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Gilchrist v Dhoni
- Thread starter Pratters
- Start date
Burgey
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See, Bevan clearly superor at strike-rotation
Bet Dhoni doesn't invite blokes to his joint for a bbq and make them bring their own food and grog though.
Top_Cat
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haha, and now we get to the meat of why Bevvo doesn't have the same plaudits directed his way as others. Like I said, knob.See, Bevan clearly superor at strike-rotation
Bet Dhoni doesn't invite blokes to his joint for a bbq and make them bring their own food and grog though.
Pratters
Cricket, Lovely Cricket
You are just too good.
Bevan rotated strike as well as Dhoni in an era where run making was less than it is today though. Same reason an average of 40 10 years ago would mean far more than an average of 40 does now.
This is why I think Bevan>Dhoni at strike rotation (from what I have seen of both of them).
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Uppercut
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Yeah, that's true.
I'm never sure what weighting to give to that in ODI cricket. ODI standards have been steadily improving- the game's only a few years old, relatively speaking, and for much of its existence wasn't taken particularly seriously. The quality of play in tests is much more cyclical.
I'm never sure what weighting to give to that in ODI cricket. ODI standards have been steadily improving- the game's only a few years old, relatively speaking, and for much of its existence wasn't taken particularly seriously. The quality of play in tests is much more cyclical.
The Sean
Cricketer Of The Year
If I've missed a very long and detailed explanation of this opinion that you've already given then I apologise, but I'd be interested to hear the thinking behind this. For Richards and Sobers as much as Gilchrist.
vic_orthdox
Global Moderator
And charge them $5 for expenses.See, Bevan clearly superor at strike-rotation
Bet Dhoni doesn't invite blokes to his joint for a bbq and make them bring their own food and grog though.
You heard that story too?
Uppercut
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It's something I'd call the theory of the aura- that Sobers, Gilchrist and Richards were so impressive in style they gave the impression of being better than they were. Flattered to deceive, you might say.
I'm not sure to what extent I buy it with those guys. Gilchrist as an ODI player certainly benefits from his test exploits in the popular mind. Sobers I'll leave alone, and Richards scored enough runs to justify his place in the popular mind even without the aura. The player I personally think it most applies to is Sachin Tendulkar.
The obvious counter-argument is that the aura impacted on the opposition too. But I'm not having that, it's all a means to an end (scoring runs and winning cricket matches) and if they benefitted from it, they'll have runs on the board to show as a result.
Burgey
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No - the same do or a different one? If it was a second one, surely no one would have turned up again.
Burgey
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I take your point, but Sobers averaged 57 ffs. Even if he didn't roll his arm over once, he'd still be an immortal with a batting record like that.
Uppercut
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Oh hell yeah. But you do feel sometimes- or rather, I feel, and thierry henry generally agrees with me- that the players who score bucketloads of runs but don't impress quite so much are getting a bit of a raw deal. Greg Chappell, perhaps?
andyc
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Seem to remember reading it here a while back
thierry henry
International Coach
Trust me, you wouldn't be interested.
The Sean
Cricketer Of The Year
Meh, wouldn't have asked if I wasn't.
Burgey
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Yes I think this does happen. GC compared with Viv is a good example. Perhaps Barrington with Sobers and Dravid with Tendulkar as well.
Whether that makes the ones who get the attention over-rated, or the ones who don't get it under-rated is the issue I guess
.
Uppercut
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Haha, well it's all relative. So bothYes I think this does happen. GC compared with Viv is a good example. Perhaps Barrington with Sobers and Dravid with Tendulkar as well.
Whether that makes the ones who get the attention over-rated, or the ones who don't get it under-rated is the issue I guess
thierry henry
International Coach
I don't have a long and detailed explanation, more a long history of getting increasingly irritate by people mythologising these three players. You could add Lillee to the list as well I guess and maybe even Warne (and at least in Warne's case I actually saw his whole career).
In a nutshell, Lille, Warne, Richards= players who probably have 20 other players you could legitimately compare them to, yet often get held above said players for reasons I find inadequate.
Sobers= probably in the top 5 all-rounders ever but, again, no matter how hard I try I can't wrap my head around the logic that he was so much better than Imran/Miller/Kallis as to not even warrant comparison. People are particularly irritating when refusing to compare him to Kallis despite the similarity in their records being unique in cricket history.
Gilchrist= imo the most diabolically unwatchable biffer in an era of "supposedly average batsmen who benefitted from flat pitches", yet bizarrely in my estimation he gets more praise than almost all of his batting contemporaries despite having nearly the worst record and looking the least like a proper batsman.
The Sean
Cricketer Of The Year
Chappell is a strange one - he was certainly thought exceptionally highly of during his career, even if he was classed a level below Richards (not necessarily fairly), but his reputation hasn't quite shone with the same post-retirement and cross-generational glow that for example Lilee's has. Perhaps it's because he never quite assumed the "man of the people" or "terrace hero" status of some of his contemporaries.Yes I think this does happen. GC compared with Viv is a good example. Perhaps Barrington with Sobers and Dravid with Tendulkar as well.
Whether that makes the ones who get the attention over-rated, or the ones who don't get it under-rated is the issue I guess
Barrington being ranked a rung below Sobers is one thing but he seems to suffer by comparison with quite a number of his contemporaries, very few of whom even hold a candle to his actual achievements - it's a paradox I've wondered about on these pages previously but have never quite hit upon a satisfactory answer to.