**Official** England in New Zealand

[Days of Grace]

Fleming gone and now I'm gone.

I will never post on this forum again.

There is no point in living anymore.

That is all.

 

[Richard]

RiP DoG.

 

[pasag]

Dire

One of my favourite players, sad to see him going when he still has a fair bit to offer to NZ.

 

[Richard]

The bowling-figures are still a real curate's-egg.

Bowling        O  M  R  W Econ  
RJ Sidebottom  11 3  32 0 2.90
JM Anderson    9  2  44 0 4.88
SCJ Broad      15 6  25 0 1.66
MS Panesar     20 10 33 3 1.66
PD Collingwood 2  0  20 0 10.00

 

[Days of Grace]

POMP AND CIRCUMSTANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!


POMP AND CIRCUMSTANCE!!!!!!!!!!!

appy and glorious
long to reign over us
God save our Queen

 

[Richard]

Dire

One of my favourite players, sad to see him going when he still has a fair bit to offer to NZ.

Not terribly sure about that TBH. He's 35 now, he's always been a good-but-certainly-not-great player. Only the very, very best tend to be able to go on performing at Test level beyond 35 or so.

Reckon he's picked the right time really. Go in his own country, in a series where his team are not outclassed, at a time he's still undoubtedly got it. Best of all, at a time when there's a decent number of promising batsmen in their mid- and early-20s knocking around.

I'm quite sad he didn't get more as he really looked good for a last-innings century. But everything has to end sometime, and Fleming's timing certainly doesn't strike me as premature. If I were him, I think I'd probably be calling it a day now too.

 

[Richard]

POMP AND CIRCUMSTANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!


POMP AND CIRCUMSTANCE!!!!!!!!!!!

appy and glorious
long to reign over us
God save our Queen

Interesting mix of British and English tunes there.

LOHAG > > > > > > > > > GSTQ BTW.

 

[JBH001]

Farewell Flem. All the best, and thanks for the memories.

 

[pasag]

Not terribly sure about that TBH. He's 35 now, he's always been a good-but-certainly-not-great player. Only the very, very best tend to be able to go on performing at Test level beyond 35 or so.

Reckon he's picked the right time really. Go in his own country, in a series where his team are not outclassed, at a time he's still undoubtedly got it. Best of all, at a time when there's a decent number of promising batsmen in their mid- and early-20s knocking around.

I'm quite sad he didn't get more as he really looked good for a last-innings century. But everything has to end sometime, and Fleming's timing certainly doesn't strike me as premature. If I were him, I think I'd probably be calling it a day now too.

Yeah but you like players retiring early so they don't hurt their stats and legacy, which for mine is a silly notion. While he still justifies his place in the side and he's still NZ's best batsman, he has plenty to offer in the short term. Much the same like Lara, Inzi and Warne.

 

[Richard]

I like players retiring at a time when they've not ceased to perform. And yes, ceasing to perform involves degrading your career figures. That's not silly at all and I'd expect better of you than to term it such.

I like someone to retire before they've stopped justifying their place in the team, not after. I hate to see a once-fine player only continuing to play because of past glories.

 

[Days of Grace]

strike another match, go start aneewwwwwwwwwwwww
Annnnnnnnnnnndddddddddddd, it's all over now baby blue...

 

[Richard]

Do-ho-hon't know that-'un I'z afraid.

 

[Richard]

Is that the end of the road for Sinclair too? Only time will tell.

Very poorly played, innocuous delivery. Can see this being over early on tomorrow now.

 

[_Ed_]

Oh dear.

Game over.

 

[Prince EWS]

Oh dear.

Game over.

... and career over, probably.

It's been fun Skippy. Worst day.

 

[pasag]

I like players retiring at a time when they've not ceased to perform. And yes, ceasing to perform involves degrading your career figures. That's not silly at all and I'd expect better of you than to term it such.

I like someone to retire before they've stopped justifying their place in the team, not after. I hate to see a once-fine player only continuing to play because of past glories.

There's a period when players may not be the stars they once were and can never match their previous feats but are still contributing to their side and still deserving their positions. I find it sad, especially when it's a favourite of mine, when they call it quits when they had more to offer. Obviously I'd also be happy they'd be giving it up if they didn't.

 

[Days of Grace]

Sinclair gone

Sinclair out

Sinclair finished

Sinclair to top himself

Sinclair is rubbish

Sinclair is buried

Sinclair's head on a stick

Sinclair is at peace.

 

[_Ed_]

Not sure about the end of his career. He'll almost certainly be dropped, but there's no doubt he'll be prolific for CD again next year and the selectors may well turn to him again.

And then he'll probably have a couple more bad innings and again be shown the door. And then be recalled again.

 

[Richard]

There's a period when players may not be the stars they once were and can never match their previous feats but are still contributing to their side and still deserving their positions.

There might be; there also might not be. It's very possible that some time very soon Fleming would have ceased to have been more use to NZ than the Fultons, Taylors, Ryders, Hays et al. That could very easily, IMO, have started with the next Test NZ play.

I find it sad, especially when it's a favourite of mine, when they call it quits when they had more to offer. Obviously I'd also be happy they'd be giving it up if they didn't.

We can't know anyone ever has more to offer though, we can only guess. If a player reckons he is soon to stop having anything to offer, then for mine the wise decision is to retire. I guess that's what Fleming thought. If, on the other hand, he wants to wait and see when that happens, that's also the risk he takes.

I personally am always happy, I repeat, to see a player retire before they've stopped being worth their place. Stephen Fleming has done that.

 

[Jono]

Fleming was always getting out in the 60s.