Harmison the World Top rated Bowler

[Pratters]

I cant think of one single bowler at the moment who is performing the way Harmison is this year and so given the lack of performances around the world, I guess he has to deserve the number one position

Harmison does deserve the number one position as he is better than any one else playing ATM. Not taking any thing away from Harmison, but as you mentioned 'lack of performances around the world', Harmison has got to number 1 with only 875 points.

Bowlers with number 1 rank usually have a 900. Even Harmison has got higher points (880) earlier in the season.

It just shows that the bowling standards at the moment are at a pretty low level with 1-2 bowlers of each team perenially injured and a lot of careers of promising fast bowlers already destroyed in recent years due to constant cricket.

 

[Neil Pickup]

The highest ranking that Kapil ever managed was 877, in January 1980 against England at Chennai.

The second highest was 856, a year later at the SCG.

Sub-Harmison!

The all-time list of those ranked above 900 is:

1 Sydney Barnes ENG 932 vs South Africa, Durban 1914
= George Lohmann ENG 932 vs South Africa, Johannesburg 1896
3 Imran Khan PAK 922 vs India, Karachi 1983
4 Muttiah Muralitharan SL 915 vs Pakistan, Lahore 2002
5 Glenn McGrath AUS 914 vs England, The Oval 2001
6 Tony Lock ENG 913 vs New Zealand, Manchester 1958
7 Curtly Ambrose WI 912 vs England, Port-of-Spain 1994
8 Malcolm Marshall WI 911 vs England, Manchester 1988
= Ian Botham ENG 911 vs India, Mumbai 1980
10 Shaun Pollock SA 910 vs England, Johannesburg 1999
11 Richard Hadlee NZ 909 vs Australia, Perth 1985
== Waqar Younis PAK 909 vs Zimbabwe, Rawalpindi 1993
13 Alan Davidson AUS 908 vs West Indies, Sydney 1961
14 Derek Underwood ENG 906 vs New Zealand, Auckland 1971
15 Shane Warne AUS 905 vs England, Melbourne 1994
16 Alec Bedser ENG 903 vs Australia, Manchester 1953
17 Jim Laker ENG 902 vs Australia, The Oval 1956
18 Clarrie Grimmett AUS 901 vs South Africa, Durban 1936

 

[Pratters]

The highest ranking that Kapil ever managed was 877, in January 1980 against England at Chennai.

The second highest was 856, a year later at the SCG.

Sub-Harmison!

Ya but will Harmison be able to maintain form over a period is the question. His recent performances dont seem a flash in the pan. However, South Africa and Australia will be big tests to silent the doubters.

 

[Swervy]

Harmison does deserve the number one position as he is better than any one else playing ATM. Not taking any thing away from Harmison, but as you mentioned 'lack of performances around the world', Harmison has got to number 1 with only 875 points.

Bowlers with number 1 rank usually have a 900. Even Harmison has got higher points (880) earlier in the season.

It just shows that the bowling standards at the moment are at a pretty low level with 1-2 bowlers of each team perenially injured and a lot of careers of promising fast bowlers already destroyed in recent years due to constant cricket.

well the question must be asked..is it a decline in bowling standards, or an increase in batting standards (so many batsman have averages in the 50's now....50 is the new 40 it almost looks like)...or is it that pitches are tending to be flatter, or is the balls that are being used, or is it the new aggressive frame of mind that many teams are adopting when batting (bowling strike rates are pretty much the same these days as before, but runs per over are up, hence higher bowling averages)...

To be honest I think its a combination of all of the above (apart from the balls )..I think teams in general are having to rely on having maybe 2 really good pace bowlers as opposed to three, and so the third pacer seems in general to be a weak link (this doesnt apply to Australia or England, i think these two teams have the best pace attacks in the world at the moment..and if Anderson /Jones fulfill their potential I would say England would have the number pace attack in the world bar none).

But I do think the standard of batting has improved though, probably thanks to ODI cricket the scoring rate has gone up,and batsmen are willing to take more risks in order to take the initiative from the other team (scores of 320 in a day are common place, whereas 20 years ago 250 would have been a high scoring day)...and thats not down to poor bowling..batters have realised that this is a batters game...you can take more risks because chances are you wont get out (bats are better than they ever have been, playing surfaces are smaller these days etc, more 6's being hit thesedays etc ).

I think 20 years ago most batsmen were too careful...and maybe it has taken a team like Australia to make everyone realise that everything other than the really good ball is a potential run scoring ball...maybe 20 years ago, the attitude of most batsmen was the only run scoring ball was the bad ball.

maybe I am wrong

 

[Swervy]

The highest ranking that Kapil ever managed was 877, in January 1980 against England at Chennai.

The second highest was 856, a year later at the SCG.

Sub-Harmison!

The all-time list of those ranked above 900 is:

1 Sydney Barnes ENG 932 vs South Africa, Durban 1914
= George Lohmann ENG 932 vs South Africa, Johannesburg 1896
3 Imran Khan PAK 922 vs India, Karachi 1983
4 Muttiah Muralitharan SL 915 vs Pakistan, Lahore 2002
5 Glenn McGrath AUS 914 vs England, The Oval 2001
6 Tony Lock ENG 913 vs New Zealand, Manchester 1958
7 Curtly Ambrose WI 912 vs England, Port-of-Spain 1994
8 Malcolm Marshall WI 911 vs England, Manchester 1988
= Ian Botham ENG 911 vs India, Mumbai 1980
10 Shaun Pollock SA 910 vs England, Johannesburg 1999
11 Richard Hadlee NZ 909 vs Australia, Perth 1985
== Waqar Younis PAK 909 vs Zimbabwe, Rawalpindi 1993
13 Alan Davidson AUS 908 vs West Indies, Sydney 1961
14 Derek Underwood ENG 906 vs New Zealand, Auckland 1971
15 Shane Warne AUS 905 vs England, Melbourne 1994
16 Alec Bedser ENG 903 vs Australia, Manchester 1953
17 Jim Laker ENG 902 vs Australia, The Oval 1956
18 Clarrie Grimmett AUS 901 vs South Africa, Durban 1936

thats certainly one hell of a list of bowlers

 

[Swervy]

Ya but will Harmison be able to maintain form over a period is the question. His recent performances dont seem a flash in the pan. However, South Africa and Australia will be big tests to silent the doubters.

I really cant see a reason why he cant (fitness allowing of course)...he had a generally flat couple of matches at the start of the WI series just gone..and yet still finished with 17 (?) wickets in 4 matches..with pitches not in his favour.

I do think a lot of his success can be credited to the performances of the other bowlers in the team as well, they are keeping up the pressure, which obviously means there is no let up in pressure on the batsmen of the opposition which is very important

 

[Neil Pickup]

Basically the points level in the high 800s to 900s means you're taking about five wickets per match.

 

[marc71178]

Bowlers with number 1 rank usually have a 900.

No, actually, they rarely have 900.

 

[marc71178]

Of 32 16 are from one team which is 50% that tells u a lot

Yes, it says he's played that team more often.

Well spotted.

Just because he's played the WI 8 times, doesn't make Lara or Sarwan any less good batsmen though does it.

 

[marc71178]

He was in the tops 1979-81/82 when he got to 100 wickets very fast.

Nope, he was only ever number 2 for a 2 month spell mid-Packer.

Till 1989, he was in the top 6-7 in the world.

Apart from between 81 and 83 and then all of 88 that is.

Still shows he was below the others previously mentioned almost all that time.

 

[Pratters]

Nope, he was only ever number 2 for a 2 month spell mid-Packer.

Apart from between 81 and 83 and then all of 88 that is.

Still shows he was below the others previously mentioned almost all that time.

04/12/1979 2 Pakistan Delhi
16/12/1979 2 Pakistan Mumbai
25/12/1979 2 Pakistan Kanpur
15/01/1980 2 Pakistan Chennai
29/01/1980 2 Pakistan Kolkata
15/02/1980 2 England Mumbai
02/01/1981 3 Australia Sydney
23/01/1981 3 Australia Adelaide
07/02/1981 3 Australia Melbourne
21/02/1981 4 New Zealand Wellington
06/03/1981 4 New Zealand Christchurch
13/03/1981 4 New Zealand Auckland
27/11/1981 5 England Mumbai
09/12/1981 5 England Bangalore


Declined after that for two years..

29/10/1983 6 West Indies Delhi
12/11/1983 5 West Indies Ahmedabad
24/11/1983 4 West Indies Mumbai
10/12/1983 5 West Indies Kolkata
24/12/1983 4 West Indies Chennai
17/10/1984 6 Pakistan Lahore
24/10/1984 6 Pakistan Faisalabad
28/11/1984 5 England Mumbai
12/12/1984 7 England Delhi
13/01/1985 7 England Chennai
31/01/1985 7 England Kanpur
30/08/1985 7 Sri Lanka Colombo (SSC)
06/09/1985 7 Sri Lanka Colombo (PSS)
14/09/1985 7 Sri Lanka Kandy
13/12/1985 6 Australia Adelaide
26/12/1985 6 Australia Melbourne
02/01/1986 6 Australia Sydney
05/06/1986 6 England Lord's
19/06/1986 6 England Leeds
03/07/1986 6 England Birmingham
18/09/1986 6 Australia Chennai
26/09/1986 6 Australia Delhi
15/10/1986 6 Australia Mumbai
17/12/1986 6 Sri Lanka Kanpur
27/12/1986 6 Sri Lanka Nagpur
04/01/1987 6 Sri Lanka Cuttack
03/02/1987 6 Pakistan Chennai
11/02/1987 7 Pakistan Kolkata
21/02/1987 6 Pakistan Jaipur
04/03/1987 5 Pakistan Ahmedabad
13/03/1987 6 Pakistan Bangalore
25/11/1987 7 West Indies Delhi
11/12/1987 6 West Indies Mumbai
26/12/1987 6 West Indies Kolkata
11/01/1988 6 West Indies Chennai
12/11/1988 9 New Zealand Bangalore
24/11/1988 11 New Zealand Mumbai
02/12/1988 12 New Zealand Hyderabad
25/03/1989 10 West Indies Georgetown
07/04/1989 11 West Indies Bridgetown
15/04/1989 7 West Indies Port-of-Spain
28/04/1989 5 West Indies Kingston
15/11/1989 5 Pakistan Karachi
23/11/1989 5 Pakistan Faisalabad
01/12/1989 5 Pakistan Lahore
09/12/1989 5 Pakistan Sialkot

Declined again after this..

He did manage to remain in the top 5-7 for about 6 years. Not really bad.

The period when he was 2-3, it was just not due to Packer years.

He had a great start to his career.

 

[biased indian]

Yes, it says he's played that team more often.

Well spotted.

Just because he's played the WI 8 times, doesn't make Lara or Sarwan any less good batsmen though does it.

harmison is a good bowler and a great bowler in the making

but its because he has played a lot aganist WI that i made the comment earlier that he should play well aganist other teams and prove he has the making of a great bowler

 

[marc71178]

The period when he was 2-3, it was just not due to Packer years.

Same as if we took the first 3 runners out of the Olympics 100m final and the other 5 all ran the times they managed in the actual race, the bloke getting Gold wouldn't have been due to the other 3 not being there?

 

[Neil Pickup]

NZ not count?

 

[Son Of Coco]

NZ not count?

Not for getting Gold in the 100 I would imagine.

 

[Pratters]

No, actually, they rarely have 900.

Ya I realised that after Neil posted the list of the top rated bowlers..

Same as if we took the first 3 runners out of the Olympics 100m final and the other 5 all ran the times they managed in the actual race, the bloke getting Gold wouldn't have been due to the other 3 not being there?

Just see his record early in his career. Its as pretty good start.

I really cant see a reason why he cant (fitness allowing of course)...he had a generally flat couple of matches at the start of the WI series just gone..and yet still finished with 17 (?) wickets in 4 matches..with pitches not in his favour.

Its the doubters he would quite. I think most people would say he is best at the moment after his performances in the season.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Not for getting Gold in the 100 I would imagine.

Myeh...

Watch your cheek, sonny

 

[biased indian]

NZ not count?

u can go through the other post it about batsmen and not teams

 

[Langeveldt]

Of 32 16 are from one team which is 50% that tells u a lot

10 are Gayle, Sarwan and Lara....

 

[Pratters]

well the question must be asked..is it a decline in bowling standards, or an increase in batting standards

There are more attacking batsmen now thanks to the advent of one day cricket. Test cricket has become more exciting. But are batsmen really that proficient technically now?

The so called very good Indian batting line up ( I wouldnt call them great yet) crumbled in a one dayer in Perth in the VB Series. They failed to play average spin bowling in the match vs Pakistan the other day as also in the Asia cup final.

Australia has shown that they can bat well on most tracks around the world. But the pitches are becoming better each day. We no longer have the so called doctored pitches as we used to. Australia gave India good batting pitches when they last toured. Batsmen are easily shown up on pitches which deteriorate.

Where is the inning like Gavaskar played in Chennai against Pakistan?

Great batting is not scoring on batting friendly pitches but in all conditions. And that is why every one has praised the 'full of gut Steve Waugh', Lara, Tendulkar and Dravid in recent times. According to me, batting has never been easier.

Coupled with this is the injuries to the bowlers. For the Kiwis, from Allott to Bond, for India, well half the bowlers are always injured, Australia had Gillespie injured earlier and then McGrath and Warne. All teams are losing bowlers and they have also become more defensive due to one day cricket. Spinners do not flight the ball as much. Pace bowlers have lost the virtue of patience (to bowl like McGrath for example) and sway in line and length if the batsmen attack a few balls. A team starts prefering a middle order batsman (like Yuvraj Singh) to technically proficient openers. Boycott was needed earlier to open. Because the pitches are not as difficult and bowlers not as testing, a Richardson is an exception to the rule rather than the norm.

I like attacking batting like the one displayed by Azharuddin and Tendulkar in South Africa in that memorable test in 1997. But getting to score more runs due to the factors mentioned above is poor cricket.

A session where the bowling is testing is as exciting, if not more exciting, than a session where runs are scored.

Call me old school, but thats the way I feel.