Is Javed Miandad somewhat underrated and who was the best against the WIs in the 80s?

[The Sean]

Looking back at it, Sunny's last two series against WI were extraordinarily "all or nothing" - he was dismissed for 20 or under 15 times (including nine single figure scores as you mentioned), but in the five innings where he actually broke 20 his scores were 32, 147*, 121, 90, 236*.

 

[honestbharani]

Seems to be a pattern with aging great batsmen tbf. They find it hard to get in, but once in, they know how to get the big scores and I guess the reflexes and body movements sort of kick in better.

 

[shortpitched713]

To me that list goes to show the inherent limitation of low sample sizes being dominated by noise, and an indictment of the "analysis by checklist" approach. Wasim Raja and Laird are not exactly great ATG candidates or something as batsmen, but apparently we should be worshipping their ability to take on the most relentless pace attacks of all time.

 

[Coronis]

To me that list goes to show the inherent limitation of low sample sizes being dominated by noise, and an indictment of the "analysis by checklist" approach. Wasim Raja and Laird are not exactly great ATG candidates or something as batsmen, but apparently we should be worshipping their ability to take on the most relentless pace attacks of all time.

Nobody’s saying they’re ATG batsmen. And yes, a quality performance against a quality attack should be celebrated.

 

[mr_mister]

Mark Waugh's record even better if the '95 series is included, which I think it oughta be as he was partly responsible for their first series loss and the end of that era of dominance

 

[Migara]

Pakistan in 80s approached WI in a different note. All other teams tried to survive their bowling attack. Pakistan went the other way, didn't care about how much they scored, but went hard on WI batting to the magnitude WI bowling went, if not more (they had spin up their sleeves too). That may be reason for their success.

Here you see the evidence. Other than for Richards and Hooper (whose 178 in 1993 boosting average - post Imran) all others were utterly tested by Pakistani bowling jaggernaut. Lara, Richardson and Haynes all average south of 40 against them

 

[Migara]

Roles reversed you see exact similar averages. Pakistani batting was not that strong in 80s. But their bowling dragged West Indies batting to their level, and that was the reason they were giving Wi run for their money. That Pakistani side is better than many best sides in the history.

 

[Migara]

Salim Malik actually was special. Very few batsmen that took on Ambrose.

 

[mr_mister]

Salim Malik actually was special. Very few batsmen that took on Ambrose.

Colin Miller took him on

 

[Migara]

And Against Wi bowling


Andrew Hudson was a monster against fast bowling. They way he was hooking and pulling Ambrose and Walsh was refreshing to see. He was one of those hard nosed batsmen who stood up to pace, one of the greatest players of pace in 90s. He never became a ATG because he was pathrtic against spin. And it begs the question if Tendulkar and Aravinda played these express bowlers more. Aravinda in particular handled Shoaib, Lee and Donald with absolute no problems.

 

[Coronis]

A great underrated player Parore.

 

[Brook's side]

Robin Smith

 

[Brook's side]

And Against Wi bowling
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Andrew Hudson was a monster against fast bowling. They way he was hooking and pulling Ambrose and Walsh was refreshing to see. He was one of those hard nosed batsmen who stood up to pace, one of the greatest players of pace in 90s. He never became a ATG because he was pathrtic against spin. And it begs the question if Tendulkar and Aravinda played these express bowlers more. Aravinda in particular handled Shoaib, Lee and Donald with absolute no problems.

Mike Watkinson was always going to be in there somewhere. Could judge the line and length before it was out of the hand.

That's why I'm against putting a minimum number of matches as a criteria in this sort of thing, as otherwise you can miss that sort of lesser appreciated genius.