*Official* England in West Indies

[ozone]

See also Anderson, J.

Nah, Andersons got completely different problems TBH.

 

[Goughy]

I'll repeat again because you apparently didn't bother to read anything.

Seamers usually cut down on pace to concentrate on accuracy when it's a slow pitch.

No they dont. And if they do then they shouldnt be selected unless they are a very skilled bowler.

I am maybe Harmisons biggest fan on here but the boy needs to bowl fast or not at all.

If he is bowling 80 mph then I dont care whether he is cutting down speed, there is no place for him.

This argument is similar to Pakistan a few years ago when Harmison he would cut down his speed and then bowled medium pace ****.

Harmison has an identity. He cant be what he isnt.

 

[Furball]

I'll repeat again because you apparently didn't bother to read anything.

Seamers usually cut down on pace to concentrate on accuracy when it's a slow pitch.

The whole point of selecting Harmison is that he's a weapon who can cause batsmen discomfort bowling at 90mph+

If he's not doing that, it's not worth having him in the side.

 

[Scaly piscine]

No you can't really but I can be sure that Hoggard would be doing a better job right now.

Hoggard would be doing a better job than any of them most probably because he can bowl cutters.

 

[zaremba]

Nah, Andersons got completely different problems TBH.

The patterns are slightly different but are similarly predictable and similarly infuriating.

 

[aussie]

Regardless of the pitch, he's inevitably going to be a massively diminished bowler at 80mph than at 92mph.

Ye if my memory serves me correctly after PAK 05 on tours to SRI, IND (twice) Harmo always tended to drop his pace & try for accuracy since give his lack of variety on flat decks him trying to bowl 90+ was proving useless.

But yea this test so war, his pace has surprisingly low. If we get a pacy deck on the tour i expect him to come into his own though, in this new & final phase of career.

 

[Furball]

GingerFurball I'm afraid you're spot on with this.

See also Anderson, J.

Anderson's had problems on tours in the past when he's been brought in from the cold, but that's where the similarities begin and end IMO.

What's more concerning to me is how Anderson has been mis-managed by England throughout his career.

 

[BoyBrumby]

I'll repeat again because you apparently didn't bother to read anything.

Seamers usually cut down on pace to concentrate on accuracy when it's a slow pitch.

That hasn't been the case with Harmy today tho. He hasn't exactly been metronomic despite the reduction in speed.

Bowling like he was in NZ just before he was dropped, actually.

 

[ozone]

The patterns are slightly different but are similarly predictable and similarly infuriating.

Yea, thats fairer, but I don't see many commentators or journalists calling for Anderson to be brought back into the team, despite the fact that he often does a much better job than Harmison when he is selected, I guess because he's not an 'X-factor' bowler.

 

[Goughy]

If someone said "Harmison didnt bowl badly but he was down on pace" Id think that it was a rhythm things and one of those things that happens a lot to genuine quicks.

If someone said "Harmison didnt bowl badly and he intentionally cut his pace" Id think they were bat**** crazy.

I buy into Harmison. I can handle the terrible days. I can handle the decent days when he is down on pace. As long as he is charging in.

There are 2 things you cannot coach in pace and height. If he is freely giving one of his natural talents away then Id be worried.

I dont mind an off day as he is a rare talent but the guy has to come hard every innings.

 

[ozone]

Anderson's had problems on tours in the past when he's been brought in from the cold, but that's where the similarities begin and end IMO.

What's more concerning to me is how Anderson has been mis-managed by England throughout his career.

Agree with what your saying about him being mis-managed, but he does have more in common with Harmison than that. For a start, they both have trouble with consistancy and reliabilty. And, along the same lines, they both have ridiculous peaks and troughs, i.e. they are both bowlers who, when bowling well, are as good as anyone in the world whilst when not, would look average in a county seconds game.

 

[Scaly piscine]

The whole point of selecting Harmison is that he's a weapon who can cause batsmen discomfort bowling at 90mph+

If he's not doing that, it's not worth having him in the side.

Except there is virtually no benefit to having extra pace on a slow pitch. The attacking benefit of bowling fast is greatly nullified on a slow pitch, the extra pace also makes it a lot easier for the batsmen to score.

If you knew that the pitch was going to produce this sort of attritional stuff then of course there's no point picking Harmison because his weapons are useless on it.

 

[zaremba]

Agree with what your saying about him being mis-managed, but he does have more in common with Harmison than that. For a start, they both have trouble with consistancy and reliabilty. And, along the same lines, they both have ridiculous peaks and troughs, i.e. they are both bowlers who, when bowling well, are as good as anyone in the world whilst when not, would look average in a county seconds game.

My thinking exactly.

And at the risk of Bothamesque banality I'd add that both are too diffident to appear to be serious fast bowlers.

 

[Furball]

Anderson is different in that I've always thought that when conditions were right, he looked lethal, but when conditions weren't right for him he lacked the experience and know how to adjust his bowling accordingly that a more experienced campaigner like Sidebottom or Hoggard would have. I don't think England have helped in that regard, because there's been times when he's been the drinks carrier when he could quite easily have gone back to Lancashire and got overs under his belt, both for experience and to find his rhythm.

Anderson last summer at least showed signs that he'd begun to turn the corner. What was his reward? He got dropped, which sums up how England have managed him to a T.

 

[andruid]

Better fro Harmison?

 

[zaremba]

Yet again real life is conspiring against me to prove my theories wrong. Harmison's starting to swing the ball both ways at his reduced pace and as a result gets a wicket LBW.

Mind you it was a bit of a dodgy decision

 

[Neil Pickup]

Better fro Harmison?

Good ball. Swung back in to Taylor - not quite sure how, but did.

Looked absolutely dead in real time but Hawkeye thinks not doing enough... to be honest, should be given out on principle.

 

[zaremba]

to be honest, should be given out on principle.

Those ones so often are.

 

[GIMH]

****, that was unlucky/lucky/clever, take your pick I guess

 

[Scaly piscine]

Last over of the day, just got an edge and he's letting him pad it away. Unreal.