England thread

[Molehill]

Stokes was never going to sit at home and twiddle his thumbs while his teammates were at the WC. It just wasn't going to happen. What he's done, however, is taken the spot of someone who actually participated in the preceding ODI cycle and was led to believe he'll play at the WC. Does Stokes improve England's side? Probably, but then he should be part of the prep too. The way I see it, he's avoided playing JAMODIs and then pulled rank to be included in the final squad.

Joe Root has barely played an ODI since the 2019 World Cup Final (I'm not even sure he has), but he was always going to be part of the WC Team. Those who take part in the cycle know what it is and will have no bitterness should Stokes return.

But as others have said, not sure how it helps the balance of the team if he cannot bowl. It just means we're left with the choice of Stokes or Brook and I don't think that is straightforward.

 

[Chin Music]

Joe Root has barely played an ODI since the 2019 World Cup Final (I'm not even sure he has), but he was always going to be part of the WC Team. Those who take part in the cycle know what it is and will have no bitterness should Stokes return.

But as others have said, not sure how it helps the balance of the team if he cannot bowl. It just means we're left with the choice of Stokes or Brook and I don't think that is straightforward.

Root has played 15 games since according to cricinfo. It is obvious they are going to try and get the best set of players they can. Personally speaking, I would have preferred Stokes to rest up his knee if he is not going to bowl.

 

[Molehill]

Root has played 15 games since according to cricinfo. It is obvious they are going to try and get the best set of players they can. Personally speaking, I would have preferred Stokes to rest up his knee if he is not going to bowl.

Just goes to show how meaningless ODI series can be wiped from the brain, despite the fact I'm sure I watched virtually all of them.

I'd also prefer Stokes just to concentrate on Tests now, get himself fit for India. As a specialist bat, he doesn't make enough difference over alternatives to make it worth it (he says hoping it induces another World Cup Final winning knock).

 

[sledger]

Stokes has the "Stokes Factor" tbf.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Stokes is back. So either his knee isn't that bad and he can play or it's really bad and he is retiring soon.

 

[trundler]

Joe Root has barely played an ODI since the 2019 World Cup Final (I'm not even sure he has), but he was always going to be part of the WC Team. Those who take part in the cycle know what it is and will have no bitterness should Stokes return.

But as others have said, not sure how it helps the balance of the team if he cannot bowl. It just means we're left with the choice of Stokes or Brook and I don't think that is straightforward.

Root has been available though. It's a matter of principle for me. Work load management/injury rehab is different from making yourself unavailable and then returning near the World Cup imo.

 

[sledger]

I see Trundler's point here, but "We shouldn't pick our best players because players who are less good might feel bad" isn't a wise approach to selection imo.

 

[Molehill]

Root has been available though. It's a matter of principle for me. Work load management/injury rehab is different from making yourself unavailable and then returning near the World Cup imo.

I'm kind of with you on this. But certain players seem to earn the right to play as and when they want to. India should've dropped Dhoni long before they did, but if you win your team a World Cup Final then you make yourself hard to drop in the future.

As already said, I personally wouldn't select Stokes unless he can bowl. If he can't, get fit for the India Tests instead.

 

[trundler]

I really didn't like De Villiers's sheananigans in the lead up to the previous World Cup either. And I agreed with Boult not playing in NZ's home summer. Picking and choosing when you play rubs me the wrong way. No one should be above the process IMO. At this point in time, if Stokes is fit enough, he probably does get picked. He'd have to play in the upcoming series though, if it was up to me.

 

[Molehill]

I really didn't like De Villiers's sheananigans in the lead up to the previous World Cup either. And I agreed with Boult not playing in NZ's home summer. Picking and choosing when you play rubs me the wrong way. No one should be above the process IMO. At this point in time, if Stokes is fit enough, he probably does get picked. He'd have to play in the upcoming series though, if it was up to me.

Agreed, and that's why I suspect the discussions are happening now so that they can get a couple of games into him at the back end of that series (could be he misses NZ and then plays against Ireland).

 

[Daemon]

Stokes was never going to sit at home and twiddle his thumbs while his teammates were at the WC. It just wasn't going to happen. What he's done, however, is taken the spot of someone who actually participated in the preceding ODI cycle and was led to believe he'll play at the WC. Does Stokes improve England's side? Probably, but then he should be part of the prep too. The way I see it, he's avoided playing JAMODIs and then pulled rank to be included in the final squad.

Lol shut up nerd. Bolded is the only thing that matters tbh.

 

[Ashes81]

I've absolutely no issue with Stokes coming back.

If I was in charge of England, I wouldn't have any of the test players playing much white ball cricket except for World Cups.

The top players obviously play too much cricket, something has to give. If that means Stokes only plays tests, and white ball WC's then I've no issue with that at all.

 

[trundler]

I've absolutely no issue with Stokes coming back.

If I was in charge of England, I wouldn't have any of the test players playing much white ball cricket except for World Cups.

The top players obviously play too much cricket, something has to give. If that means Stokes only plays tests, and white ball WC's then I've no issue with that at all.

Then how is a young white ball specialist supposed to break into the squad if performances outside WCs don't matter at all?

 

[GIMH]

If you've got the option to have Stokes batting in a knockout game, and you turn it down, you deserve to lose. It'd be great if he could bowl, but it's not like he's amazing with the white ball in his hand. & if he thinks his knee is up to it then let him get on with it.

There were 'he shouldn't be in the Test side' posts halfway through the second Ashes Test, about a day before he went berzerk at Lord's. Pick him, and savour him, because when he's gone it'll be a long wait for some else so special to come along.

 

[Molehill]

Then how is a young white ball specialist supposed to break into the squad if performances outside WCs don't matter at all?

By being Harry Brook?

The unlucky man will probably be Malan. Gets called up, scores loads of runs, will probably get dropped.

 

[trundler]

By being Harry Brook?

The unlucky man will probably be Malan. Gets called up, scores loads of runs, will probably get dropped.

Brook isn't a white ball specialist TBF.

But yeah Malan being left out would be a daylight robbery. He's done everything right and Stokes being better than him isn't a guarantee either. Malan is a lot better than a Vince who's destined to be a backup player.

 

[Ashes81]

Then how is a young white ball specialist supposed to break into the squad if performances outside WCs don't matter at all?

I'm not saying that performances outside of WCs don't matter. What I'm saying is that those players who play all formats, should concentrate their efforts on test matches and WCs.

I don't want to see Stokes, Root, Wood, Woakes etc. play very many white ball games apart from WCs.

But players who only play white ball cricket for England should play in all white ball games.

 

[Nintendo]

I really didn't like De Villiers's sheananigans in the lead up to the previous World Cup either. And I agreed with Boult not playing in NZ's home summer. Picking and choosing when you play rubs me the wrong way. No one should be above the process IMO. At this point in time, if Stokes is fit enough, he probably does get picked. He'd have to play in the upcoming series though, if it was up to me.

Issue with the boult thing was picking a rapist who averaged 30+ with the ball over him, tbf.

 

[WICFan]

Stokes was never going to sit at home and twiddle his thumbs while his teammates were at the WC. It just wasn't going to happen. What he's done, however, is taken the spot of someone who actually participated in the preceding ODI cycle and was led to believe he'll play at the WC. Does Stokes improve England's side? Probably, but then he should be part of the prep too. The way I see it, he's avoided playing JAMODIs and then pulled rank to be included in the final squad.

Either, Stokes and the ECB think he can manage through the pain or he's kicking the can down the road and he'll be going to India for the test series doing the same as he done in the Ashes and then go under the knife.

He's going to be taking someone's spot but it's not like it hasn't happened before and we've seen in other sports like football were guys reverse retirement for another World Cup.

 

[Molehill]

England squad announced for NZ ODI's which should be the same as the World Cup. No Brook or Archer, Atkinson the surprise.

Bairstow, Roy, Malan, Root, Stokes, Buttler, Ali, Rashid, Woakes, Wood, Willey, Atkinson, Curran, Livingstone, Topley