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Jasprit Bumrah vs Sydney Barnes

Who is the better test bowler?


  • Total voters
    24

sayon basak

International Vice-Captain
How old are you?
There are quite a few footages of O'Reilly, maybe he likes his action or something. (or maybe the stats or the peer rating, it can be anything) I myself like to watch highlights of Qadir and Underwood, so that could mean they are my favorite, although I haven't watched them live.
 

sayon basak

International Vice-Captain
Was thinking about how many bowlers in total have the argument of being the greatest ever.

Marshall
Muralitharan
Barnes
Warne
McGrath
Hadlee

Is this it? Did I miss someone?
 

DrWolverine

State Vice-Captain
Was thinking about how many bowlers in total have the argument of being the greatest ever.

Marshall
Muralitharan
Barnes
Warne
McGrath
Hadlee

Is this it? Did I miss someone?
Barnes played between 1901-1914. He was the best bowler of his era. No doubts about it.

Why is George Lohmann (1886-1896) who was the undisputed best bowler of his time period not talked about in the same manner as Barnes?
 

sayon basak

International Vice-Captain
Barnes played between 1901-1914. He was the best bowler of his era. No doubts about it.

Why is George Lohmann (1886-1896) who was the undisputed best bowler of his time period not talked about in the same manner as Barnes?
I still rated him quite highly; top 26/27 maybe.
Lohmann bashed a much weaker SA, (AUS was also very weak compared to Barnes' era) and his WPM drops down from 8.44 to 4 against AUS. And peer ratings place him below Spofforth. So, yeah.
 

Arachnödouche2.0

U19 Debutant
Barnes is greater than anyone bar McGrath/Marshall/Hadlee. Bumrah is not yet even clear of guys like Garner.

even in technicalities, Barnes constantly bowled bowls that would swing visibly in one direction and then cut to another the moment they pitch full


O Reilly + 10-20 kmph of pace + swing both ways? Modern batters would get cooked.
Technicalities indeed. Ryan Harris once made it swing and seam two ways over 22 yards too, doesn't mean he knew what he was doing. To make an article of faith out of something improbable that's been passed down as lore over a hundred years is naive.
 

Thala_0710

State Regular
All I have read about Barnes, makes me think he was like a Mustafizur type of bowler in his bowling style, and he got figured out in red ball cricket and wasn't successful in the modern era. This would happen to a lot of cricketers from that era and you can't just take records at face value imo
 

sayon basak

International Vice-Captain
All I have read about Barnes, makes me think he was like a Mustafizur type of bowler in his bowling style, and he got figured out in red ball cricket and wasn't successful in the modern era. This would happen to a lot of cricketers from that era and you can't just take records at face value imo
Mustafizur only bowled off cutter (I had only seen him bowl leg cutter once in test, and you know, more than half of his back of the hand deliveries ended up as a beamer). That was not the case with Barnes, who could swing and seam the ball, before it became a thing.
And even if they were similar in attribute, that wouldn't mean they would be similar in outcome. I could argue Bumrah and Naveen Ul Haq have similar actions, doesn't mean if Naveen fails in tests, so should Bumrah.

And as I've said this earlier, if cricket exists after 100 more years, the game is gonna evolve even more. Would you then agree if someone says, "Sachin's stats can't be taken at face value, as he performed against limited opponent and in a very different time"?

as Red_ink_squid said, we should compare players by "player vs contemporaries" vs "player vs contemporaries" and Barnes was the most dominant bowler in his time by a long shot.
 

sayon basak

International Vice-Captain
Aus wasn’t weak. They couldn’t figure out Lohmann.
Eng vs Aus w/o Lohmann : 2 wins. 3 losses. 2 draw.
Eng vs Aus with Lohmann : 15 wins. 2 losses. 0 draw.
I acknowledge that they were the best team that Lohmann played against. But they were definitely weak "compared to Barnes' era", weren't they?
 

sayon basak

International Vice-Captain
Top Bowlers in Lohmann's matches:-
IMG_20241225_115105.jpg
Top bowlers in Barnes' matches:-
IMG_20241225_115052.jpg

Would say the gap between Barnes and his Contemporaries is clearly greater than that between Lohmann and his Contemporaries.
 

Coronis

International Coach
Not that old to have seen O’Reilly. Won’t say the exact age. Just heard and read lot of O’Reilly when growing up. Everyone seemed to just talk about him so very highly. That has forever stick to my memory.
Now now, age is not a number to be ashamed of.

How old are you?
Age doesn’t necessarily have much to do with favourites. A lot of my favourites (the majority probably) retired before I was born, and a not insignificant number of them would’ve been dead.
 

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