Hear, Hear, Hear : Lend me your Ear

[Son Of Coco]

Ajit Agarkar > Glen Mcgrath Please...

And thank you for your wonderful effort in this thread

haha, I presume we're talking bowling as I've already proven Glenn's the best batsman that ever lived?

 

[Sanz]

Of Course, we are talking bowling, AA is greatest bowler ever to grace the cricket world and I guess the Stats company Analysis will prove it.

 

[SJS]

haha, I presume we're talking bowling as I've already proven Glenn's the best batsman that ever lived?

SoC,

There's too much work piled up. I counted three assignements. There may be more by the time I finish posting this !!

I suggest you start earning your salary m'lad.

And what happened to Master Vic ? Send out an SOS for him to help out.

Come on guys there is a job to be done

 

[vic_orthdox]

I'll take Robert Croft vs Ashley Giles, if that's OK.

 

[SJS]

I'll take Robert Croft vs Ashley Giles, if that's OK.

Good lad

 

[Son Of Coco]

SoC,

There's too much work piled up. I counted three assignements. There may be more by the time I finish posting this !!

I suggest you start earning your salary m'lad.

And what happened to Master Vic ? Send out an SOS for him to help out.

Come on guys there is a job to be done

Right, I'll take Agit vs Glenn

 

[vic_orthdox]

I apologise for my rank amateur attempt at proving you wrong.

Could you prove for me how Robert Croft is on a par with Ashley Giles please when comparing their respective non-Test stats?

Marc, I'm just seeking clarification. Do you want me to prove that Robert Croft is a better bowler/player than Ashley Giles, despite his poorer non-Test record, or that Robert Croft is a better non-Test bowler/player than Ashley Giles?

And also, where can I find the "Assorted Domestic Averages" thing on the cricinfo profile page? I can't find it. Or is there another site I can use? Help needed!

 

[SJS]

Can anyone try to prove that a test match with Zimbabwe v Bangladesh warrants more attention than a Australia v England test match

ZIMBABWE vs BANGLADESH
A Greater Contest than the ashes​

1. What makes a great contest ?

For many years, in fact well into the second century of test cricket, it was widely agred that the tied test between Windies and Aussies of 1961 was the greatest match of all times. It was the only tied test. It was joined in the early 1980’s by only the second tied test ever.

So why are the tied tests considered so very great as contests ? Because they are so rare. Surely if 80% of the 1750 tests played so far were tied, people would STOP watching tests altogether !! It is their rarity that ensures that excitement absolutely WOVEN into them.

Fine. Now 2 out of 1750 is very rare, I agree but is 306 out of 1750 rare ???

Of course not you say. How can something which occurs in every sixth test be called rare ? So what else is rare in test cricket after the two tied tests. ?

Matches between Zimbabwe and Bangladesh, of course. Just 8 out of 1750 !! One occurrence in every 219 tests !!
WOW !! Now that’s rarer than a solar eclipse !!

Conclusion I : Like the Tied Tests, it’s the rarity of these great contests between these two sides that could be called the B to Z of test cricket that makes them warrant so much attention, nay, anticipation !!

2. What else makes the Tied tests so unique ?

Why are the ties so important : Because a tie means that there was a very very close contest.. And such a perfectly close contest has occured only twice in 1750 tests. Mere 0.1% of all matches. I must hasten to add, NEVER in a match between Australia and England in 306 games !! Ha !!
So what is NEXT as a real close game? A drawn game, naturally. So how many drawn games between Australia and England? 86 out of 306 . A measly 28.2 %.

Zimbabwe and BD. 3 out of 8. 37.5% !!!

Only India and Pakistan with 34 drawn games out of 53 have a better % at 64.2. But then that’s why these contests are blood curdlingly exciting !!

Let there be four wars between Zimbabwe and Bangladesh and watch those stats zoooom !!

PS This in spite of NEVER having played a test other than over five days. England and Australia managed to have a result even three day tests !!

Conclusion II : Zimbabwe and Bangladesh provide the greatest contest for the spectator since these sides are so well matched.

.....to be continued ​

 

[SJS]

ZIMBABWE vs BANGLADESH
A Greater Contest than the ashes
......continued​

Now lets come to the quality of the cricket played by these two majestic sides and the colonial pretenders !!

Great Batting Feats : Carrying the bat through a completed innings !!

One of the rare and great feats that a batsman can accomplish in a test match is to open the innings and remain unbeaten even when all ten wickets have fallen. This is so rare that only one Indian, the legendary Sunil Gavaskar has achieved it for India in 385 test matches !!!

It took 13 years for the same to be achieved in an England Australia contest !!

Now look at the B-Z series.

In the very first test between them Javed Omer Carried his bat through the BD second innings for 85 out of 168 !!

Conclusion III : At the very begining of these contests, the stars of these sides showed they were fit to be ranked with the rarest of the rare jewels in the history of the game.


Poor Batting Feats - 2-digit innings!!
Never has a team been bowled out for a two digit score in the ENTIRE ERA of cricketing history between Bangladesh and Zimbabwe. The white pretenders , however, have been dismissed, hold your breath, 31 disgraceful times under three figures.

Conclusion IV: The teams playing the ashes series often fail to give the paying public nothing remotely close to their money's worth

Totally one sided contests :

We talked earlier of close games being the hallmark of B - Z matches. Now lets look at the completely one sided games.

Throughout the glorious history of the matches between the two sides we are defending once, ONLY ONCE , did a match end in a result where it was won by the margin of an innings plus. We must clarify here that this was the first match between the two sides and Bangladesh were just finding their feet in test cricket. However, like all great sporting units, they quickly showed their class and NEVER again did a one sided contest like this take place between these two sides.

Now in the A-E matches as many as 45 were lost by the margin of an innings and more !!

We pity the spectators !!

Conclusion V : So poor is the standard of cricket in these two nations and so inconsistent their performances they a very large number of the games are actually NO-CONTESTS !! Now what is a sporting event if not a contest ???
PS : Since the time of the first match between BD and Zimb. On 19 april 2001., four matches have been won by Australia by an innings and , as mentioned earlier, no such result in the B-Z games !

The Zeal of the Contest :

It is often stated that a match between India and Pakistan is war sans bullets. Some people try to ascribe similar attributes to the ashes series. This is totally wrong. It is actually the games between BD and Zimb that bring out the best between these two side. Here is synopsis. The figures in brackets are the overall stats while those outside are in B-Z matches.

ZIMBABWE :
- Runs per over scored : 2.94 (2.64)
- Runs per over concecded : 2.63 (3.0)
- Runs per wicket scored : 39(27)
- Runs per wicket conceded : 26.3(38.8)
- Lowest innings score 154 (54)
- Highest Innings score Against 488 (735)
- Matches won 50% (10%)

BANGLADESH
- Runs per over conceded 2.94 (3.4)
- Runs per wkt scored : 26.3 (20.7)
- Runs per wicket conceded : 39 (50.5)
- Lowest innings score : 107 (87)
- Highest innings score against : 542(559)
- Matches won 12.33% (2.8%)

Conclusion VI : Clearly Zimbabwe and Bangladesh reserve their best performances against each other. That’s what makes their contests so fascinating. The same can hardly be said of the Ashes teams !

Comparison of the four teams.

Finally, here is a comparison of the two sets of opponents at the same stage of their contests /. That is to say, figures of BD and Zimb in the 8 matches played between them till date and those of Aussies and the Poms in their first 8 games against each other.

Highest innings scores
Zimbabwe : 542
Bangladesh : 488
Australia : 420
England : 327

Run Rate (Runs per over scored)
England 2.56
Australia 2.3
Bdesh 2.63
Zimb 2.94

Batting Average (Runs scored per wkt)
Zimbabwe 39.0
BDesh 26.3
England 22.8
Aust 24.1

Conclusion VII : Anyone who thinks Ashes warrant more attention than a contest betwen these two giants needs to have his head examined !!

 

[marc71178]

Marc, I'm just seeking clarification. Do you want me to prove that Robert Croft is a better bowler/player than Ashley Giles, despite his poorer non-Test record, or that Robert Croft is a better non-Test bowler/player than Ashley Giles?

And also, where can I find the "Assorted Domestic Averages" thing on the cricinfo profile page? I can't find it. Or is there another site I can use? Help needed!

Want you to prove they're on a par.
Assorted domestic is tricky - can get the last few seasons-worth from the county pages on Cricinfo though.

 

[vic_orthdox]

On par regarding just their FC (without Tests) record, or just as players generally? That is what I'm asking. And thanks for the Assorted thingy.

 

[marc71178]

On a par based on non-Test performances!

 

[steds]

I apologise for my rank amateur attempt at proving you wrong.

Could you prove for me how Robert Croft is on a par with Ashley Giles please when comparing their respective non-Test stats?

I wanna go!

Why Robert Croft is on a par with Ashley Giles

Ashley Giles and Robert Croft have long held Englands spin department in an era of Warne's, Murali's, Harhajan's, Kumble's and Saqlain's running around world cricket, so these two stout yeomen from Swansea and Surrey tend to be far underrated. This case is especially so for Croft as Giles has played in over twice as many tests for England. However, I am about to prove that Croft is on a par with Giles as a player.

1) Batsman

• In First Class cricket, Robert Croft has scored exactly twice as many 100's and exactly twice as many 50's (6 to 3 and 42 to 21 respectively) in less than twice as many innings (449 to 229) as Ashley Giles, therefore he is a superior First Class batsman

• In one day cricket, Croft regularly takes a spot at the top of Glamorgan's batting order and has scored 4 List 'A' centuries to Giles' 1.

• He also is a FAR better record in Twenty/20 than Giles, who has scored 0 runs with a best of 0 not out.

2)Bowler

• Robert Croft's best First Class bowling is 8/66, and in that match he took 6/103 in the first innings to prove it wasn't a fluke. His victims included intenational players Andy Lloyd, Dermot Reeve, Neil Smith, Roger Twose, and Tim Munton whilst Ashley Giles' best first class bowling is only 8/90.

• Giles has taken 50+ wickets in a season just twice, whilst that feat has been acheived by Croft 7 times.

• Giles' ODI economy is a huge 4.32 runs per over compared to Croft's 4.24

3)Fielder

• Croft has taken over 10 catches in 5 English seasons (1991, 1992, 1993, 1996, 1997). Giles has only acheived the feat in 1996

4)Captaincy

• Robert Croft showed how great a captain he is by leading Glamorgan to the 2004 National League 1 title. Giles hasn't captained Warwickshire to anything

Therefore, I conlude that Robert Croft is Ashley Giles' equal if not better in all areas of cricket

 

[vic_orthdox]

Haha, thanks Steds. I really was going to struggle with that one. I owe you one...in fact, if there's one you'd like me to do for you, lay it out for me. (I'd prefer international comparisons )

 

[Adamc]

• Croft has taken over 10 wickets in 5 English seasons (1991, 1992, 1993, 1996, 1997). Giles has only acheived the feat in 1996

Haha, I read this disbelievingly a few times before I realised it referred to fielding, not bowling.

 

[steds]

Haha, I read this disbelievingly a few times before I realised it referred to fielding, not bowling.

ahh crap. I knew I'd f*ck up somewhere. Edited to read catches

 

[Sudeep]

I'm still awaiting a report on why Tendulkar's batting has been more valuable to India that's Dravid's, since 2000.

If not, I'd like refund.

 

[SJS]

PUBLIC NOTICE ​

The views, analysis,opinions etc of our guest contributors are essentially their own and SJS Stats Factory does not stand any liability for disputes arising out of these ​

 

[honestbharani]

Waiting for the Agarkar/McGrath one.... And this should be pinned, seriously....

 

[Slats4ever]

thank you so much for answering my question about the Zim v Bangladesh one... i'll try to come up with more questions. i'm seriously thinking about trying to answer one of these as well. u should be a politician SJS... turn anything into something believable