**Official** England in New Zealand 28 Nov-18 Dec 2024 - 3 Tests

[CartyDurham]

Durham attack possibly with Potts coming in to share with Stokes and Carse

It’s only about 7 years since the ECB tried to ruin Durham

 

[honestbharani]

He has been a great servant for NZ cricket and while his performances may have been on and off (which happens with most players anyways) he has played a role in NZ achieving some of their greatest moments in their cricketing history. The way it is all happening could have been better but guy deserves all the plaudits he gets.

He has truly been a remarkable servant of NZ cricket and I hope he has a great time in his retirement and contributes back to the game in his own way.

 

[Son Of Coco]

It certainly comes across that way, but I do think that on balance, England have got it right though. The biggest success of the last few months has been the onboarding of two seamers in Atkinson and the truly class, Carse!

Do we need to have a meeting about this?

 

[Chin Music]

Do we need to have a meeting about this?

Bah! I used the type of management bull**** speak that I myself despise! I shall use the word 'introduction' next time.

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

Very good point about that. SInce his marvellous ton at Lords he has 51 visits to the crease, 3 50s and an average of 22. When you think about how his batting was spoken about when he broke, through I thought he might have developed more as his career has matured. I never get the feeling he knows what his role is, but sometimes think he feels he needs to be like a 'proper' batsmen when many of hist best Warks innings were aggressive counter-attacking affairs.

A very good average for a number 8, but not the sort of game-changing figures that he had in his pomp. I find it interesting that his average at number 8 is around 22, but his average in the top 7 is far better (despite not doing much against Sri Lanka), it’s almost as if being at number 8, he’s unsure on whether he’s a proper batter or whether he’s a bowler who can merely hold a bat

 

[Betterpolo]

A very good average for a number 8, but not the sort of game-changing figures that he had in his pomp. I find it interesting that his average at number 8 is around 22, but his average in the top 7 is far better (despite not doing much against Sri Lanka), it’s almost as if being at number 8, he’s unsure on whether he’s a proper batter or whether he’s a bowler who can merely hold a bat

Exactly. And it's even stranger in this regime where he's got license to have a go (which was his natural style as a youngster)...

 

[flibbertyjibber]

One thing that should happen but won't is that Southee shouldn't get the new ball. He has basically wasted it on each occasion with his floaty garbage and been no threat. Give it O'Rourke.

 

[Skyliner]

One thing that should happen but won't is that Southee shouldn't get the new ball. He has basically wasted it on each occasion with his floaty garbage and been no threat. Give it O'Rourke.

If he plays then that has to happen. They can’t trot out this “Tim’s the leader of our attack” tripe. It is a worry how these professional sportsmen can exhibit so much collective delusion.

 

[Skyliner]

‘Silverback Tim continued to have the pick of the best foliage, while the subordinate males looked on expectantly. After an hour in the prime patch, Silverback Tim would relent and allow access to ‘his’ patch.’

 

[SteveNZ]

If I see any more of these "Southee is a lazy bum and always has been" posts I'm gonna start rooting for him again. Ffs, I know we're all frustrated and he should've been dropped after last year's Australia series, but that doesn't change the fact that he's been one of our greatest ever.

See, I think it's open to interpretation. I don't see him as one of our greatest ever, moreso that he's had admirable longevity and for decent periods was world class in Tests, and a lot less so in ODIs. From 2012-14 and 2018-21 he was absolutely a world class performer. But there were a lot of lean years around them, where the only reason for subpar performance was, as people have said, laziness. Not having that inner fire to be his best consistently. He went on that tear in 2012 after being dropped. He was absolutely diabolical for his level of talent before that (yes, he was young). And in ODIs, he could have been world class with the way he swung the ball and could hit the hole at the death - remember the epic super over he bowled to Haddin with six yorkers in 2010 or so I think it was. But he coasted, picked up the odd big bag like England WC 15 and was never a consistent leader. And obviously all of that comes before we discuss his batting...

Yes we should celebrate the career of Tim Southee but I don't have a problem with those, like me, who don't rate him as highly. And I also know that if he'd been in demand by franchise teams over the years, his career would be well done...but this 'loyalty' Stead and co have talked about this week was never truly tested.

 

[Ali TT]

Bah! I used the type of management bull**** speak that I myself despise! I shall use the word 'introduction' next time.

I'm currently at capacity with the test match about to start but I'd be grateful if we could put a pin in this and circle back to it in a few days time

 

[Bahnz]

Do I think there were times in Southee's career where he got complacent and deserved a kick up the bum? Yes. But I really don't think it's been a problem since 2016 at the latest. His record from late 2016 - early 2022 was 161 @23. This final phase of his career I don't see as motivation thing issue at all, but the decline of his powers due to age in much the same way that people tend to go broke: gradually and then all at once. Worth remembering that he's bowled about 10,000 more balls in international cricket than Boult has. Eventually he just ran out of juice.

 

[Northerner]

Do I think there were times in Southee's career where he got complacent and deserved a kick up the bum? Yes. But I really don't think it's been a problem since 2016 at the latest. His record from late 2016 - early 2022 was 161 @23. This final phase of his career I don't see as motivation thing issue at all, but the decline of his powers due to age in much the same way that people tend to go broke: gradually and then all at once. Worth remembering that he's bowled about 10,000 more balls in international cricket than Boult has. Eventually he just ran out of juice.

Boult got out at the right time, Tim hung on too long, he probably knows himself that he did , but 400 wickets was his goal,

 

[Athlai]

Boult didn't get out, he got in

 

[straw man]

So much Southee chat. Reckon they'll surprise everyone and pick Southee as the 12th man to walk the boundary all test, sign autographs and receive standing ovations for all five days.

 

[Neil Young]

Stead is the biggest irritant in world sport.

 

[straw man]

Oh sorry I meant non-stop standing ovations for Southee as he trundles in to bowl 123k half volleys for five days.

 

[Skyliner]

No Nathan Smith. Joe Root will be happy.

 

[BazBall21]

Big call to bowl first in Hamilton

 

[Skyliner]

“No dead rubbers, so much on the line….Tim Southee is almost indispensable to this team”.
- Scotty Stevenson