Days of Grace
International Captain
Waddle and Coney suggesting that Phillips make way in order to squeeze Young into the team. Coney’s rationale is that England bat so aggressively that we will have more time as a batting team.
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**Official** England in New Zealand 28 Nov-18 Dec 2024 - 3 Tests
- Thread starter FBU
- Start date
ataraxia
International Coach
That's a dreadful idea imo.
hendrix
Hall of Fame Member
Why?
Young is a better batsman than Phillips.
As useful as Phillips' bowling has been, it's unlikely a part time offie is going to be of much consequence, particularly with Rachin also in the side +/- Santner.
ataraxia
International Coach
Phillips is not a part-timer lol. He's an all-rounder who balances the side perfectly, is under the age of 30, and has massive potential as a test player. He's also a great asset in an otherwise lacklustre fielding side. Underperformed on the SC tours but he was still one of the first names on the teamsheet.
hendrix
Hall of Fame Member
The side doesn't need "balance", nor does it need people to be "under the age of 30". It needs runs and wickets.
Will Young is more likely to score runs than either Phillips or Mitchell for what it's worth.
Phillips' bowling is not likely to be used much in NZ conditions.
I understand and agree that Phillips has a lot of potential and I like him as a player. I'm saying that for this series Will Young should play ahead of hip (or Mitchell).
Days of Grace
International Captain
I can see the arguments both sides but I am sure they will go with Phillips since Steady has always had an inkling for like-for-like replacements. He sees Young as a substitute for a top 5 batsman and Phillips as a spin bowling allrounder.
Yeah, I'm not a fan of that at all. I know Young is in a good vein of form, but Glenn brings a lot to the table and probably more (IMO) that this side needs. There's no spot in the top 5 for Young, he's not a 6-7...what do you do, bat him at 4 and push everyone down?
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
If Young was going to come in for Phillips I'd probably bat him at 5 and move Mitchell to 6. But I think especially while Santner isn't playing and there are four specialist quicks, Phillips adds more with his bowling. I'm not anywhere near as convinced as Hendrix that Young is better than him on batting alone anyway.
Yeah, I tend to agree that pitched in at 5-7, Young isn't offering a lot more than Phillips is on balance, anyway. I think it was Flem (?) that said for all of his outstanding work in India, he was still the same Will Young - looking a million bucks and getting out between 20-70 as a general rule. That has continued through the limited overs in Sri Lanka. I like GP batting with the tail as well, he's made a good fist of that in the past.
I don't think GP is going to add a lot in troubling England's RH batsmen so I don't expect he'll do a tremendous amount of bowling, although may have a job to do at Hagley if he's the main spinner. Obvious does offer something different to Santner/the limited amount of overs Rachin will bowl.
Zinzan
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Hey what media outlet is that on?
Immenso
International Vice-Captain
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
No, he's not. Phillips averages more with the bat in both tests and 1st class cricket.
Phillips should be at 6, and Young should be our batting cover.
Since his return to the test side, Phillips has been our 3rd* best player behind Henry and Ravindra.
*O'Rourke not considered
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Especially if it is a strong tail (if Southee is dropped for test 2 or 3 we could have an 8-10 of Smith-Santner-Henry).
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Hmmm....
Averages for NZ spinners with 25+ wickets:
Phillips 27.4
Ajaz 29.3
Vettori 34.2
Boock 34.6
Burtt 35.5
Yuile 35.7
J Bracewell 35.8
Santner 36.3
thundaboult
International Debutant
dude...what
throw blundell out get young in
latham keeps
gp out? lol wut??
throw blundell out get young in
latham keeps
gp out? lol wut??
Zinzan
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Yeah Coney's side was;
Conway
Latham
Young
KW
Ravindra
Mitchell
Blundell
Smith
followed by 3 undefined seamers.
All good and well unless you value GP's golden arm, & value in the field which I do. Dude has 9 wickets @18 in NZ including that 5-fer vs. Australia.
Young is unlucky but is the next cab off the rank if there's injury or a form slump in the top 5.
Conway
Latham
Young
KW
Ravindra
Mitchell
Blundell
Smith
followed by 3 undefined seamers.
All good and well unless you value GP's golden arm, & value in the field which I do. Dude has 9 wickets @18 in NZ including that 5-fer vs. Australia.
Young is unlucky but is the next cab off the rank if there's injury or a form slump in the top 5.
Zinzan
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lol it's not a T20 game, you don't just throw your captain and opening bat the gloves to solve a good selection problem.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Latham can't keep and open the batting. And if you move him down the order you then create a new problem for yourself - who takes the vacant opening spot? Young has been tried repeatedly as an opener and failed. Rachin's only just finding his feet at 4, no way you'd want to move him up the order at this point. And to be honest, I don't think Latham's keeping is good enough for tests, especially these days.
Moss
International Captain
This was worth a one-off in India maybe, but not at home and not a longer term solution. Blundell will eventually be replaced but by a proper keeper.