England Fans - how is this series shaping up compared to 06/07 and 13/14?

[TNT]

Not necessarily

I'm all ears.

 

[S.Kennedy]

So batsmen like Cook and Root probably would not have even made the england team in the 70's and 80's.

They'd struggle to get into Illingwoth's early 70s side - especially Cook as he'd be competing with Edrich and Boycott as an opener. They'd probably get into later sides.

Are you seriously suggesting the bowling era of Steyn, Anderson/Broad, Ashwin/Jadeja etc is a better era than (leaving out England's bowlers) Holding, Marshall, Roberts, Croft, Marshall, Lillee, Thomson (albeit Boycott didn't face them two in their best series) and young Hadlee, Dev and Imran? There is no comparison!

Do not forget that Boycott's 246* against the Indian spin trio somewhere near their peak at the beginning of his career: Prasanna, Chandrasekhar and Bedi.

 

[S.Kennedy]

As fast bowling is Cook's achilles heel and he would have done well, we can only assume that Warner would have thrived.

I wouldn't say that is true. I'd say it is more a case of full pitched off-4th stump bowling that is Cook's ''Achilles heel'.

 

[TNT]

Do not forget that Boycott's 246* against the Indian spin trio somewhere near their peak at the beginning of his career: Prasanna, Chandrasekhar and Bedi.

And then for the rest of the series made 25, 6, 3, 33, 10, 6

 

[JRC67]

Lyon's already better than Swann, and yes, Warner is at least on the level of Amiss and Boycott, if not definitively better

Comparing players from different eras is all but impossible. Lyon has developed in to a very good finger spinner, particularly on Australian pitches where lateral movement is hard. He's the best spinner I've seen al exploiting over and under spin to get the bounce to vary and coupled with his accuracy it makes him very hard to get after. A couple of England batsman have used the slog sweep to spinners quite effectively and the variation in the bounce he generates pretty well negates that. He's been so effective against Ali in particular because what he does well really negates the way he plays spinners. I'd take Lyon over Swann in Australia or South African. Swann probably had a better bowling style for India. What is impressive is how far Lyon has developed his game in the last 2 years. He's probably at his peak now and playing very well on wickets he's developed his game to prosper on.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Everyone cricket fan I know has been concerned for months that we might well be on for a hammering in this series, and once Stokes was taken out of the equation it became almost inevitable

Pretty much exactly it. I'm feeling like the beaten cur who flinches when his master raises his hand and is pathetically grateful when he isn't thrashed.

The moments of hope still hurt the most though and we've had them in every test: Oz 220 odd/7 at the Gabba, Root unbeaten overnight in the Adelaide chase and Malan & Bairstow's partnership at the WACA. As Basil Fawlty had it, I can cope with the despair, but the hope will kill you

 

[Tannhauser]

Wait, did somebody say Warner is at least as good as Boycott? That's really rather funny.

 

[S.Kennedy]

And then for the rest of the series made 25, 6, 3, 33, 10, 6

Still arrived with a career average against India of 57.05 (47.12 in India) as compared with Warner's 36.03 (24.25).

 

[TNT]

Still arrived with a career average against India of 57.05 (47.12 in India) as compared with Warner's 36.03 (24.25).

Whatever floats your boat, but if as the thread is alluding to then we can only assume that players like Williamson, Root and Kholi would be a lot less successful against the bowlers of the eighties and not be anything other than average cricketers. Batsmen from the eighties like Border, S Waugh and Dean Jones if batting today would be miles ahead of Williamson, Root, De Villiers and co.

 

[S.Kennedy]

Whatever floats your boat, but if as the thread is alluding to then we can only assume that players like Williamson, Root and Kholi would be a lot less successful against the bowlers of the eighties and not be anything other than average cricketers. Batsmen from the eighties like Border, S Waugh and Dean Jones if batting today would be miles ahead of Williamson, Root, De Villiers and co.

I noticed you patriotically included three non-Australians as the ones being 'less successful' if batting in an earlier era, and all-Australians as being the three who would be more successful if batting in a later era haha.

 

[TNT]

I noticed you patriotically included three non-Australians as the ones being 'less successful' if batting in an earlier era, and all-Australians as being the three who would be more successful if batting in a later era haha.

I do that to give you an out, if you cant fault my logic you are still able to point out my patriotism and we both are right.

 

[S.Kennedy]

I do that to give you an out, if you cant fault my logic you are still able to point out my patriotism and we both are right.

You could have thrown in a Tendulkar or Crowe in the section you placed the three Australians just to emit a semblance of impartiality.

 

[TNT]

You could have thrown in a Tendulkar or Crowe in the section you placed the three Australians just to emit a semblance of impartiality.

Its cricket, they are cricketers.

 

[S.Kennedy]

Its cricket, they are cricketers.

Off-topic but do you eat pie floaters? That is haute cuisine. A pie drowning in a sea of peas. I only discovered its existence a few years ago and have been (morbidly) fascinated with this dish ever since.

 

[TNT]

Off-topic but do you eat pie floaters? That is haute cuisine. A pie drowning in a sea of peas. I only discovered its existence a few years ago and have been (morbidly) fascinated with this dish ever since.

Is that a roundabout way of asking me if I'm a croweater.

 

[S.Kennedy]

Is that a roundabout way of asking me if I'm a croweater.

I do not know what one of those is but I discovered pictures of this disgusting object a few years ago on the internet and was wondering whether you ate it considering you seem a patriotic 'Australia or nothing' sort of chap.

 

[TNT]

I do not know what one of those is but I discovered pictures of this disgusting object a few years ago on the internet and was wondering whether you ate it considering you seem a patriotic 'Australia or nothing' sort of chap.

Pie floaters are South Australian, they eat them in the winter at the football.

We call South Australians croweaters, they used to eat crows (probably still do) and their state football team are the crows even though they now have two teams, the other is Port (they drink a lot of Port).

 

[GuyFromLancs]

Cook would have struggled to open in an era where Boycott and Gooch, among others, were options. Had Cook been picked though, he would have no doubt done well.

Root would have made it.

Incidentally, Steyn is probably the closest bowler around today, style-wise, to Lillee. Lillee has a broader repotoire as he got older though.

Too young to recall Lillee, but Steyn is phenomenal.

Incidentally, my autocorrect tried to change Lillee to Killer ... which I guess fits

 

[GuyFromLancs]

Pretty much exactly it. I'm feeling like the beaten cur who flinches when his master raises his hand and is pathetically grateful when he isn't thrashed.

The moments of hope still hurt the most though and we've had them in every test: Oz 220 odd/7 at the Gabba, Root unbeaten overnight in the Adelaide chase and Malan & Bairstow's partnership at the WACA. As Basil Fawlty had it, I can cope with the despair, but the hope will kill you

This. Two blokes at work discussing how we'd probably beat Australia down under. I didn't even bother engaging. I seriously had us at evens for a 5-0 ass ****ing

 

[TheJediBrah]

I noticed you patriotically included three non-Australians as the ones being 'less successful' if batting in an earlier era, and all-Australians as being the three who would be more successful if batting in a later era haha.

Tbf you and TNT are just as bad as each other re. the one-eyed patriotism