been done so far) and things will remain as bad or get worse.

 

[Jono]

Yup, was beginning to irritate me until "they will be under heavy pressure" - Bhajji.

Long live the sons of Punjab!

LOL! Gotta love Harbhajan to end the friendly embraces

 

[Arjun]

Because its the biggest plague affecting Indian cricket right now and some people might see it really hurting indian cricket in the years to come. This should be a wakeup call to the bcci of the negative aspects of having zonal selectors (like pratyush said). And if we just move on from this critical issue to other things, it might well be let aside (as it has always been done so far) and things will remain as bad or get worse.

There are a few things wrong with the way the Indian team is made up, and the way they're playing. That's far more important than satisfying a few bruised egos. Boot polishing can wait. There are tournaments to win.

 

[adharcric]

No one is arguing about Sourav's selection in the team (even that is debatable at best) but the way people like SJS and adharcric are making gross generalizations about people of Kolkata.

Point is would it be fair If I call Mumbaikars as goons of Shiv Sena ? Few idiots dont make people of Kolkata.

no one's making generalizations about kolkatans. it's the disgraceful ones who show up at the matches and cheer for the wrong team for the wrong reason that are making a bad name for everyone in the city. don't make up stuff now, and i seriously hope you dont condone the behavior of "certain" kolkatan fans lately.

 

[Arjun]

You think the omission of Ganguly was unfair, but what about what happened to Joginder Sharma and JP Yadav? Both are frontline all-rounders for their FC teams. Ganguly, on the other hand, is just another batsman in the Indian team, and not as relevant as these two. Yet, when he is dropped, a major furore is raised all over India, and everyone rallies round him. Even if he's been dropped for a reason. These two all-rounders have done little wrong, and yet they lose their places. And nobody complains– though they are a solution for a problem that has weakened the Indian team for years. Why?

 

[Pratters]

You think the omission of Ganguly was unfair, but what about what happened to Joginder Sharma and JP Yadav? Both are frontline all-rounders for their FC teams. Ganguly, on the other hand, is just another batsman in the Indian team, and not as relevant as these two. Yet, when he is dropped, a major furore is raised all over India, and everyone rallies round him. Even if he's been dropped for a reason. These two all-rounders have done little wrong, and yet they lose their places. And nobody complains– though they are a solution for a problem that has weakened the Indian team for years. Why?

Why are you repeating the issue of Joginder Sharma and Yadav being omitted on every thread and have a problem when other people raise various other issues?

No one is stopping you from discussing what you think important. I thought there were more important issues than the omission or inclusion of player X,Y,Z and brought it up.

 

[Sudeep]

The fact I can't understand is why are certain Bengalis complaining, why are certain other people complaining about people asking why are Bengalis complaining, when the Indian team is doing perfectly well.

 

[Arjun]

Why are you repeating the issue of Joginder Sharma and Yadav being omitted on every thread and have a problem when other people raise various other issues?

No one is stopping you from discussing what you think important. I thought there were more important issues than the omission or inclusion of player X,Y,Z and brought it up.

There is so much to talk about on Indian cricket, and I only raise that issue when needed. Yet, on every thread that relates to the Indian team, we find long, boring debates on the Chappell-Ganguly-Dalmiya-Pawar circus, or the drop-the-opener discussion. What I highlight is a variation. Next time, it could be the return of Zaheer Khan. Or support for tearaway VR Singh. Or something on Munaf Patel, the Indian version of Justin Kemp. Or even the next Indian bowling plan. But mention Indian cricket, and only one issue seems to involve all the fans. Don't you notice that? Why complain about eight posts on two fringe players, when there are over 80 on one much-abused issue?

 

[Pratters]

we find long, boring debates on the Chappell-Ganguly-Dalmiya-Pawar circus, or the drop-the-opener discussion. What I highlight is a variation.

But apart from the Chappell-Dalmiya-Pawar issue there are indeed other issues which are being discussed -

The exclusion of Dinesh Karthik was brought up
I brought up the zonal selection system
You have brought up issues pertaining to Yadav, Joginder Sharma

There are Pakistan fans on the forum and talk about Pakistan team composition is imperative like the Indian team composition before the match starts. We were discussing the Indian team composition likely for the tour match. And we are also discussing Indian team composition for the first test - so who will be included or excluded and the consequent Ganguly aspect is bound to come up.

It has been an issue for months now and has continued for far too long. As adharic said, hopefully it will be settled by the end of the tour with a decisive failure or success from Ganguly or in whatever manner.

I understand your irritation on the whole issue.

 

[Arjun]

The exclusion of Dinesh Karthik was brought up

And got drowned quickly, with the familiar excuse that Chappell does not like him (not so much here, as on another forum).

I brought up the zonal selection system

That's a question of politics, hinting back at the pet topic.

We were discussing the Indian team composition likely for the tour match. And we are also discussing Indian team composition for the first test - so who will be included or excluded and the consequent Ganguly aspect is bound to come up.

It has been an issue for months now and has continued for far too long. As adharic said, hopefully it will be settled by the end of the tour with a decisive failure or success from Ganguly or in whatever manner

Right you are. But the problem is that Indian fans seem to be divided into warring factions. When a decision is taken here, one group is happy, the other up in arms. When it is reversed, that other group then takes offence and how, and given how far they took it, that issue divided the cricket fan following in the country.

Besides, none of the contenders in that drama are really relevant in the Indian side at present.

 

[Arjun]

From an article in Deccan Herald–
Karachi, PTI: Wasim Akram said he was disappointed with the progress of Irfan Pathan as a fast bowler.

"I thought he had tremendous talent and he started off brilliantly. But today, I feel that instead of getting quicker, he has slowed down. Also, he has still not perfected the art of swinging the ball away from the right-handers and relies on deliveries that come in.

"Irfan rocked Pakistan in 2004 (with 12 wickets in the series) because he was then an unknown commodity. But now the batsmen have learnt how to handle him. They stand a couple of yards outside the crease and try to play out the new ball. After the ball becomes soft, Irfan is extremely easy to handle," said Akram, who had guided Pathan in the initial stages of his career.

Comments? Frankly, the way the pace bowlers are used is questionable. Irfan is often used in long spells in supposedly pace-friendly conditions, oftne without much support (Agarkar is no support), and in home matches, he's only used for a small spell, then Kumble and Harbhajan bowl on and on....and on. Frankly, he should be used in regular short spells to keep him going, at top pace.

 

[Pratters]

Ah I really do not understand you coming on so strongly. But i wll make an attempt neverthless =

And got drowned quickly, with the familiar excuse that Chappell does not like him (not so much here, as on another forum).

Then not related to CW and discussions here.

That's a question of politics, hinting back at the pet topic.

So we should ignore problems which do not suit you even though they may be bigger.

Right you are. But the problem is that Indian fans seem to be divided into warring factions. When a decision is taken here, one group is happy, the other up in arms. When it is reversed, that other group then takes offence and how, and given how far they took it, that issue divided the cricket fan following in the country.

In any issue perspectives will vary. And in an issue which has carried on for so long - it is bound to appear more strongly. Cricket fans on CW I think have dealt with the issue far more calmly than the rest of media, fans on the streets have.

Besides, none of the contenders in that drama are really relevant in the Indian side at present.

Ganguly is in the side. Chappell is the coach. Pawar is the president and people involved are relevant.

Really Arjun, the drama has been an ugly one and I can imagine you being disgusted but it cannot be ignored even if we try as it is imperative in crucial aspects like team selection.

 

[aussie]

my guess what the sides will be like for the 1st test:

PAKISTAN:

Butt
Malik/Kamal
Younis
Inzi
Mohammad Yo
Afridi/Razzaq
Akmal
Rana
Sami
Akhtar
Kaneria

INDIA:

Gambhir
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Laxman
Yuvraj/Ganguly
Dhoni
Pathan
Agarkar
Harbhajan
Khan/Kumble

 

[pug]

INDIA:

Gambhir
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Laxman
Yuvraj/Ganguly
Dhoni
Pathan
Agarkar
Harbhajan
Khan/Kumble

Hoping against hope that these two don't make it.

 

[adharcric]

Hoping against hope that these two don't make it.

Sehwag
Jaffer/Gambhir
Dravid
Tendulkar
Laxman
Yuvraj/Ganguly
Dhoni
Pathan
Agarkar/Harbhajan
Kumble
Zaheer

 

[Arjun]

Ah I really do not understand you coming on so strongly. But i wll make an attempt neverthless

Then not related to CW and discussions here.


So we should ignore problems which do not suit you even though they may be bigger.



In any issue perspectives will vary. And in an issue which has carried on for so long - it is bound to appear more strongly. Cricket fans on CW I think have dealt with the issue far more calmly than the rest of media, fans on the streets have.



Ganguly is in the side. Chappell is the coach. Pawar is the president and people involved are relevant.

Really Arjun, the drama has been an ugly one and I can imagine you being disgusted but it cannot be ignored even if we try as it is imperative in crucial aspects like team selection.

There are two problems with the Indian team that need to be solved if they are to win tournaments consistently-

• A genuine all-rounder in Tests and ODI's who bowls seam, swing or pace
• A tearaway pace bowler who can attack the batsmen in the early overs

Rather than keep all swollen heads happy, the people in charge should focus on these issues.

 

[pug]

Sehwag
Jaffer/Gambhir
Dravid
Tendulkar
Laxman
Yuvraj/Ganguly
Dhoni
Pathan
Agarkar/Harbhajan
Kumble
Zaheer

Replacing Agarkar with Harbhajan wouldn't be the right way to go, I think. If you want two spinners, by all means, but keep 3 pacers nevertheless. And no, Ganguly is not the same league as the other specialist bowlers. So, I would go with
1. 6 batsmen, 1 w/k, 3 (medium) pacers, 1 spinner
2. 5 batsmen, 1 w/k, 3 (medium) pacers, 2 spinners

 

[pug]

There are two problems with the Indian team that need to be solved if they are to win tournaments consistently-

• A genuine all-rounder in Tests and ODI's who bowls seam, swing or pace
• A tearaway pace bowler who can attack the batsmen in the early overs

Rather than keep all swollen heads happy, the people in charge should focus on these issues.

Don't want to harp on this issue much, but you see your problem again comes back to the selection process.

 

[marc71178]

There are two problems with the Indian team that need to be solved if they are to win tournaments consistently-

• A genuine all-rounder in Tests and ODI's who bowls seam, swing or pace
• A tearaway pace bowler who can attack the batsmen in the early overs

Rather than keep all swollen heads happy, the people in charge should focus on these issues.

And rather than keeping on mentioning this point, you could recognise that such players don't exist as yet, so they need to try alternatives.