*Official* England in India 2023/24 #CryMoreTour

[Sunil1z]

Won’t believe in this Team unless they successfully chase around 250 in 4 th innings. That performance in 1st Test was embarrassing

 

[Silver Silva]

Won’t believe in this Team unless they successfully chase around 250 in 4 th innings. That performance in 1st Test was embarrassing

Hey at the start of this test people were calling this the weakest Indian batting line up ever and they smashed England to pieces with the bat

I think you should have faith in these young guys ..Especially Jaiswal and Sarfaraz they seem like they are run machines .

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Kohli missing out on a lot of runs

 

[Aidan11]

Didn't take long for ex-players like Vaughan to start laying into England and bazball.

 

[Pup Clarke]

I'd make the analogy of comparing BazBall to undertaking a new job. Let's say 12 hour shifts 6 days a week. Sure, at first you can get by on the novelty factor like new colleagues and a different culture - maybe a really likeable boss. You also get by on sheer adrenaline. It's all-encompassing and addictive.

But 2 years later you've completely burnt out and you have no other choice but to take up a new position

 

[Molehill]

This was what most of us expected to happen.

India improved massively since First Test by adding Kuldeep, Sarfaraz and Jurel. England meanwhile have lost their only spinner of note, are relying on two inexperienced twirlers and lost both tosses.

The only hope now is to win a toss, bat big and put pressure on because they’re no match on a skills basis.

 

[Silver Silva]

This was what most of us expected to happen.

India improved massively since First Test by adding Kuldeep, Sarfaraz and Jurel. England meanwhile have lost their only spinner of note, are relying on two inexperienced twirlers and lost both tosses.

The only hope now is to win a toss, bat big and put pressure on because they’re no match on a skills basis.

Missed a trick by not calling a replacement for Leach ..I think Dom Bess would have been a good addition to the squad

 

[Molehill]

Missed a trick by not calling a replacement for Leach ..I think Dom Bess would have been a good addition to the squad

The only real option was Dawson but that ship sailed. Carson and Parkinson were with Lions but didn’t achieve much.

 

[honestbharani]

I think you guys are being too harsh on Bazball here. As many have pointed out, including me, for long now, you gotta take the good with the bad with this style of play. I still remember a lot of our NZ posters explaining the original methods of Brendon McCullum's batting as something like "if batsmen keep playing shots without worrying about defence, they will have the odd day when everything comes off but also many days when nothing does." Obviously paraphrasing here, but I think it was @Prince EWS who made that kind of post about his batting and how other test batsmen can also do the same, they just choose not to coz they want to enable more consistent results for their team. But what Baz has done now is get a whole team to buy into that philosophy but tempered to an extent.

Personally, I dont think this England side with their current personnel (in as far as I have seen, even the ones knocking on the doors or around the side etc.) getting the results they did with their traditional methods. These guys have got results playing this way and lets face it - playing India in India in tests is and has been the toughest challenge in cricket for about the last 15 years. I felt the sides we put out against Australia and the form we were in during that series meant Oz squandered what probably would have been their best chance at winning here and I feel the same about England here. But its silly to think they would have done better with these personnel with more traditional methods. So gotta take the occassional L like this when it has been this successful otherwise.

What must be done, though, is some tempering of how some of these guys seem to buy into their own hype. I said it during the Ashes and earlier this series. I think the biggest kryptonite of Bazball is themselves and how seriously they take their own hype. If you can stay grouded and understand moments when its a dogfight and you kinda gotta first stand your ground before you can advance. This is not the way England chased down runs in that summer in 2022, they knuckled down during the tough spells and then took advantage when the fielding side lost their heads.

 

[Hungry Llama]

I think England and Bazball should be more results focused. They won 1 session on the 2nd day,
but thats not enough to win a match, as rohit said after. Instead of Bazball they got Jazball.

 

[Ashes81]

There's been an overreaction to this loss in the media.

It was a horrible defeat but we have been competitive in this series.

I've been watching Engkand a long time and I've seen us take some real beatings, particularly away from home.

I've seen series were not only have we been beaten but we've not been competitive, its been men against boys.

So far this series hasn't been like that and you have to remember away to India is about as tough as it gets, particularly with such an inexperienced spin line up.

We do need to learn some lessons though both on and off the pitch.

We need to read match situations better and we need to stop the embarrassing interviews - never send Duckett out again to speak to the media .

But to throw the baby out with the bathwater would be a big, big mistake.

 

[Molehill]

I think you guys are being too harsh on Bazball here. As many have pointed out, including me, for long now, you gotta take the good with the bad with this style of play. I still remember a lot of our NZ posters explaining the original methods of Brendon McCullum's batting as something like "if batsmen keep playing shots without worrying about defence, they will have the odd day when everything comes off but also many days when nothing does." Obviously paraphrasing here, but I think it was @Prince EWS who made that kind of post about his batting and how other test batsmen can also do the same, they just choose not to coz they want to enable more consistent results for their team. But what Baz has done now is get a whole team to buy into that philosophy but tempered to an extent.

Personally, I dont think this England side with their current personnel (in as far as I have seen, even the ones knocking on the doors or around the side etc.) getting the results they did with their traditional methods. These guys have got results playing this way and lets face it - playing India in India in tests is and has been the toughest challenge in cricket for about the last 15 years. I felt the sides we put out against Australia and the form we were in during that series meant Oz squandered what probably would have been their best chance at winning here and I feel the same about England here. But its silly to think they would have done better with these personnel with more traditional methods. So gotta take the occassional L like this when it has been this successful otherwise.

What must be done, though, is some tempering of how some of these guys seem to buy into their own hype. I said it during the Ashes and earlier this series. I think the biggest kryptonite of Bazball is themselves and how seriously they take their own hype. If you can stay grouded and understand moments when its a dogfight and you kinda gotta first stand your ground before you can advance. This is not the way England chased down runs in that summer in 2022, they knuckled down during the tough spells and then took advantage when the fielding side lost their heads.

Agree with much of this. It’s taken until halfway through the series to have a really bad day. But at 200-2 on a flat pitch they had the chance to grind India down and got it horribly wrong. The final innings collapse was not unexpected, but also the first time they’ve been bowled out for under 230 in 18 Tests, that’s a testimony to BazBall in itself.

Some interviews are painful, but they’re also getting hyped up by the less intelligent sections of the media which doesn’t help.

I still think if they can win a toss they can cause problems, but it’s tough to chase a game in India.

 

[danzydab]

the difference between india's bowling and england's bowling is staggering. having leach injured was a massive blow for england. to have any chance of winning, they needed leach and liam dawson in their spin attack.

they are much better off bowling with 3 seamers instead of rehan. atkinson and robinson should come next test.

both foakes and bairstow could be binned in the near future. either jamie smith or james rew should be eng's next keeper batsman.

 

[honestbharani]

India land the body-blows as England's ethos takes a pummelling

Short turnaround will test resilience after worst defeat of Stokes-McCullum era

www.espncricinfo.com

Ab to maar hi nahi rahe hain - could be the defining words of this series.

 

[Arachnodouche]

Won’t believe in this Team unless they successfully chase around 250 in 4 th innings. That performance in 1st Test was embarrassing

Piss some more in my milk why don't you

 

[Arachnodouche]

Stokes can say what he wants but this one's gotta sting. You keep losing while chasing i..e. your style's calling card, and doubts will creep in, especially among the guys who weren't so good before this do-over.

 

[Aidan11]

I'd be disappointed if we dropped bazball although I don't think we will.

Sometimes it just isn't gonna work. Can't win 'em all.

 

[Anil]

Well done India! That said, England can still win or at least draw this series so I hope we don’t celebrate too soon!

 

[wpdavid]

We need to read match situations better and we need to stop the embarrassing interviews - never send Duckett out again to speak to the media .

I am increasingly of the view that only Mark Wood should be allowed anywhere near our press conferences..

 

[wpdavid]

There's no getting away from the fact that this one stinks. Losing 18 wickets for around 230 either side of the other guys ammassing 400+ for 4 (and one of those was the night-watchman) is not good. Nor was the ridiculous number of dropped catches, which always grinds my gears. Fair enough our spinners aren't nearly as good as theirs, but at least hold on to the chances that do come your way. Right now I wish this was a three match series, because it's hard to see the remaining two being anything other than horrible. I don't know why India gave us five after the last two series really.