ICC ranks Hair second best

[C_C]

C_C, I witnessed discrimination on Day One in Karachi

Dont make it sound like some clandestine ritual that only the initiated can interpret

In 1961, sorry 45 years ago, Aborigines had no vote, no right to citizenship, no right to social security, some lived on missions, no vote, no land rights etc.

All that changed by 1967

So call it 40 years

BTW, UN made comments in late 80s - gee world hasnt changed much since then

Err the UN made comments as recently as last year.
And vote ? Right to citizenship ?
Pffft.
You must think i am a gullible if 'rights on paper' equate to 'getting rid of discrimination in reality'.
Again, precisely the line of thought of the closet supremists. Dont worry, i've met your type before- the one who'd argue that blacks and whites were on the same footing in America after the civil war because techinically they were free people.


PS: Dont give a hoot on what goes on in Pakistan - their philosophy and laws are derived from middle eastern ones, not subcontinental. As such, i dont see how you could use Pakistan as an example of subcontinental culture. Unless ofcourse, you cant tell the difference between an Indian and an Arab (Which i bet you probably cant). Oh and dont try the 'geographical' angle- if you believed in that, you'd not get worked up when i talk about european world and western world's culture. Your nation, on geographic basis, is neither.

PPS: Answer Dasa's post now. As he said, he happens to agree with most of what i say and he has all the 'credentials' you are looking for. So what now, chump ?

 

[Slow Love™]

Well this has become a farce. This thread should be closed IMO.

Agreed - well, kind of.

This thread is in cricket chat, and for the last page or so it has had NOTHING to do with cricket. If the thread was in off-topic I wouldn't give a stuff, but IMO the moderators should step in and request (or insist) that the thread get back on topic when this occurs.

At this time it is purely a "my region is better than yours" pissing contest.

 

[social]

Err the UN made comments as recently as last year.
And vote ? Right to citizenship ?
Pffft.
You must think i am a gullible if 'rights on paper' equate to 'getting rid of discrimination in reality'.
Again, precisely the line of thought of the closet supremists. Dont worry, i've met your type before- the one who'd argue that blacks and whites were on the same footing in America after the civil war because techinically they were free people.


PS: Dont give a hoot on what goes on in Pakistan - their philosophy and laws are derived from middle eastern ones, not subcontinental. As such, i dont see how you could use Pakistan as an example of subcontinental culture. Unless ofcourse, you cant tell the difference between an Indian and an Arab (Which i bet you probably cant). Oh and dont try the 'geographical' angle- if you believed in that, you'd not get worked up when i talk about european world and western world's culture. Your nation, on geographic basis, is neither.

PPS: Answer Dasa's post now. As he said, he happens to agree with most of what i say and he has all the 'credentials' you are looking for. So what now, chump ?

Chump, heh?

Ive told you before that if youre going to lie then make sure no-one finds out

UN did not comment on racism in Oz society - they're concerned about changes to the Lands Act that affetcs Native Title (ignores the fact that previous changes had rendered Act unworkable), the abolishment of ADSIC (corrupt dept) and large no.s of aboriginals in jails

Australia's top sports, other than cricket are Rugby Union, Rugby League, Australian Football and netball

20% of the national Rugby Union Team are coloured

50% of the national are coloured

Aboriginals have a long and proud history of success in AFL and make up over 10% of the playing roster

At one stage, the enitre Aus netball team bar one was aboriginal

In other words, youre talking **** AGAIN

As for your views on Pakistan, if I claimed India you'd say the same thing

Point is, you were wrong for the umpteenth time

As for Dasa, kindly point out where I've ever claimed that racism doesnt exist in Oz.

However, compared to other places (such as Dubai, where I'm sitting now), it's almost irrelevant

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Agreed - well, kind of.

This thread is in cricket chat, and for the last page or so it has had NOTHING to do with cricket. If the thread was in off-topic I wouldn't give a stuff, but IMO the moderators should step in and request (or insist) that the thread get back on topic when this occurs.

At this time it is purely a "my region is better than yours" pissing contest.

Yeah. I've tried to post in it a few times, but really there's nothing that can be said in response to some of the absolute drivel in here. Close it or make a new thread about why X region/nation/city is better than Y.

 

[C_C]

20% of the national Rugby Union Team are coloured

Define 'colored'.
As far as i can tell, 'Croats' are apparently colored.
How many asians, blacks, aborigines etc. are involved ?
And surely- you aint gonna give me 'Gillespie-esque' aborigines in your count, will ya ?
Or maybe you will. Your ilk often deals with the 'one drop' policy in racial matters. Again, not surprising.

Point is, you were wrong for the umpteenth time

Err no i am not- not on this issue. And if you think i am, you'll have to do a helluva lot more than just rely on personal anecdotal references. Your country has a negetive image simply because the likes of you are far more common than the likes of S_L or Faaip.

However, compared to other places (such as Dubai, where I'm sitting now), it's almost irrelevant

Yet another categoric and utter lie. Sorry but Dubai- DUBAI- is one of the best places on the world when it comes to inter-ethnic and racial integration. Oh yeah- you 'live' in Dubai. Well, i've lived in Dubai too- and in the middle east elsewhere for that matter- and i call you a categoric liar on this.
Continue this- if you dare to put any shred of credibility you have left on the line.

UN did not comment on racism in Oz society - they're concerned about changes to the Lands Act that affetcs Native Title

Lie. They specifically mentioned inter-ethnic tension and systematic racism in the Australian civic mechanism preventing/impeding the rise of non-white people in the power circles of australia.
As i said- make the claims you'r making when you have one- just one- non white Governor/leader/whatever it is you call it - at even the state level, let alone national.
So far, as i said- your country only has corrected the 'image' partially- nothing credible except what you want us to believe about your nation. As i said, it is a 'nation out on parole' - dont be pretending to distance yourself from your social responsibility, given that you guys stopped being openly barbaric less than a lifetime ago. Thats nothing mate- absolutely nothing. Establish a credible history- say like the French have- enough to credibly assert that their culture doesnt have systematic racism and discrimination entrenched at all levels. You either think i was born yesterday or 'another gullible brownie' if you really expect me to even consider your 'blahblah date they got their rights on paper, so its all fine and dandy' angle. Real life doesnt work like that and i am sure you'r aware of that.

As for Dasa, kindly point out where I've ever claimed that racism doesnt exist in Oz.

Kindly correct your comprehension skills - i doubt you know more than one language fluently, so its rather pathetic if you cant even grasp that properly. Dasa said(to paraphrase) he 'more or less' agrees with me. So again, what now, chump ?

 

[Dasa]

As for Dasa, kindly point out where I've ever claimed that racism doesnt exist in Oz.

As C_C said, I never said that.
However, you consistently seem to suggest that no-one should be criticising Australia because in your view, it's worse elsewhere - despite the lack of evidence and despite statements from others who have experienced life in both regions.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Define 'colored'.
As far as i can tell, 'Croats' are apparently colored.
How many asians, blacks, aborigines etc. are involved ?
And surely- you aint gonna give me 'Gillespie-esque' aborigines in your count, will ya ?
Or maybe you will. Your ilk often deals with the 'one drop' policy in racial matters. Again, not surprising.

You know, it does get really frustrating when you talk as if you're an expert on things that you obviously don't know anything about. Rugby League and AFL in Australia are full of aboriginal players and islanders and so on, and soccer is full of immigrants and people from immigrant families. They've won medals, captained the country, and been stars of the game on huge salaries by the standards of the sport. If anything, sport is the one area in Australian life where aboriginal people do recieve equal opportunities for advancement, similar to the role that sport has traditionally played for blacks in the US. For you to sit there and claim the opposite with no evidence at all, and then turn around and question whether or not the players in question are "aboriginal enough" is just ridiculous, especially when you couple it with criticisms of other people for commenting on nations you don't believe they know anything about.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Croats are white too, are they not ? Or is the concept of 'white' in Aussie culture similar to the Nazi model of 'whites' (ie, Germanic-Celtic-Scandinavians with rest of europe being lesser) ?

My point is that it's about migration, rather than the colour of the migrants.

 

[social]

Define 'colored'.
As far as i can tell, 'Croats' are apparently colored.
How many asians, blacks, aborigines etc. are involved ?
And surely- you aint gonna give me 'Gillespie-esque' aborigines in your count, will ya ?
Or maybe you will. Your ilk often deals with the 'one drop' policy in racial matters. Again, not surprising.



Err no i am not- not on this issue. And if you think i am, you'll have to do a helluva lot more than just rely on personal anecdotal references. Your country has a negetive image simply because the likes of you are far more common than the likes of S_L or Faaip.



Yet another categoric and utter lie. Sorry but Dubai- DUBAI- is one of the best places on the world when it comes to inter-ethnic and racial integration. Oh yeah- you 'live' in Dubai. Well, i've lived in Dubai too- and in the middle east elsewhere for that matter- and i call you a categoric liar on this.
Continue this- if you dare to put any shred of credibility you have left on the line.



Lie. They specifically mentioned inter-ethnic tension and systematic racism in the Australian civic mechanism preventing/impeding the rise of non-white people in the power circles of australia.
As i said- make the claims you'r making when you have one- just one- non white Governor/leader/whatever it is you call it - at even the state level, let alone national.
So far, as i said- your country only has corrected the 'image' partially- nothing credible except what you want us to believe about your nation. As i said, it is a 'nation out on parole' - dont be pretending to distance yourself from your social responsibility, given that you guys stopped being openly barbaric less than a lifetime ago. Thats nothing mate- absolutely nothing. Establish a credible history- say like the French have- enough to credibly assert that their culture doesnt have systematic racism and discrimination entrenched at all levels. You either think i was born yesterday or 'another gullible brownie' if you really expect me to even consider your 'blahblah date they got their rights on paper, so its all fine and dandy' angle. Real life doesnt work like that and i am sure you'r aware of that.



Kindly correct your comprehension skills - i doubt you know more than one language fluently, so its rather pathetic if you cant even grasp that properly. Dasa said(to paraphrase) he 'more or less' agrees with me. So again, what now, chump ?

Coloured = non-white. Look at the team photo and there are 37 in the current touring party, 30 white faces + 7 black faces, all Australian

On Dubai, sorry but you've got to be kidding.

Australia has recorded 15 violation of UN Human Rights conditions - none relate to racism per se but 7 relate to conditions relevant to refugeee/illegal immigrant detention centres.

The conditions in these detention centres are not far removed from labour camps that house a substantial proportion of the UAE's population - 10 to a standard room, no air-conditioning, not allowed to leave, must return to country of origin when work contract finished

1 worker dies per day in accidents on UAE construction sites because they have no Health and Safety Regulations as this adds to construction costs/timeframes

Until recently, work was carried out throughout the hottest period of the day (48 was the hottest day this year) resulting in another 2 deaths per day

Arabs are in another world altogether where racism and other forms of discrimination are concerned.

Provide a link on the UN because searches have revealed nothing

BTW, you do realise that the non-white percentage of Aus population is less than 2% dont you? Might go some way to explain why the level of non-white representation is so low

 

[social]

My point is that it's about migration, rather than the colour of the migrants.

It's all about colour with C_C - black good, white bad

 

[honestbharani]

What's the difference?

Warning - "the markings on this ball are inconsistent with those attributable to normal wear and tear - dont do it again!"

Penalty - "the markings on this ball are inconsistent with those attributable to normal wear and tear - dont do it again!"


Oooooooh sorry - 5 runs, forfeit and umpire sacking. How could we forget!

no, the penalty means that the umpire is sure that the cause was a player from the bowling team. So, BIG DIFFERENCE.

 

[C_C]

It's all about colour with C_C - black good, white bad

Err no. Whites like you = bad. Thats more like it. Its precisely the reason you'd rather find croats in the team than a darker dood. And as i said, i am sure your ilk is familiar with the 'one drop' policy. If i thought it was all whites, i'd not be living in a predominantly white nation- with my profession, i can find employment of my choosing anywhere on this planet.

Coloured = non-white. Look at the team photo and there are 37 in the current touring party, 30 white faces + 7 black faces, all Australian

Show me. Lets see how black are these 'black' faces.
I do hope i see some of these kinda 'blacks and aboriginals' than some of these blacks and aboriginals

On Dubai, sorry but you've got to be kidding.

Nice comeback.
Now, lets get talking about Dubai- like i said- substantiate your thoughts- if you dare to.
Remember- i too have lived there so kindly dont try a fast one.

The conditions in these detention centres are not far removed from labour camps that house a substantial proportion of the UAE's population - 10 to a standard room, no air-conditioning, not allowed to leave, must return to country of origin when work contract finished

And these workers conditions are damn sight better than refugee conditions in your nation, stuck in concentration camps- atleast, these arnt women, children and infirm being roasted alive in the desert without their prior consent and economic compensation. Certainly, worker conditions in the middle east is pretty grim but your concentraion camps are on a whole new different level.
As per labour camps, there are a lotta subcontinental/philipino 20-something workers who live in portacabins but 10 to a standard room is nothing more than baseless propaganda.
Usually its 2, 4 or six.

BTW, you do realise that the non-white percentage of Aus population is less than 2% dont you? Might go some way to explain why the level of non-white representation is so low

So in entire history of Aussie sport, cricket for example- not a single non-white has 'made it' at international level. Sorry but 2% population has nothing to do with it- countries such as Canada or France have had colored players long before Australia stopped treating their native citizens as less than pigs- which i am sure you'd remember given you were very much alive and kicking when such actions were taking place.
Btw, care to tell us in the first place how exactly Australia's 'non-white' population got to 2% ? I am sure if you dig through family archives(given your family's been there for more than 3-4 generation), you'd find your answer.
As i said- modulate your 'enthusiasm'. Good graces, much like ill grace, has to be earnt- not assumed. So far, its 200+ years of barbarity and umm..less than a lifetime of talk (even less when real action is concerned). Yer out on parole mate. Lets not forget the crime so quickly. And yes, you DO share moral responsibility for it.

Arabs are in another world altogether where racism and other forms of discrimination are concerned.

True. But most of them are far more progressive than what you've displayed here.

 

[PY]

Right, I've had enough as have some people as well by the looks of things.

Every subsequent post that isn't related to the topic in the thread is going to be deleted and no last potshots either. Too much narrow-minded, 'unable to see other people's perspective' going on in here which is way OT and I don't want go into how much of the stuff people are saying is opinions masquerading as fact because 'I/you say so'.

Take a long hard look at how some of you are behaving and I'd expect better from some of the people here.

 

[honestbharani]

the incidence of discrimination on the sub-continent is far, far greater than it is in Oz

wiped out culture? enslaved? - god u guys are ignorant

casteism affects only the subcontinental guys. IN essence, it is an internal issue of the respective countries. Racism in Australia affects the visitors there, therefore it becomes an international issue. And therefore, it affects the image of the country involved in the eyes of the rest of the world.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Show me. Lets see how black are these 'black' faces.
I do hope i see some of [url =http://www.crystalinks.com/aboriginals.jpg] these [/url] kinda 'blacks and aboriginals' than some of these blacks and aboriginals

Here's some people who represented Australia in the International Rules series a few weeks ago against Ireland.

Danyle Pearce
Graham Johncock
Aaron Davey

I could post plenty more from other years, and no doubt I could also point out people aboriginals and islanders who have represented Australia in Rugby Union and Rugby League, and even captained the country, but it'd be a bit pointless at this stage.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Going to lock the thread temporarily to further emphasize PY's point. No good stating it, and having us deleting post after post and having people ask why.

Everyone have a good look at PY's post, and maybe we can start this all again.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

In an effort to get this thing back on topic, cricinfo is now reporting the fact that Hair was voted "Umpire of the Year", and also that the New South Wales Umpires and Scorers Association is threatening to boycott ICC sponsors over the Hair sacking and will be printing an open letter to Malcolm Speed in the Telegraph criticising the sacking.

edit: Link.

 

[social]

In an effort to get this thing back on topic, cricinfo is now reporting the fact that Hair was voted "Umpire of the Year", and also that the New South Wales Umpires and Scorers Association is threatening to boycott ICC sponsors over the Hair sacking and will be printing an open letter to Malcolm Speed in the Telegraph criticising the sacking.

edit: Link.

Whilst I've been critical over the ICC's handling of Hair, we all need to move on - decision has been made and wont be reversed. Publicity such as this simply damages the game's image further in an extremely competitive sponsorship market-place and with the biggest season in years recently underway.

Admirable that they're standing up for a wronged colleague but, as the rep says, unlikely to get them anywhere.

 

[adharcric]

Hair has only been banned from officiating international matches, so why should internal Australian boards have a problem with it? If people over there think he's so great, they can go ahead and have him umpire in their domestic matches. There are several reasons he's not fit to umpire in international cricket, but above all a majority of the test nations are not comfortable with him umpiring their matches. End of story IMO.

 

[social]

all a majority of the test nations are not comfortable with him umpiring their matches. End of story IMO.

That's it in a nutshell

We can debate the rights and wrongs of the decision forever but it wont change the outcome

A more constructive approach would be to discuss the position of the umpire and match referee as it stands and ramifications of the ICC's stance